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Discussion: Time to eliminate senior bats

Posted Discussion
Dec. 14, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Time to eliminate senior bats
What happened to the days when you relied on two maybe three guys to hit the ball out ? Today I watched a guy 5 foot nothing hundred pounds if he's lucky, hit one 375. Awesome bat skills? I think not. It's rediculus, any 12 year old boy athelete can hit a ball out with a senior bat, I imagine a few 12 year old girls as well. It's time to change the game, eliminate totally any home run rule if you eliminate the senior bat.
It's all about the money. If our parents could see us now spending 200 dollars every couple months on a bat, would they tell us it's a quality investment ? Hell no.
I'm done breaking every bat senior softball has to offer as a durable bat. Bring the price down on those worthless investments by purchasing a quality NON-SENIOR bat.
Of course this would never win by vote when you realize 65% of any 50's team can't hit a home run unless they use a senior bat.
Go ahead, give me hell. But it's the truth

Richard Bokinsky
Dec. 14, 2013
hemi racer
Men's 65
93 posts
Not going to give you (H) about it Richard, just disagree with you a little. I am as you amazed at some of these smaller guys that have amazing pop in their bats. But that's a talent they are blessed with. As for myself I'm 6'2 and somewhere around 230 lbs. and it's all I can do to hit one 301' every now and then. BUT it give me great joy when I do as I'm sure it does everyone 65+ years old. I was thinking that you had to be 60+ to use a senior bat in tournament play anyway. So humor us old guys a little and let us feel like we're young once again.
Have no argument that $200 for a bat making any sense. Got to spend my kids inheritance on something you know.
Dec. 14, 2013
Omar Khayyam
1003 posts
Little bit passionate and exaggerated, but true at bottom. The hot senior bat has changed the game and is responsible for players who never hit a home run in their prime (like me) now putting them over the fence. I'd willingly bring back the old single wall aluminums.
Dec. 14, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Oh I totally agree with you. There's a time and place for everything. I was not looking at it from your point of view. But still 5 foot nothing hundred pound does not needs bat skills at 50 to hit one out. Like I said. I venture to say a 12 ur old athelete could to it with our bats.
Dec. 14, 2013
mad dog
Men's 65
3948 posts
BO...i totally agree with you...these senior bat are addictions to the senior who n never hit them when younger,or even now when they play mens/coed leagues/tourney's where they aren't allowed....

hemi...you really think someone 5' 100 something would hit them out with ASA/USSSA bats..prolly not,but hey let them use super bats and they will...sound more like ego boosting to me instead of real play.....


i went from a 10% for hitting hrs with regular bats to close to 50%(or the chance to) with super bats..even now at 63 going on 64 i still can hit them with senior bats ....my regular bat % has gone down,but it should with my age going up..and guess what,i'm ok with that as that is the way it should be...
Dec. 14, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Ya know mad dog I really don't see a problem with them in the 60's n up league. It's when these bats are in the hands these beast. I seen pattyMac take one off the head n thought it would have killed him. Thank God he had a enough reflex to just graze him. He still pretty though.
Dec. 14, 2013
Sparky.1
Men's 55
119 posts
mad dog.........Posting the same response for this topic as well............

I remember when the ASA allowed the Pitchers the "unlimited" arc and boy did the "bombers" complain...........I don't mind watching a "true big man" hitting the bombs but watching many, many players this past season that I managed & played against back in the ol' days that could not hit a golf ball out and now many, many years later, those same players now have "the beast" as a nickname. A true performance joke!
Dec. 14, 2013
xcoach
10 posts
I am 5'6 and I can one out with a USSSA or Senior Bat. I am 57 soon to be 58. I stay in shape and can still run down line drives in the outfield. Its called Practice. Send picture of 12 year old hitting it out. I am a scout...
Dec. 14, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Well xcoach all I can say is congrats for being 3 out of the ten people your age that can do it with an ASA bat
Dec. 14, 2013
Sparky.1
Men's 55
119 posts
and while I'm at it, let's open some discussion involving another matter from this past season and that is this state to state roster crap.

Bats are big $$$$, tournaments are big $$$$, travel is big $$$$ and I as a sponsor this past season, spent some big $$$$ SO WHY AM I AND MY CLUB RESTRICTED TO THE PLAYERS THAT I WANT TO PICK UP JUST BECAUSE THEY DON'T BORDER THE STATE MY CLUB IS REGISTERED.

As a sponsor, it's my $$$$ and the SSUSA as well as the other Senior Softball organizations should look at this what is in my mind, a totally ridiculous rule.

If I want to put up the $$$$, I should be allowed to pick up any player in the club's classification regardless of where they live.

Once again, get back to the way it was in the 'ol days. Big $$$$ sponsors put together quality clubs REGARDLESS OF WHERE THEIR PLAYERS WERE FROM.



Dec. 14, 2013
Sparky.1
Men's 55
119 posts
adding to my above statement, as this rule applies, I can SPONSOR a club in Hawaii, Florida, California, etc. but even though I am the SPONSOR, I could NOT PLAY WITH THE CLUB because I live in INDIANA. Seems a rather ridiculous rule if you ask me.
Dec. 14, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Interesting point sparky. It's your money, build your team. Too much big brother. It's like half century in fla, Polk county I live in forces me to play with west coast teams, why not east coast teams. Alow everybody to build their travel teams with anybody in the state, throw out the zoning districts, and watch how competitive half century gets.
Dec. 14, 2013
Sparky.1
Men's 55
119 posts
BObatbrkr........My point exactly...........Played for Little Caesars owned by Mike Illich (owner of the Tigers & Red Wings) and he and his manager the late Gary Vitto got who they wanted regardless of their address and if this format was used today, it would like you mention, suddenly get very competitive.

SSUSA and the other Senior organizations only care about one thing and that is $$$$$$$$. No qualifications for Worlds, just cut a check. If that is the case, then I as a Sponsor want to put together MY TEAM and not one that handcuffs my Manager and total team potential.
Dec. 14, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Well put sparky. Well put
Dec. 14, 2013
Fabe
Men's 50
225 posts
These bats will not go away! Look who have booths at the Managers meetings and all the fields during big tourneys….Money is very important to this system otherwise they would just let us play in our local leagues!! Good things is if softball goes spiraling down I can still surf!! Aurite,,,Fabe
Dec. 14, 2013
garyheifner
367 posts
I would really like to know where all these HRs are flying out of parks hit by little guys. I just played 7 or 8 games in the winter nationals in Ft. Meyers at the 70AAA level and not one single ball was hit out. We even played against a 75 M+ team and nothing even got near the wall.

I held over for 2 weeks and played in a pick up league 4 times in Naples. 9 inning games and the players were 50 and up to the 80s. Many were tournament players in the Florida half century and SSUSA. In those 4 games not one single ball was hit out.

I also played one day in a league that allowed only single wall bats, 44/375 balls and a 200' field. I believe only three were hit out. They even have a rule you can't throw a guy out at first because the outfielders are so shallow. Is that the kind of softball you want?

My team played in about 10 tournies last year at the 65AAA level and I can easily say there were less than a dozen hit against us the whole season.

My question has to be, if balls are flying out endlessly, are the hitters using legal senior bats or have they been altered by rolling or some other means?

Dec. 15, 2013
Lefty
Men's 65
502 posts
I agree with you gary. Where are they hitting these hot softballs out like golf balls. I believe if he is using a rock ball it might be close. In aaa and aa you can only hit one or three.
Dec. 15, 2013
Bubble Gum
65 posts

From reading some of these posts, like any 12 year old instantly becomes a home run hitter are highly over exaggerated.

Having played outfield for many years, I have a question for you that think home runs are only because of the bat.

My question is:
If a batter using a BPF 1.20 legal bat is hitting the balls on average 200 feet then how far will that same batter, hitting the same balls, hit the balls on average using any legal senior bat?
300 feet?
400 feet?

I can tell you that at 200 foot hitter with a 1.20 bat will only make me back up a few steps in the outfield if I know that same hitter is using senior bat.

All bats are tested and have to meet performance standards set forth by the softball organizations and the bat manufacturing industry. The difference between BPF 1.20 and BPF 1.21 is only 1/100. Which means that the senior bats are about 1% more lively than non senior bats.

It's the Magician not the Wand!
Dec. 15, 2013
Lefty
Men's 65
502 posts
Love it bubble gum. Great come back.
Dec. 15, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Ok bubble gum, I'm talking about the 50''s division. And if the wall difference of the senior bat is 1/100 difference, why is there a disclaimer on EVERY senior bat that said may cause serious harm or even death on it ? U think 1/100 means nothing , there's a reason they will not allow senior bats to be used in regular league games. I will produce a 12 yr old boy to hit one out. and as Naples is 325 fence. Move all fences to 325 and watch all the pop ups for outs
Dec. 15, 2013
boogpow44
52 posts
Great discussion gents, here in central Delaware league we use 52-300 balls and I believe there were about 10 balls hit out all season. We have some decent hitters in this league. We also have a lot of rec players, if it were not for senior bats could barely get the ball out of the infield. We play on the same field that the young guys do fences are 305. If you hit one out that is a pretty good stroke. The young guys, who are big and strong still shave the guts out of their bats unless there are checked, most of the time they are not. Us seniors need a little help now and then.
Dec. 15, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
And boog that is the exact point I'm making. Like I said earlier. A 5 foot tall 100 pound man 50 yr old can not hit a ball 375. I saw I done yesterday. When I asked for it to get checked, it went straight to the bat bag. He did not swing it again and he bitched as he popped up shallow the next three at bats. His bat was shaved no doubt. Nothing done about it. LIFETIME BAN should be penalty for altering a bat
Dec. 15, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
As for the "it's the magician not the wand" comment ? Lets not forget that Harry Potter can really fly around on a broom.
Dec. 15, 2013
bucs15
19 posts
I think the idea of going to 1.20 or lower bats only create a huge headache.How soon we forget the problems that effect the young guys and the fact that they are rolling and shaving bats.Same thing will happen in senior ball,there are just certain guys that will cheat no matter what age they are.At least with senior bats we are all playing on a even keel.Our team has played multible senior ASA tours and can't compete against the teams swinging illegal sticks yet those same teams never win anything but ASA tours.JMO.Happy Holidays.
Dec. 15, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Great point bucs. If they start thinking fence, that's all they swing for. Takes them right out of their game
Dec. 15, 2013
crusher
Men's 70
403 posts
Gary, in November played in Winter Nationals in Phoenix. I did not see one ball hit out in the 70 Major and Major +.

Playing league 50 - 80 I did see one 50 year old guy hit 2 out one night. He seemed to be in good shape.

AND, very interesting this went from ELIMINATE ALL SENIOR BATS to ,,, OH it is the cheaters with shaved bats that is the problem.

We have a great game, just need to stop so many new rules (IMO).

C
Dec. 15, 2013
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1006 posts
Buc 15 hits it out of the park...They aren't going back to Metal bats anytime soon so this whole subject is a Moot point! IMO and I think most seniors love hitting the good balls and hot bats!
Dec. 15, 2013
garyheifner
367 posts
My memory can get fuzzy but:

Of the few HRs hit against us last I want tosay the majority of those were in the two tournaments that the "ROC" ball was used. I even hit the base of the fence once which I don't usually do anymore.

Has anyone else noticed that-that ball flys more than the Trump 44/375?
Dec. 15, 2013
bkb555
94 posts
wood bats and cork balls ...lets go back to basics


NOT!!!!!...we use U-Trip bats in our senior league and guys who can hit them out do hit them out....as soon as we go to Sr. bats in the fall league, the balls start flying out of the park.....sure the bats make a huge difference but it IS fun.....we use Sr. bats in tourneys 4-6 times a year and that is fine for us
Dec. 15, 2013
Snot Nose Kid
45 posts


BObatbrkr

I get it!

That 12 year old which you claim can hit softballs easily over a 300 foot fence with a senior bat is.......
>
>
>
>

HARRY POTTER













Dec. 15, 2013
boston
306 posts
I am 5'11" 170lbs. I have hit HR's in USSSA and senior ball with USSSA bats. I hit them with my senior bats. I don't see much difference personally and i'm a little guy. I get about a year or more out of my senior bats. I had an OG Snake for 4 years before it died. I have also found some extremely hot USSSA bats such as the OG Freak and the Rawlings Rush 120 that I ahve usd in senior play. For the life of me i can't understand why guys weighing 200 plus lbs at any height need a senior bat. Then bitch about them breaking and having to buy several per year. The USSSA bats come with a year warranty except Easton now goes 6 mths. I can undersatnd guys my size drooling over the senior bats. I have seen smaller guys I know hitting bombs in seniors and playing USSSA and having WTP.
Dec. 15, 2013
Pull My Finger
71 posts

BObatbrkr


You asked Bubblegum " why is there a disclaimer on EVERY senior bat that said may cause serious harm or even death on it ?"


EXPLAIN TO ME WHY I SEE THAT SAME DISCLAIMER ON MY MIKEN FREAK 1.20 BAT?

Lots of non-senior bats have similar disclaimer stickers on them!













Dec. 15, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
That's what it comes down to for me Boston. I'll break any bat within two months. Longest bat was 4 months and it was the Ambush. Hot from day one. I'm BObatbrkr for a reason. Time for me to drop down to a durable ASA or usssa bat. Heard so many good things about the Z2000 and the psycho. Have used both, love them both. Nothing like a good bat investment.
Dec. 15, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Hey pull my finger. The disclaimer Is there for a reason. Any bat in a beasts hand is a deadly weapon. It says that cause of it compression rating. Just because it says 1.20 doesn't mean it's a bat with killer power. But there are 1.20 bats that compression standards are so high they put that disclaimer on them all. Bottom line is pitchers are forced to wear face masks. Not an option. U think its because it has anything to do with their lack of abilities ? I think not. We all hate rules, but need them in the game. Pitching nets are coming next, you watch. It's already happening in league ball most places. Just get rid of the hot bats n lets all play softball. Lifetime ban bat shavers.
Dec. 16, 2013
hemi racer
Men's 65
93 posts
Already using pitching nets in Atlanta league. I think it was the county's liability concerns more than safety issues.
Dec. 16, 2013
BruceinGa
Men's 60
2696 posts
Hemi, If you are referring to the league in Cherokee County, it wasn't a liability issue, just a safety issue.
I had my doubts when the rule was instituted. I was afraid it would change the game drastically but now I really like it. No throws from the outfield or infield have hit it.
I agree with lifetime ban for bat shavers.
Dec. 16, 2013
Fabe
Men's 50
225 posts
Many good ideas and opinions, but realistically these bats aren't going anywhere! Too much investments have been made and too much money will be made. Think about it….now safety equipment will bring companies revenue! Don't like the idea of a pitching net, unless being used for practice, just my view. Aloha, Fabe
Dec. 16, 2013
DOLFAN
39 posts
I played in a Major tourny a few months back and a team hit 21 HR's eeeeeer I mean Walks in the 7th inning...It was boring!!!!

Im tired of hearing people whining about HR's. Dudes who are whining probably didnt hit HR's back in the day with the Gray 38 ounce Easton everyone use to use. I bet over 75% of dudes hitting HR's in Senior Softball is probably for the first time and never did it at any level, including Little League.

These Bats are stupid. I say that the 40's and 50's shouldnt use senior bats at all. And one last thing, if you have to shave a senior bat, YOUR WEAK and are a CHEATER!!!
Dec. 16, 2013
mad dog
Men's 65
3948 posts
hey guys..you do know that all senior bats have to pass the bpf 1.20/1.21 test....the other assoc's are lower,except now ASA is allowing bpf 1.20 b/c they use the 52-300 ball....in fact there are ASA bats not allowed to be used in USSSA now.......

want to keep using the senior bats and keep the pitchers/inf'ers safer,we then need to use the 52-300 ball...get rid of these babe ruth ego's and play some real ball......
Dec. 16, 2013
softball4b
Men's 60
765 posts
FYI

Not to exceed 1.20 or 1.21 as indicated.

In some instances different associations do not allow other association bats because they failed to meet the internal approval process or failed to provide sufficient liability insurance or failed to pay association approval fees.

Dec. 16, 2013
mad dog
Men's 65
3948 posts
mike it is not the assoc's doing it..its the mfg'er not sending the bat to a particular assoc for testing/inspection...the miken freak is/was an example for NSA.....you could use it all over but there.....remember as soon as you start hitting with your bats they start to exceed the 1.20/1.21 bpf...most of them.....the assoc's then started with the "never can exceed"...
Dec. 16, 2013
softball4b
Men's 60
765 posts
That's what I said. (they failed to meet the internal approval process - mfg'er not sending the bat to a particular assoc for testing/inspection.) In order for a product to receive the stamp for an association, you must send bats to be tested independently of the your testing, your company must provide proof of liability insurance of X, and in some instances pay a fee to the association.

My use of the term of association, refers ASA, USSSA, SSUSA. The above does not apply specifically to anyone association. It does not matter if you did 1 and 2, if you did not pony up the fee, no acceptance.

That is why small boutique manufacturers are unlikely to receive stamps for use in the big 3 associations.
Dec. 16, 2013
L
37 posts
I remember when I first played slow pitch I had moved from Ill and had played fastpitch and we used wooden bats so when I started slow pitch all I had was a wooden bat but soon realized that metal was so much better to hit with. I have hit alot more homeruns with the dave carrol and bombats than I have with the new bats but I have not been asked to do so in several years. I still like the older bats with a 47/52 ball. We also played on 270 foot fences when we got to play at major complexes other wise it was baseball fields. I dont remember ever breaking one of these bats it just got old and lost its pop. But could still use in batting pratice and didnt have to worry about breaking the bat in. So when they talk about breaking bats 2-4 times a year would it not be wise to go backwads a little and I now what most are going to say the bat makers would never let this happen as they make to much money with all the home run hitters breaking bats. I just wanted to write because this is all that you read about. The major plus let them do what they want like we did before there was all of these rules and regulations let them get who they want if they have the money like they did in the 60s-80s. Then all players will be happy as they will not bother our game.
Dec. 16, 2013
neck10
505 posts
so if you eliminate the senior bats are you not going to let patty mac & steve imly lift, because if you let them lift & take batting practice thos fellows are going to hit it out.We play in 55 major I wont say never but most of the time both teams have home runs left at the end of the game.we are allowed seven & I know when we were younger & used the asa bats we always hit more than seven per game.We have to use asa bats in our leauge & we will still have 3 per game.Guys are going out and getting new hips knee's & other body parts so they can still play, im sure the $150.00 for a senior bat is in there budget.Besides if you want a senior bat that will last you buy a miken ultra two with the asa stamps on it (will cost a little more)will last a long time.
Dec. 16, 2013
L
37 posts
Most of the guys you are talking about do alot of lifting and hitting to make sure they stay on top of their game. So as I stated above let these gentlemen start there own league more or less like they used to have and that way they can make there own rules and not have be limited as I believe Sparky had suggested when you have the bucks and want to spend them that is up to you.
Dec. 16, 2013
StevenL.Imlay
Men's 60
75 posts
If you eliminate the senior bats you will have the same situation as the young kids with altered bats.

I'm just saying...

SLi
Dec. 16, 2013
tg69
311 posts
The young kids have homerun limits just like seniors do..A thru E, different .Most of them are DBOs or 1 up, not walks.
Dec. 16, 2013
mad dog
Men's 65
3948 posts
steve they don't have the problem as much..b/c the assoc's have now gone to the 52-275/300 ball....they have found they waste their money when getting them shaved..as most all the bats are within 15-20' of each other regardless of assoc type or altered with this ball...it is the reason this ball was brought out onto the market...the assoc's ask for a safer ball.....
Dec. 17, 2013
bucs15
19 posts
Ok make the change to ASA or USSSA bats and see the outcome after one year.Sure home runs will still be hit but you will have so much bitching about certain teams-guys swinging hot bats it will make your head spin.Using the senior bats keeps us all equal and thought it is more of a offensive game due to power and speed of ball good defenses will still prevail,Good or excellant defenses make the routine play and occasional great play were as average teams makes to many errors to be a consistant winner.Sad but there are more then you think who would shave any bat to hit a bomb.I'll never understand how someones ego can justify cheating.Remember fellow ballers at the end of the day it's a game!Oh by the way bat testing is a joke ask any upper level player.
Dec. 17, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
What a great discussion this topic has brought out. Even thought I'm against using a bat 12 yr old atheletes can hit the ball out with, I think they are great in the 60's and up division. I don't care how much u shave a senior bat, bring a softer ball into the 50's age group game and we will not even see warning track power. Nothing but outs. Not 301 foot singles. If u wanna be a beast and hit home runs, work for it, anybody can swipe a card these days and hit bombs. Horse shit

Richard Bokinsky
BObatbrkr (for a reason)
Dec. 17, 2013
boston
306 posts
If some big hitters guys feel strongly enough about the use of senior bats. May I recommend they set the example and use USSSA or ASA bats. Prove to your counterparts that you are a better man by hitting bombs with a supposedly lesser bat. I have actually done this in league. I would hit bombs with my USSSA bats and tell guys "I don't need no stinkin senior bat" lol
Dec. 17, 2013
boogpow44
52 posts
This is why we have different divisions ie aa, aaa, major. The very last thing I want to see playing ball in our recreation league is guys hitting the ball 150 feet. Most of the ball players will never see the fence. Senior bats give the average ball player a more enjoyable experience. I love when these guys I play with so it's only a game, have fun, etc, then I see them dive for balls, run like heck around the bases, swing from their shoes like the "babe" himself. It's all part of the senior softball experience.
Dec. 17, 2013
Tim Millette
499 posts
The main reason I support senior bats is that to many cheaters will be swinging shaved kids bats.
Dec. 17, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Hey Boston, your answer hits it home. B the one who shows its not in the wand, the broom nor magician, Simply good mechanics and some muscle

Richard Bokinsky
BObatbrkr
Dec. 17, 2013
taits
Men's 65
4396 posts
Tim, they do that now. Look around the web sites. All assns. suffer from it. I never saw a bat checked in Vegas but only at the 2 parks I wen to.

Have a Merry Christmas.
Dec. 17, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
senior softball organization buy a bat compression tool. Have it at every tourn. If you refuse to allow it to be checked, and get caught its a LIFETIME BAN. Weed the cheaters out.

Richard Bokinsky
BObatbrkr
Dec. 17, 2013
AcePV
Men's 60
22 posts
Interesting reading all the posts both Pro and Con for getting rid of Senior bats. The one's that get me the most are the one's saying that if Senior bats are banned we will start seeing more rolled and shaved bats like the "young guys do." We are all "senior aged players" and we all should be mature enough to play the game without cheating. Are ego's on some ADULTS that important as to risk serious injury to others just so they can try and prove something or to feel superior to someone else?
Dec. 18, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Great comment ace. Lets not forget when we talk about the "young guys" with their shaved n rolled bats, we are not talking about the 20 ur old kids in league ball. We are talking about the early 50's guys who never in their life hit a home run. Now they are a part of something that really isn't such a big deal cause we been doing it since the age of 20 swinging 34 inch 34 ounce Easton telephone poles. What makes it a big deal, cause it took 50 yrs and a senior bat to hit a home run. I am in the process of proving my point. I will find a 12 yr old boy n video him hitting a ball out with a senior bat. What will the world say then? "It's a shaved senior bat"

Richard Bokinsky
BObatbrkr
Dec. 18, 2013
mad dog
Men's 65
3948 posts
BO...corky had one with the ssusa truck he used to run....it was the ASA version...for asa a bat was no good if tested below 1500...most senior bats start near there and go lower(lower means hotter more flexing of the barrel)....actually most broken in bats tested around 1250-1300,as i watched him do many tests on bats....this was not for getting bats gone ,but more for the curiosity of the players....every now and again a bat would test in the 1100's...these were bats that were on their last legs,but hotter than crap...so the machine was there.......
Dec. 18, 2013
Adiktiv6
Men's 50
66 posts
Getting rid of Senior bats....hummmm, let's see.....

Let's say there are 2000 senior players in each state...there are 50 states Happy Kitty....just in case you didn't know that!

50 x 2000 = 100,000 Senior players

Let's say each of those players owns 2 senior bats (except Happy Kitty and Dbag, as they don't swing the bat hard enough to break any) and each bat costs, say, $150 bucks!


That would be $300 bucks spent by each Senior player (Dbag and Happy Kitty = $300 together)

So.... $300 x 100,000 Senior players = $30,000,000 ($30 MILLION a yr going to the bat companies just for Senior bats!)

I, for one, do not see Senior bats going away or any bat company "getting rid" of a money maker such as Senior bats!! JMHO

A dik
Dec. 18, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Ya that's my point. I break them all in less than a month. In florida we play year round. Now do he math. Hmmmm. Hey tanner lets start a bat business


Richard Bokinsky
BObatbrkr (for a reason)
Dec. 18, 2013
Perl
110 posts
Just wondering, how many of you guys that want to ban senior bats swing them in tournament?

All of you, just what I thought.

Why don't you guys start the movement and swing only ASA or U-trip bats. If you are going to talk the talk how about walking the walk.
Dec. 18, 2013
the answer
Men's 55
104 posts
I think they should use the net and add an 11th fielder it works well..the Hr s are no big deal as they are limited and most teams score their 5 runs an inn. with or w/o hitting Hrs
Dec. 19, 2013
Az Iz
39 posts
BObatbrkr:

So what do you want the senior bats to be replaced with?


Dec. 19, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Ok az iz, pitchers are forced to wear masks. No more options. When your team has hit your allowed number oh home runs, THE MIDDLE IS WIDE OPEN. Now I'm talkin 50's n 55's only, Make them swing 1.20 bats. If you are caught with an altered bat, then the league in which he is playing MUST put that player on a LIFETIME BAN. If you refuse to have your bat checked, LIFETIME ban. I don't know about you, it's bad enough these 1.21 bats are so hot, but in the hands of the ones who choose to shave them, has no respect for the life of a fellow competitor.
Now when you see someone 5 foot tall and one hundred pounds hit a ball 400 feet, with a 1.20 bat I just can't believe he can do it. I can understand they are able to hit home runs for the first time in there life, there's a reason for it. If u want to impress me, go back to hitting base hits instead if swinging for your solo shot.
It's obvious I'm not making friends here. But remember in the vaveman days, the big boys made the kills, the rest of the clan cleaned the meat.


Richard Bokinsky
BOmotherFInbstbrkr
Dec. 19, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Sorry let me clarify, Remember in the days of the caveman, they send the big boys out for the kills, the rest of the clan cleaned the meat. Everybody had a specific job
Dec. 19, 2013
Sparky.1
Men's 55
119 posts
BObatbrkr: IN TOTAL AGREEMENT WITH YOU PARTNER!

We have "Senior" ball to keep us feeling young and enjoy the game like we did in the 'ol days, so why not relax and play under the same type of conditions, equipment, etc. that we did back then which simply means, you didn't hit them out back in your hay day, so what makes you a Carl "Tex" Collins (Hall of Fame with the Detroit Little Caesars) now!

Dec. 19, 2013
Perl
110 posts
BObatbrkr and Sparky1

Like I asked above, do you two swing senior bats in tournaments? I bet you do, but why? Talk the talk then walk the walk.

We are still waiting on the 12 year old to hit 300 foot bombs.

Also, would love to see a 5 foot 100 pounder hit it 400 feet. I take BP with one of the best players in the game, a member of two HOFs, a guy that can bench press 300 + pounds, a guy who has been a premier HR hitter for 35 years and when he kills one it goes 375.

Dec. 19, 2013
Airbosn
Men's 65
322 posts
Perly...Me thinks the above guys donot recall that the 1.20 amd 1.21 are one and the same...Just an formula error by the engineer. I believe in unlimited homers for all levels especially 70 and above...lol. Our game is becoming more like goofy golf. The beauty of baseball/softball was that we played with no time or home run limit, and thats the way it should be...Damm the umpires union. LOL
Dec. 19, 2013
Perl
110 posts
Airbosn, cool to see a guy that plays defense, runs like the wind, basehits with anybody and doesn't live for the HR, recognize the home run is a very important part of the game.

Congtars on your award Tuesday night, was well deserved.
Dec. 19, 2013
BruceinGa
Men's 60
2696 posts
What award? Fill us in.
Dec. 19, 2013
taits
Men's 65
4396 posts
BO.....,
Try keeping up to date... Read the new rule on gear, they changed it get up to date. Red priority above.

I am glad to see what they did but feel some may not be playing with a full deck as it were and ignore the safety issue for wearing it.
Happy Holidays to all. Stay healthy and safe.
Dec. 19, 2013
Perl
110 posts
Bruce

Here in Pensacola we have two senior leagues along with Tuesday and Thursday morning games. Lenny is very active in their success. Lenny was recognized and awarded for his accomplishments this year including his team winning the season ending tournament.

I hope you are 100% after your rehab and hope to see you and Lynn soon.
Dec. 19, 2013
BruceinGa
Men's 60
2696 posts
Well, congratulations Len!
My rehab is going well. I probably won't be playing until February. See you then!
Dec. 20, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Perl, come to our next TOC and lets talk sbout who walks the walk. Tho shalt not call a man out unless u r ready to stand face to face with him and utter sincere apologies.

Richard Bokinsky
BObatbrkr
Dec. 20, 2013
Sparky.1
Men's 55
119 posts
Perl........If you took the time to look, I am only a "Sponsor" that is concerned about his team and the game he loves!

p.s. Never hit a ball out during my entire playing career but was a lifetime .600+ hitter

p.s.s. Be careful like BObatbrkr mentioned until you come face-to-face.
Dec. 20, 2013
hemi racer
Men's 65
93 posts
Boy this discussion about senior bats has really taken of. Haven't taken time to read all the post, but as I understand you guys are suggesting not allowing the 45 to 60 year old guys the use of senior bats. Not us 65 year old guys. Is that pretty much the suggestion here?
Dec. 20, 2013
Perl
110 posts
BObrkr and Sparky1

I will be in S. Florida fron March 1-3 playing in a tournament. Look me up, I'll be playing with Elite 60 from Atlanta.

Gladly ready to stand face to face and discuss or differences.

Dec. 20, 2013
Robo2
226 posts
I am not for eliminating senior bats because I have seen how people cheat with ASA bats. I am sure anyone who has played this game for any reasonable amount of time know this. Senior bats make it equal. Now if the tournaments supply the bats, then I would not care what bat is used.
Dec. 20, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Perl u called me out as someone who just runs there mouth. Look me up and We can go take a little BP together and I'll show you how a 200 lbs man can easily hit 400 ft bombs with a 1.20. hey but it only needs to be 301 right.

PS- 60s n up should use senior bats
Richard Bokinsky
BObatbrkr
Dec. 20, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Our differences is u called me out as swinging a senior bat. There is nothing to discuss except when I hit one WELL over 400 foot with a 1.20 bat u owe me am apology. Bottom line, it only has to go 301 feet. Who needs an apology, but me a beer
Dec. 20, 2013
PattyMac
96 posts
BOBatbrkr,

I would like to see the 400 ft. homeruns myself.

I play on a pretty good 50 team and hit with a monster and he hits it as far as anyone and sometimes he hits it 400 but not all the time. 400 is used a lot on this site but it is rarely done.

5 ft. 100 pounds hitting it 400 I would like to see.

Senior bats have changed the game though, when I started playing 11 years ago with the Florida Crush team, we only had 4 or 5 guys who hit homeruns. The first ultra really changed the game, our base hitters on the Crush now became hr hitters every now and then. Hurt our team.

I'm just saying.

PattyMac

ps. Perl don't get hit with a beer bottle. hah
Dec. 20, 2013
Adiktiv6
Men's 50
66 posts
Patty,

Quit talking about yourself......lol

A dik
Dec. 20, 2013
Perl
110 posts
BObatbrkr

I'd love to see you hit a few 400 foot bombs and have a cokd beer.

Looking forward to the day we can take some BP and get to know each other.
Dec. 20, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
At the end of it all. We all love each other and the game. PattyMac u know me. Bo from team 1 . Love u brother
Dec. 21, 2013
PattyMac
96 posts
Bo,

looking forward to seeing you soon. looks like our team is major plus now.

I have seen you hit some bombs I have to admit.haha

Be careful with my boy perl, he has a wicked left jab. haha

To you and your family have a very Merry Christmas.

PattyMac
Dec. 24, 2013
phantomf4j
21 posts
Well boys, there are senior players and then there are senior players. Once a player reaches 70 yoa it is rare that anyone in that age bracket will hit one out. It happens, but maybe once or twice for an entire tournament. And until one reaches that milestone and beyond, he does not realize how the skills, strength and coordination erode. I am amazed at how that erosion has impacted my own game just from age 65 to age 71. There are a few 70+ players who can still bop the ball, but they are few and far between. In all honesty, I can see how a 60+ player still has all the physical assets he needs to hit with power. That becomes less of a factor as one nears age 70. So for me, I selfishly want to see the senior bats stay around for my age group.
Dec. 24, 2013
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1006 posts
don't worry Phantom, most senior players feel this way.... senior bats keep it more honest than any other sanction in Softball... Everyone has a fair shot, except the pitcher! ;-)
Dec. 24, 2013
hemi racer
Men's 65
93 posts
Phantom I echo those thoughts. It does add enjoyment to the game to be able to hit with a little distance. I work twic or three times harder now to keep what strength I have as we did in our 30's and even 40's. Back then you just showed up and the ball flew. Don't think the folks selling these bats will ever let them be banned. I'm 66 so I'm right behind you.
Dec. 25, 2013
Turbo 34
Men's 50
10 posts
What this new rule means to me is no more SSUSA softball tournaments! I'm not going to drive four plus hours to play in tournaments where I have to worry every time I bat I might hurt someone. That may sound like I have an elevated opinion of myself but it's just not going to happen. I played with Monster last year and had a blast playing against great competition like PattyMac and D12 and many other great players but I'm not going on the field to injure anyone with a senior bat. I'm one of the lucky old dudes that still gets plenty of offers to play on really competitive young teams that play all their games within an hour or two of home. Why would I want to play by C division rules (home runs outs) in senior ball with a lightning rod in my hand? I'm extremely disappointed in the SSUSA rules committee. Players reading this may think I'm on an ego trip, but if you ever played against me you know you don't ever want to see me hitting the middle with a senior best. There will be to many times that you have to go to the plate in non home run at bats that infielders are in jeopardy. Sorry if I sound like a senior bat hero but in our local senior league we have to swing ASA bats and hit .375 balls and it's never an out and it's no problem to hit two or three a game. Been a blast but it's not worth it any more.
Dec. 25, 2013
JDub
Men's 50
150 posts
No need to Worry Turbo34, we Pitchers are Safe now. If you haven't heard the news, we are required to wear a Mask now. Feel Free to Pin the Tail on The Donkey, as the Flood Gates are now Open ! ! !


Have Fun, Be Safe,
Jeff White #7
AZ Elite 50M+
Dec. 25, 2013
boston
306 posts
Turbo 34 I don't understand your decision based on using a senior bat. You do have the option of swinging a nonsenior bat. If you are that concerned about hurting someone and can hit HR's w/o a senior bat then why use one. If it is the HR rule you are more concerned with then that is good reason. But, you do sound hypocritical blaming the HR rule and the use of a senior bat. You do have control of that aspect of the issue. JMO Merry Christmas
Dec. 25, 2013
AcePV
Men's 60
22 posts
If a homerun is an out and you're a "crusher", why go to the plate with a 1.21 bat with the hopes of not ripping the pitcher, or another infielders head-off, when you know you have to hit down on the ball? I'll bet nearly every player out there has two or more bats in their bag.
Dec. 25, 2013
Turbo 34
Men's 50
10 posts
The bat has nothing to do with me not playing SSUSA it's the fact that when teams start hitting the middle at my pitcher I will be inclined to retaliate. I realize that every softball player has a massive ego and saying I will do this or I will do that probably doesn't carry much weight on a board like this so I will just leave it like I said earlier I don't want to play with the new rules.
Dec. 25, 2013
garyheifner
367 posts
As I said on another post, if you don't like the bats and rules and start your own association and maybe a bunch of teams will join yours.
Dec. 25, 2013
DCPete
238 posts
Come on Turbo, really? "every softball player has a massive ego"?
And where is it written that you have to hit the middle when you're out of home runs?
That's the biggest cop-out on this whole issue.
Dec. 26, 2013
TAT22
15 posts
Turbo, if there are "middle wars" with the new DBO rules, I would like to think that the players of senior softball would have matured enough not to have them. Reactions are slower and you state that with the homeruns gone that guys are going to blast the middle or take an infielders head off! I say if guys start playing that way, I won't boycott, I will take care of it after the game on a personal level.
Dec. 26, 2013
hemi racer
Men's 65
93 posts
Comments on purposely hitting up the middle are depressing and alarming to me. Under no circumstances would I ever intently hit up the middle. I would hate to live with myself if I seriously hurt a fellow senior player by accident, must less on purpose. If other teams make a practice of this tactic their showing no regard for their fellow brothers and or sisters. I certainly would voice my concerns to them if a team practice this tactic. If they chose to continue that would be on their page, I have enough on my page to worry about.
Dec. 26, 2013
Az Iz
39 posts

Is hitting Home Runs or hitting up the center all you guys can do?
Dec. 26, 2013
boston
306 posts
Turbo are you kidding me you would be "inclined to retaliate". What are we 18 again. I play plenty of utrip still and when I here kids yell middles open it pisses me off. Utrip has a rule now if they hear a team say that the player is to be thrown out the game. In whatever league I play in if I hit pass the pitcher I apologize when I get to base. If I hit a pitcher I have actually not run and walked up to the pitcher to make sure they are alright. My teammates often get upset but i don't care. The health of a person is more important than my getting on base. Pitchers do need to take steps to protect themselves. There is plenty of lightweight safety equipment that can be worn.
At our age anyone that would purposely try to hurt a fellow player either by hittng up the middle or sliding at a player late or out of the base path is a punk.
I have an ego but not enough to hurt someone. I also have a young wife and trust me. My ego in the bedroom is far more important than on the field. If I needed viagra the senior bat would go first. lol
HAPPY NEW YEAR

"Stay Thirsty my Friends"
Dec. 26, 2013
Turbo 34
Men's 50
10 posts
Now that's exactly what I'm talking about, you would take care of it on a personal level in the parking lot. Two years of senior ball and have had nothing but great competition and fellowship, but now I'm telling you it will change. Have any of you ever injured another player? We'll I have and I don't ever want to be part of that again on either side. We were playing in a C tournament a couple of years ago and were out of home runs when I step in the box the other teams third basemen starts running his mouth saying, " What can you do we no home runs big man?" Because I bat left handed he never expected the ball to be hit at him. It hit him square in the forehead. He never raised his glove. He had to have 17 stitches and stay over night in the hospital with a concussion. This happened in an ASA tournament, if it had been a senior bat I really don't believe he would have lived. Until you have this happen to you and you have to live with the consequences you just don't understand.
Dec. 26, 2013
PattyMac
96 posts
Turbo,

Great hearing from you on this issue. I have played senior ball for 11 years now and have seen it all. SSUSA had the DBO rule a few years ago and also had to put in the rule if you hit the pitcher you were out.

They, SSUSA, know that this will increase the balls hit up the middle after the HR's are gone. Hence the facemask rule.

Again why change when things were going good?? It is not about what the players like or want it is about SHORTENING THE GAMES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have seen what you can do when you hit the ball down while playing first base. Did not like it then and hate to see it when you have to because of DBO.

Keep hitting it Big Man.

See you soon.

PattyMac
Dec. 28, 2013
Webbie25
Men's 60
1993 posts
I've been playing this game at the highest levels I could for 45 years. I've watched technology change the game several times. I still have a Steeles Bat, a couple Louisvilles-the brown one was 38 oz, the old Eastons, etc. There were always guys that could hit it out. I got my share. But, the biggest change that I didn't like over the years was making a home run a DBO-or even worse, an ejection. But, playing in Albuquerque, we had nothing higher than a class B team so we played 2 hr's and DBO. I knew I could still hit .700 without hr's so I gave up the home runs to the point that I only hit a few a year. Last year when I picked up with GSF I ran into a guy that played with me in Albuquerque during those years and he did not even realize I had much power. Then after playing 50AAA from 2006-2011, we played DBO, too. Now I finally got a chance to move up and swing away and now we are going to play DBO's at Major Plus too? I am very disappointed in that change. I still say that any man over 50 that has maintained himself and his game to the point that he can hit it 300 feet-with or without a senior bat, should not be penalized.
Also, for BOBatBrkr, without senior bats at the lower levels, the game would become so small there would be almost no offense in a lot of games. Defenses could squeeze it way down. I do believe SSUSA has it right keeping senior bats.
I also admit to enjoying watching guys like Steve Imlay, Fred Purvis, Mike Adair, Tom Amundsen, PattyMac, Davey and others hit. It is hard not to be impressed.
Dec. 28, 2013
boston
306 posts
Webbie: You seem to be doing well. Now that the Major plus division has DBO after you use up your HR's. You might as well join us in the 55 Major division. lol
I actually enjoy watching a guy 150 lbs to 200 lbs hitting the ball 300 plus, than guys well over 200 lbs. Guys that big should hit it a ton. They don't even have to workout as hard as us little guys. We need as much muscle and have to swing out our butts to get it out. We definitely can't rely on a few extra pounds.
Dec. 28, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
J,dub- there was a time when the pitcher was the baddest SOB on the field. They wanted you to hit at him. They needed you you hit at them. To prove their point. I'm sure no matter how lively these bats get, they still are the boss of the field and most of the guys want it hit at them. (Most)


BObatbrkr
Dec. 28, 2013
db14
91 posts
Gee Whiz Guys......DBO, alumium bats, dumbed down balls, masks, screens, open middle, 400 ft hr's (ha)...blah blah blah..........WHY DON'T WE JUST ELIMATE SENIORS.........Problem solved (sorry)!
Dec. 28, 2013
Perl
110 posts
Db 14

After 5/6 years of looking at this website you get the award for worst post ever.

Congrats


Dec. 28, 2013
Mark 44
Men's 60
56 posts
Can't we all just get along? Love it or Leave it. I love playing ball, I can't believe at 60 that I'm still playing a kids game. Every year they bring out new rules. Some work, some don't. I hate the idea of DBO outs. I'll keep playing & thank God that he still allows me to play. If you think that isn't politically correct, who cares.... Batting practice Tuesday at 11...........

Mark 44
Dec. 29, 2013
hemi racer
Men's 65
93 posts
AMEN!! Mark. I'm thankful I can still enjoy precipitating and enjoying the fellowship of my fellow players. Sometimes we take this game too seriously, especially at our age.
Dec. 29, 2013
db14
91 posts
Hey Mark.... Pretty much what i was trying to state although via tongue in cheek (humor.. to those i may offended). Still many simply cannot play with the hand (and rules) they are dealt and just be happy to be able to get our old tired bodies on and off the fields and be absolutely grateful to do it again a few weeks later.
Dec. 29, 2013
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1006 posts
I say all the senior bat haters just bring out the Aluminum bats and show us how manly they are... I look forward to them bringing a knife to a gun fight! ;-)
Dec. 29, 2013
BObatbrkr
Men's 50
30 posts
Nothing wrong with bringing a knife to a gun fight.. Just have a good sneak attack and add then to our prayer list. Hey lets get a 34 in 34 oz Easton 1980 bat n have a home run derby. Prolly wont have 5 contestants.

Richard Bokinsky
BObatbrkd
Dec. 29, 2013
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1006 posts
LOL when I started playing I was swinging the 38 oz easton... came from hardball still have to slow down after all these years... lol
Dec. 29, 2013
Mark 44
Men's 60
56 posts
In all actuality, I've been hitting a pretty HOTT single wall Demarini. It's too cold to be swinging those delicate by design, senior bats. Going back to single wall bats is fine by me. I think I'll swing the Demarini in my 50+ USSSSA league.
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