http://www.mikensports.com/

 
SIGN IN:   Password     »Sign up

Message board   »Message Board home    »Sign-in or register to get started

Online now: 4 members: Robert Lenzmeier, Tri18, Zase, bill bertrand; 26 anonymous
Change topic:

Discussion: Talk regarding illegal bats

Posted Discussion
March 7, 2013
olie04
Men's 50
46 posts
Talk regarding illegal bats
(This post is intended towards Senior softball only)
How big of a problem are illegal bats in our game? I
read many posts on here that infer some think they are in our
game today. It has been suggested before that if a team knows
or suspects someone of using an illegal bat(shaved,juiced,tampered with)
whatever you want to speculate it being, then why would your
pitcher even pitch to the suspected offender? If the person
never got a chance to swing in a game, then I would venture to
guess voluntary compliance by the culprit would soon follow.

We should be policing ourselves and this great game. Don't leave it up to the various associations because it won't happen. If players are willing to complain
about the issue, then at least stand up for what you believe to
be true. Strength in numbers will work. If a player is reasonably
suspected, and there are articulable facts,let it be known to as many
teams as possible. If it is just sour grapes because someone can hit the ball harder
than you can and you have no speculative proof then that is another issue,one
that the accuser can only deal with. I have never seen a Cheater bat in
Senior Softball,I don't even know what one would look like or act like.
Please educate me and let me know if this is an issue or is it a
Urban Legend. Thanks for your time. #10,Ollie Oliverson Team GSC (Gods Sports Company)
March 7, 2013
crusher
Men's 70
403 posts
SSUSA Staff -- I looked at rules online and failed to see how a player could protest a possible illegal bat and what the protestor would have to put up in cash to do the protest.

Can the other team protest every bat and all bats could possibly be removed from the game? Or, does the protestor have to put up monies that will not be returned. Or, could every bat be protested with the umpire making each decision about bat being illegal.

Thank goodiness I have seen any team try to get other team's bats pulled from game.

Thanks, James
March 8, 2013
SSUSA Staff
1304 posts
An "illegal" bat is fairly easy to identify, principally by the absence of the approved BPF 1.21/1.20 certification on the bat. We also have a very short list of "illegal" bats: Original Miken Ultra (aka Miken I), the Yellow Rip-It, the older Boombah with the BPF=1.205 and a small production run of Canadian manufactured ComBats made for SPN use in addition to the above mentioned BPF non-compliant bats.

Identifying an "altered" bat is more problematical. Our Directors have been instructed to look for indicators that a bat may be altered by rolling, shaving or other alteration techniques, and those indicators are internal and proprietary. It also helps when someone like Corky Pellien or other bat-savvy vendors may be onsite to be consulted. The procedures for handling of a supected "illegal" or "altered" bat are described in the SSUSA Rulebook at 3.4 and following.

Since we do not have a protest fee structure, enforcing the rules regarding these situations is a cooperative effort by and between umpires, directors, managers and players. In most cases, a simple inspection of the bat(s) in question resolves the issue. Although, in theory, a team could object to any/all bats present in an opponent's dugout, we don't recall such an effort being attempted.

March 8, 2013
Tim Millette
499 posts
Ollie, I have heard of one senior that has said he has shaved a senior bat. The player is of no, or vey little talent and its said the bat broke in less then z25 swings.
I would think with the built in durability issues with senior bats that inferior guys that need to shave bats don't do it very long because of the HIGH price of replacement.
Now....on the other hand.....i believe rolling or breaking in a senior bat by other then regular play is happening a lot.
That's the only good thing about these senior bats.....it eliminates the cheater bat advantage.
March 8, 2013
cal50
Men's 50
286 posts
I would think that it is very rare that any seniors roll a senior bat. How other ways are there to break in a senior bat other than BP or regular play?
March 8, 2013
taits
Men's 65
4395 posts
Cal, your living in a dream world if you think that. For one, do a search for shaving on most web well known sites message boards or sellers sites and CL. Also on here.
March 8, 2013
BudLeftField
64 posts
I have always used a rubber mallet on a new bat. I roll up a towel and lay the bat head on it and hit the barrel as hard as I can while rotating the bat. I will do this hundreds of times. This is supposed to loosen the bat up. I know that they sell a tool made of a hammer handle with a softball attached to pound the bat with also. Whether this works or not I have no idea, but it makes alot of noise in the garage.
March 8, 2013
cal50
Men's 50
286 posts
taits, I play over 150 games a year and don't think I have seen an instance of a senior doctoring their bat. Maybe it is just a midwest thing, are west coast values that different to be that rampant as you say with seniors shaving or doctoring their bats?

Remember we are talking about seniors, not the youngsters, I know it is rampant there.
March 8, 2013
0
60 posts

I have seen players rapidly tapping the sweet spot of a new senior bat against a metal fence pole. Not hard to notice since the tapping sounds similar to that of a wood pecker tapping against a pole.



March 8, 2013
taits
Men's 65
4395 posts
Using mallets, hitting against trees, post and the other rolling or Dr stuff, is, for lack of correct wording not normal break in usage, therefore altering bat.
I agree that the younger gen does more of it, or is more obvious at least, but one tends to carry over habits as one ages, don't they. ant all this has been going on for about 15 years now since ASA started the banning bat and changing the ball crap.
March 8, 2013
cal50
Men's 50
286 posts
taits I have not seen what you describe and I am not living in a dream world.
March 8, 2013
taits
Men's 65
4395 posts
Ck Jefferson and Chicago with wide open 'eyes' .
Until 2008 I played more that that < it's in posts awhile back> but enjoy it still, just can't do the same now.
March 8, 2013
cal50
Men's 50
286 posts
I guess you know what you are talking about, but I sure don't.
March 8, 2013
ju25
Men's 55
149 posts
I've witnessed quite a few seniors who will tap a new bat against a fence pole or tap 2 bats together. Although according to the rules it would not be part of the normal break-in process and therefore illegal it doesn't bother me. I'm sure there are some out there who alter their bats by shaving or rolling, but I don't think it is many. If you alter a senior bat it's not going to last very long. I know a couple 65+ guys who have there senior bats rolled and one guy who uses a shaved freak98, but they don't hit the ball hard enough that it would matter. I also know some 65+ and 70+guys who crush with any bat(USSSA, ASA). They don't mess with their senior sticks. Pretty hard to detect an altered senior bat IMO, when broken-in they all make that nice crack sound, that is usually a dead giveaway for altered in the young kids game.
March 8, 2013
HJ
Men's 70
443 posts
I am an absolutist and totally agree with taits. It is illegal to break in a bat using any artificial method and shouldn't be done or tolerated. How you enforce it is a different question.
March 8, 2013
bkb555
93 posts
As an outfielder, i could tell immediately if a bat was altered/juiced/shaved etc by the sound and the way it traveled over the fence or over your head.....that was in U trip leagues though...with senior ball, it is very difficult to tell because the bats all have that "crack" sound and before you know it, the ball is 40 feet over the fence.......i bet there are probably a bunch out there who do it but as for me being able to tell right now, I wouldn't be able to call out any bats that I played against.....but the real issue is WHY???? we aren't playing for money ( I think) and it's not like in the old days when you got prize money for winning a tourney....every one likes to get a good dinger now and then but for me, knowing I used a cheater bat to do it, doesnt make me feel any better.....that is one reason why i never used a Miken(no matter what model) because I knew right from the get go, they were too good for the game....I stuck with my triConn and mutants while other guys were blasting away withy ultras and freaks.....but at least i knew it was ME who supplied the power and not the bat.....senior ball is different though...I feel like everyone is on a level playing field, so any bat is good to go...I use a Melee in senior tourneys but a Worth 454 in league Utrip/senior games......there is no doubt a senior bat gives you extra distance and to shave it or roll it is just plain egotistical and selfish
March 8, 2013
taits
Men's 65
4395 posts
Cal..
Maybe you just do not pay attention as to what is going on. around you, that's all.
March 8, 2013
Olden Slow
Men's 65
182 posts
I have played against 1 team in particular that we all know uses a few shaved bats...How do I know?? First couple of days..guys are hitting with very little pop...Come big games...Guys that don't normally hit them out are all of a sudden clearing the fences....This is in Cali and Az...I also had a guy in our league come right out and proclaim..." Just got my bat back for getting rolled "...We thought he was joking....truth is..he was not..A couple of us got together and told him...First of all it's BS that he wold do something like that and second..if we saw him using it..we would call him on it...He is probably one of the best players around this area and already crushes the ball...Makes no sense to me...As far as the team...If it's that important for them to win...I feel sorry for them...One quick note...In a game against another team..this team would use the bats and immediately take them behind the dugout..We already knew why..and one Ump took notice and went to the director..Don't know what happened after that...
March 8, 2013
cal50
Men's 50
286 posts
taits, Perhaps you are hanging around the wrong people, or you have a very vivid imagination.
March 8, 2013
Olden Slow
Men's 65
182 posts
cal...Not trying to stir the pot..But the 2 cases I mentioned were both Seniors....60's....
March 8, 2013
cal50
Men's 50
286 posts
Olden, I am saying that I do not see it here. More responding like I am to taits comment to me.
March 8, 2013
OZZIE#8
13 posts
Shaved bats are everywhere in this country in asa,utrip,nsa,etc. etc.
not as bad in seniors but they are around.
March 8, 2013
the answer
Men's 55
104 posts
why would you shave a senior bat? they are already hot...and less durable..if you shave it ,it wont last long but there is no need to
March 8, 2013
taits
Men's 65
4395 posts
No, just not naive.
March 8, 2013
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1006 posts
Tim, just because you only know one doesn't mean there aren't more.. I know of a few and it amazing how people cheat to compete... in the end they are only cheating themselves. I break two to three bats a year and that's with unshaven bats, I would go through tons of bats if I was shaving them. I can't imagine hitters that have any pop shaving bats and them lasting very long..
March 8, 2013
ffdonnie
Men's 50
95 posts
Did a BP session last year with a guy who bought two Toxics and paid an extra 100 bucks to have them shaved. He played in the 65 age group last year but doesn't play now, so I won't rat him out. They were 28 oz shaved down to 24 oz according to the stickers on them. He was hitting the ball around 300' until the thing exploded in half after 30 or so swings. We had to take a break because we were laughing at him too hard.
Dumbest thing I've seen.
Oh yeah, he wouldn't let anyone swing the other one.

To 0, tapping bats together or lightly against a pole is not an attempt to alter or break in a bat. I do all the time, by holding the knob you can tell where the sweet spot is and how wide it is. They vary by make.
March 9, 2013
skip_6
Men's 60
15 posts
I was at a tournament last season and saw someone rolling and selling bats from the trunk of his car in the parking lot. There was a line of players waiting to get their bat rolled. As we walked by he looked up at us and stated that the new mikens were hard to break in, as he was rolling a Reebok. So bat altering is happening.
March 9, 2013
ju25
Men's 55
149 posts
A shaved USSSA bat (when done right) will outhit a senior bat. I think there is more rolling going on than shaving. Like I said before if you shave a senior bat it is not going to last very long. I have heard from known bat doctor in our area(Metro Detroit) that he removed the rod from a 30oz. Launch(4 oz.) and put the weight into the end, for a senior player. Same guy who shaved the Freak 98 for a 65+ senior.
March 9, 2013
Bigon
13 posts
Does throwing a bat into a fence or beating it into the ground after having a bad day at the plate alter a bat or make it illegal.
March 9, 2013
mnmasters38
Men's 60
14 posts
I'm to the understanding that rolling, hitting bat with rubber mallet, against a post, against another bat, squeezing in a vise plus numerous other ways is considered altering a bat. Suppose to help them break in quicker. I beleive it also shortens the life of the bat, especially rolling it. I beleive in going to the batting cage or just taking BP to break in a bat is the best. Most senior bats are hot out of the wrapper or they get hot within 150 swings. 1 or 2 visits to the cage gets it done. Maybe one of the staff members can claify what SSUSA considers altering a bat. I agree with The Answer on why would anyone shave a senior bat.

March 9, 2013
SSUSA Staff
1304 posts
The SSUSA believes that the only rules-compliant method for "breaking in" a bat is by the owner/player using that bat consistent with the manufacturer's only intended purpose: striking a softball.

Activity which serves to change either the "as manufactured" technical specifications OR the performance aspects of the bat by any manner not resulting solely from the manufacturer's intended use of their product (i.e., the bat striking a softball) is considered altering a bat. Examples include, but are not limited to, bat shaving, bat rolling/compressing, striking items other than softballs, striking the bat with foreign objects and/or opening the bat and adding or removing material.

Simply stated, buy the bat, strip off the wrapper, take BP if you wish, and play ball. And as an added bonus, such an approach will more than likely provide the user with better longevity for the bat.

March 9, 2013
garyheifner
367 posts
Olie04

Will comment only on what I have seen/heard. No second hand.

In a tourney between prelim games, heard a player whisper to another if he was going to bring out the special bat. Guy said hell no, not until the championship bracket play.

Another time the opponents, championship bracket play, were hitting rockets against us. Almost the entire team used the same bat. Just kept handing it off even though they had a bat rack full of U2s. ??????????????

I am no longer a big HR threat even though I hit the ball hard. Was playing in a pick up park district game in Florida. A little guy hit the wall twice. I said you have real power. He said it is the bat-try it. 28 oz
U2. 1st swing, I hit one about 315. I walked back and said it was the hottest Miken I ever hit. He then said it was rolled. For the 1st time, I understood what rolling could do and why some might give up their integrity just to win.

I am a great listener. Have heard at least 4 maybe 5 different conversations in which the general direction of the talk was that rolling a bat was no big deal or cheating.

Don't think too many shave bats. From what I have been told is that they won't last but a few swings. You would have to be rich.

When I pitch, everytime a real bomb is hit (65 division), can't help but wonder if that guy is a great hitter or did he use an altered bat.

In terms of the rules, I don't like that a manager might get suspended if an altered bat is found. He can't control what an adult player brings to a tournament. However, I sincerely believe that if a hitter is found using an altered bat he should be suspend for "LIFE" no second chances and that his name should be given to all the other assocaiations for the same fate. In other words, tell him to buy golf clubs.

I can't wonder if a guy wins a ring using an illegal altered bat, does he feel a great deal of pride showing the ring to his grand chidren. Look kids. This is what you can get if you cheat!!

P.S. All that hitting your U2 against posts or with hammers to break it in is:

When I talked to Corky, he said stupid. Doesn't break it in, just reduces life. Simply hit it and rotate with every swing.



March 10, 2013
miken44
78 posts
guys there is cheating everywhere guys who hit for power do it also but the one who bothers me the most is the guy who has some pop but use's the whole field to hit blowing ball's past infielders and going the middle with a loaded bat at some point someone will hit and severly injure a player at that point what will happen if it is someone on my team that gets hurt by one of these idiots i know what will happen played last year in senior olympic team there had two bats with different color piece tape on handle used them when they wanted to blow one past someone or go yard little guy or big guy made no difference but stayed out of middle like i started if you feel the need to cheat then get out of the senior game better yet get out all together
March 10, 2013
HJ
Men's 70
443 posts
garyheifner has it so right. My only quibble is don't use the word suspend. That implies there is a way back in. Cheats should be banned for life.
But rules are meaningless unless enforced and I not sure those in power will enforce such a rule since it potentially is against their own financial interest.That is why garyheifner is again so right. ASA UTRIP and SSUSA must all agree that one banned by 1 association is banned by all. This will not happen because it means giving up sovereignty to the other organization to ban 1 of your guys because they banned him.
Therefore, I see no way any banning protocol if in place will ever be enforced. Staff???
March 10, 2013
cal50
Men's 50
286 posts
I still think it is rare for shaved senior bats. I bet less than 1%. Do you think it is more than that? If so what %?
March 10, 2013
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1006 posts
I destroyed a bat this moring in 8 swings, it was 50 degrees.. I just wanted a few swings with what I was going to use.. ended up swinging a Utrip bat for the first two games..Grrrrrrrrr until it warmed up.
March 11, 2013
southernson
261 posts
cal50,
It is extremely naive to think it is a rarity for bat modification to be occuring. Labels and paint mean nothing, they can be purchased as part of the process, icluding the BPF label.

Rolling is a norm and I will guarantee you a teammate(s) on your team has a name and number of someone who rolls bats. But that's mild alteration, and personally, even as a pitcher it doesn't bother me. But what does bother me is the number of shaved or pressure injected bats I see regularly at tournaments. Do we know for certain, no we don't unless we cut them in half. But what's that saying, if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, well you know the rest. You see-
1) There are more bat doctors now than ever
2) I've seen rolling machines in the parking lot
3) I know that there are some teams that have a "tournament" bat bag and the regular assortment of individual bats
4) Tight fisted pitches hit 320 feet with just a sneeze? Saw the pos in half...

There is rarely a fair softball game played in a big tournament with only stock issued equipment, and that's the truth. Not only with the young guys, but also with the seniors. Their just hasn't been a cost efficient way to stop it yet, or either the willingness to do so. We got signed statements required for the pitchers who won't wear the hockey gear as the solution for now. Really??

Quack, quack...


March 11, 2013
Brett
Men's 55
239 posts
There is only one definitive way to stop it. If an assortment of bats were furnished and made available at each game on each field, and controlled by the umpire, everyone would have to use one of them. That would obviously level the playing field for everyone. That of course is not realistically feasible and will never happen. It would be very interesting if it did.
March 11, 2013
BudLeftField
64 posts
Hi Brett-We actually have a league where bats are provided. The visitors bat and then the bats are brought over to the home teams bat rack. These are the only bats allowed for the game. I call these bats Wal-Mart bats as they are cheap aluminum bats, and they put the emphasis on defense and safety. Since the outfielders play shallow, there are alot of gappers that go for inside-the-park home runs.
March 11, 2013
cal50
Men's 50
286 posts
southernson, maybe I am naive on it, just do not see the senior bats being altered. They don't last that long anyhow, why do something to make them last even less time?
March 11, 2013
DoubleL10
Men's 65
834 posts
I, too, may be naive, but I play in 60 Major and 65 Major Plus and I just don't see much, if any, evidence of bat tampering. I do see an occasional "strange" bat being used by a guy or two, but it's extremely unusual. By strange, I mean a USSSA bat instead of a senior bat...and that could be the hitters' preference to use a more durable bat. JMO.
March 11, 2013
stick8
1318 posts
When I was umpiring there were three different occasions last year where I spotted someone wacking a bat off of a pole and then came up to the plate using the bat. Each time I told the individual they cannot use that bat. That is altering a bat.
March 11, 2013
olie04
Men's 50
46 posts
In reading all of these posts I arrive at the conclusion that no one actually knows of anyone who is using or has used a Senior bat that SSUSA would ban. I base this on the fact not even one persons name being mentioned as an offender. Maybe people don't want to falsly accuse on this message board and suffer the consequences or maybe it is truely only speculation.

Can you imagine someone being found guilty in our society without any evidence? Where is the evidence of altered bats, or more importantly, how do you find evidence of an altered bat. I for one will not point fingers and speculate someone is doing something illegal unless It can be proved. For all who claim they have seen many illegal bats being used, and even teammates claiming they are using them, why not put a name to an offender.

We don't need cheaters in our game. I have no problem approaching someone (If I know their name and who they play for), and asking them about illegal bat issues. Every post given has been very much appreciated. Ollie Oliverson #10 GSC
March 11, 2013
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1006 posts
Ollie, I know 4 people! Am I going to Rat them out? NO! Not my job! I would tell them to there face and not put them on the this site... At the end of the day, I feel sorry for them... Like I said above, they are only cheating themselves!
March 11, 2013
neck10
504 posts
stick why would you care if some idoit gave three hundred dollars for a bat then hit a poll with it .I saw a guy in our leauge do that,not very smart I would think you could do more harm than good(this guy didnt wrap the bat in a towell)he just wacked the pole with it an asa ump was standing next to me when he did this we discussed how bright we thought it was later in the winter we were discussing this with the lady that runs all the softball up here the ump denied seeing this happen I was standing next to him .I dont think theres any difference in hitting harder balls than a light pole.
March 11, 2013
olie04
Men's 50
46 posts
Swing,I can appreciate and understand your not wanting to "Rat them out" that is a personal choice. I don't look at it as "not my job" I get paid for a job. This is my hobby. I just have an issue with grown men who feel so inferior in their abilities or want to be a big fish in a little pond, that cheating to gain some advantage in a game of softball is required. Look me up at a tournament this year, then maybe you can give me some names. Thanks swing, your opinion on this board has merit to me. Ollie.
March 11, 2013
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1006 posts
Thanks Ollie, one thing I compare this to is Baseballs Drug policy, I would make SPA ASA USSSA NCSSA SSUSA and all other sanctions say if they catch anyone with a shaved bat in any division there would be lifetime ban from all sanctions... This might get through to the few that feel they have to cheat to complete!
March 11, 2013
olie04
Men's 50
46 posts
Swing,
I could not agree more. Tell Joe Rinaldi I said hello next time you see him. He has amazed me many times while taking B.P. with him. Tell him Mike Burbank is doing very well and said hello as too. Ollie.
March 11, 2013
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1006 posts
I will Ollie!
March 12, 2013
stick8
1318 posts
Neck10, personally I don't care at all. I should have specified my experience was USSSA mens ball. Altering a bat is against USSSSA rules. Spotting someone altering a bat and then said person using that same bat in a sanctioned USSSA game is against the rules. In this case they guy did it and walked right up to the plate with the same bat. If I let him slide and he drills a pitcher and thus injuring him that pitcher has a pretty good lawsuit he can impose. And myself being the one who weas the umpire could be held partially liable for knowingly permitting an altered--illegal bat to be used. It's not worth taking the risk.
How's your team shaping up this year?
March 13, 2013
HJ
Men's 70
443 posts
Some additional thoughts.
1. We all assume risks playing softball. Pitchers
and infielders are at particular risk from batted
balls. However, none have assumed the added risk of being hit by a ball from a juiced bat. I suggest a rule whereby whenever a player is injured by a batted ball the bat be immediately confiscated and examined by knowledgeable people
who will have the right to dissemble the bat if they think it altered. If altered the batter will immediately be banned for life. If not altered and the bat ruined the batter will be compensated for the current price of that model bat.
2. If an injured player can prove he was injured by a juiced bat he should consider suit.
3. A goggling of applicable terms discloses many many people selling juiced bats. Not only do they roll, and shave, but they hot roll and will customize the weight and weight distribution. I think using juiced bats is much more widespread than discussed here. Perhaps more in non-tourney play perhaps not. We so many providing the services with so many having stock altered ultras, combats, and other senior bats ready for immediate delivery that many people must be using them. I was so naive.
March 13, 2013
HJ
Men's 70
443 posts
Sorry my penultimate sentence should have read:

With so many providing these alteration services and with so many providers having large stocks of altered ultras, combats, a other senior bats ready for immediate delivery the only conclusion is that many are using juiced bats.
March 13, 2013
RIK56
Men's 50
120 posts
HJ i just dont see that many seniors swinging shaved bats,Let me ask you this do you know of any that swing a shaved bat,I know every tournament team in my area and i do not believe any of them swing a senior shaved bat.
March 13, 2013
HJ
Men's 70
443 posts
Rik, fair question. I was so naive that I never thought in my rec league guys would do that. After seeing so many guys on the internet selling
juiced bats I am reconsidering. I have no knowledge of anyone using one, but there are guys who seem to generate more distance than their size, musculature and swing mechanics should generate. But no, no direct knowledge of a cheater.
LOL story, last year in BP I was having a particularly good day (very rare) and I was using
a USSSA Combat Virus. I was accused of using a juiced bat. Thinking back on it, the fact I was accused means the accusers have knowledge of juiced bats and may have been using them. My point is I had no idea they were so readily available delivered to your home for relatively little extra.
March 13, 2013
DCPete
238 posts
Sad but true, in fact there's 1 company whose website seems to sell nothing but shaved, juiced & rolled bats - they include these "services" in their pricing.
HJ, problem is who would pay the players for their disassembled bats if they turn out to be legal???
March 14, 2013
HJ
Men's 70
443 posts
Unfortunately DC there are many more than just 1 company that provides these "services". There are
many that will sell you a hot rolled shaved senior bat direct from their stock of them. Sad, but true. If the sanctioning organizations were serious about safety and honesty they would pay. My guess is they would develop procedures so they were pretty sure before they opened it up. On second thought, if there were a clean way to pop the endcap and a look from the barrel was dispositive, then the only cost would be to reinstall the endcap which is not expensive, maybe $25. Of course the accused could just agree to be banned, take his bat and go home.
March 14, 2013
ju25
Men's 55
149 posts
If your going to shave a senior bat you better have deep pockets. 50 bucks for 50 swings(if that) is not worth it. Used to be that altered bats were only used in upper level ball, but now it has filtered down to the lower levels(D-E) and even league ball. If you need to use a shaved or altered bat in senior ball you seriously need to find another hobby. How are you gonna feel when you seriously hurt someone because you had to use a thunderstick. Doctors pop the endcap to shave them so why can't you pop them to check them.
March 14, 2013
ju25
Men's 55
149 posts
By the way Easton stamps there name on the inside of the barrel and therefore leaves no doubt to whether or not the bat has been shaved. If you send back an Easton and the stamp is not visible they will not honor the warranty. Maybe the other companies should do this. Sorry to say but cheating has been going on forever. Cork in wood, tennis balls in aluminum etc. When you call a young gun out on an altered bat there response is" If you ain't cheating, you ain't competing". Sad!!
March 14, 2013
HJ
Men's 70
443 posts
ju25, not that deep pockets. It may be that this is most prevalent with the weaker hitters who don't break them as fast as the true power hitters. More thoughts about detection. You mentioned above about a Launch which had a rod near the handle removed and 4 oz added in the barrel. This would drastically change the balance point. A sanctioning body could easily catalog the balance point when testing originally for whether to sanction a new bat. Once the balance point is known, it is simple and fast and no cost
to check the balance point of a bat in question.
If the balance point is different than it has been altered which can then be confirmed w/o question by opening it up.
Requiring a stamps on the inside of all sanctioned bats should be required by all sanctioning agencies.
One additional thought which might have a great
terrorem effect (make people scared): Require any
bat which becomes cracked during a tournament to be immediately confiscated and then opened up and
checked. The bat is already ruined so check in with no issue of compensation for destroying a
good bat. This would stop this cold in tournaments anyway. Staff????
March 14, 2013
ju25
Men's 55
149 posts
HJ,
Composite bats develop cracks and will still last for years. I had a first batch Synergy that developed vertical cracks in less than 100 swings, that lasted 6 more years until it actually broke. A crack in a composite bat is something that happens naturally after use and doesn't necessaraly mean the bat was altered. USSSA has a rule that if the Ump finds a crack in a bat it should be removed from play. Due to the high rate of bat doctoring USSSA has changed their bat standard for 2013. The new bats are supposed to be made to unravel when they exceed the 1.20 bpf.
Sign-in to reply or add to a discussion or post your own message and start a new discussion. If you don't have a message board account, please register for a free nickname. It will only take a moment.
Senior Softball-USA
Phone: (916) 326-5303
Fax: (916) 326-5304
2701 K Street, Suite 101A
Sacramento, CA 95816
Send us e-mail
Senior Softball-USA is dedicated to informing and uniting the Senior Softball Players of America and the World. Senior Softball-USA sanctions tournaments and championships, registers players, writes the rulebook, publishes Senior Softball-USA News, hosts International Softball Tours and promotes Senior Softball throughout the world. More than 1.5 million men and women over 40 play Senior Softball in the United States today. »SSUSA History  »Privacy policy

Follow us on Facebook

Partners