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Discussion: Observations and conversations.

Posted Discussion
Nov. 1, 2006
ms softball
5 posts
Observations and conversations.
I recently attended the Tampa Tournament with my husband who is an attorney and a player. For months now he has been telling me that it is only a matter of time before the litigation attorneys find their way into our game. Insurers are looking at dropping their liability coverages because of the greed of the bat and ball manufacturers and when the litigation starts, the manufacturers, associations, municipalities and sponsors will all be named parties. Sounds like doomsday. The greed factor in softball is at an all time high and while it is plausible to believe that sponsors who pick up the tabs are good for the game, they are in fact totally counter-productive and will be the ultimate downfall for both competitive and recreational softball. I overheard a conversation between some players and coaches in Tampa that went something like this and I paraphrase for brevity....Team Florida is quite presumptious in using the name of the state for their team. Nowhere else does any team use the state name. Well, if they're going to be called Team Florida, at least they should have the integrity and credibility not to recruit players from out of the state of Florida. Isn't Florida among the top three in senior players? Perhaps in lieu of trying to destroy parity within the state, the powers that be should try a reasonable alternative, the Cialis Challenge.

This circumstance along with many others along the same lines demonstrates the direction that the sport is headed. Somewhere down the road, a AA or AAA recreation player is going to get hit by a line drive from the Ultra II of a major+ player using a 47 core in a seed game and that will be the end of that.
Nov. 1, 2006
STONEMAN
Men's 50
535 posts
MS SOFTBALL : Who r u? What age group do u play in?
It is O.K., u do not need to answer !!

I like many SENIORS, started playing slow pitch, in 1966.
In the 70's, ILLEGAL BATS, started showing up. The top "PRO" teams & players have been using ILLEGAL BATS for about 30 yrs.

Even the PRO BASEBALL, players in the 40's, were driving nails into the end of their bats. Honus Wagner, used a 50 oz WOOD bat. One of the 1920 players, was known for driving a 60 Penny nail into the end of his bats. (( YES, a 60 P & not a 16 P nail.))

In the 80's, there were hot balls. DUDLEY, came out w/ their 54 cor HOT DOT. Several players were killed, when this ball came out. Players & Teams, would Microwave their HOT DOTS, in order to increase DISTANCE.

In the Mid 80's, for the Kansas State Tournament, a DUDLEY THUNDER ball was used. Miss hit this ball even off of the handle & that ball went 330 feet.

There are few Tournament thay go by someone does not get hurt. In Softball & Baseball, 71 % of the injuries, are caused by sliding.

For many of PLAYERS, if, we could find a sponsor, we would be able to save $600 or more per event. W/ a sponsor, a TEAM would be able to travel & play farther from home.

MS---- Question, 4 u. Why, do attorneys not use Cialis & other E.D. drugs? ...... Cialis & other drugs will only make them taller.......

HOW RUDE........... The STONEMAN
Nov. 1, 2006
ms softball
5 posts
Eh...I attended with my husband.

Eh...I overheard a converstion.

Sorry, I'm only the piano player.
Nov. 1, 2006
STONEMAN
Men's 50
535 posts
MS SOFTBALL : O.K., I'll bite. So, what was yer point?

SENIOR MEN, have big EGOS? S. MEN, have E.D.,
problems? S. MEN, have too much PRIDE?

Az Legends, Alamo City Legends, Fla. Legends, Tx Legends, Vegas Legends, Or. Legends, Dayton Legends, Tenn. Legends & many Legends.

Fla. Crush, Ga. Crush, Fla. Crush Munzo, Calif. Crush, Orange Crush, Crush Softball; etc.

S. Fla. Blitz; S. Fla. Heat; Fla. Heat, Fla. Cat, Fla. Sluggers; Florida Merchants; etc.

Tx Bullets; Tx Bulls; Tx Eagles; Tx Lobs; Tx Pirates; Tx Pride; Tx Stars; Tx Senior Club; Tx cCassics: Tx Ironman; Tx Tornados;

Ol' A's 50, Ol A's 55, Ols A's 60;

M.O.B. 50's & M.O.B. 55'S; AZ MOB; AZ 55; AZ Blues; AZ Champions(Phil's Filling Station); AZ Cougars; Az Oilmen; AZ Rattlers; Arizona Thunder etc..

MS SOFTBALL--- Keep Posting. There is no reason 4 u to be sorry.

Thanks........ The STONEMAN

Nov. 1, 2006
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
If we can't get carriers for insurance
we'll figure something else out.
No one is going to stop us from playing.
Maybe that accident she's referring to will
help bring out meaningful reforms
that will carry us well into the future.

Nov. 1, 2006
the wood
1075 posts
Ms Softball - With all due respect, a disagreement over a team name is a long way from someone getting hit by a line drive. For the record, there are several teams that include state names without much ado... Texas Pride, Cal Thunder, NY Statesmen, AZ Mob... to name a few.
But your point about the AA/AAA teams playing major + teams is something that should be discussed at the Summit Advisory Board this year. It definitely contradicts everything that the 'Impact Player List' is all about.
Bob Woodroof
Nov. 2, 2006
jah#4
Men's 55
551 posts
I too was in tampa for the SPA world and there was alot of players hurt most of them pitchers and yes most of the teams there was using the ultra II but the players being hit was playing a higher level team. Our team which is a Major was playing a AA team the score was getting one sided so both team making switches the other team put in other pitcher to try to stop a rally we had going, our leadoff hitter was up he got two strikes on him and the new pitcher throwed a flat pitchthat looked like going to hit the front of the plate he did not have time to raise his glove. The pitcher leg swelled up when the player rushed to him.
Like Bob Woodroof said in his post need to tell the Summit, It takes them a year to put it in place. The lake of teams is why the TD group all of us together than try to put us in the proper divisions . while some lower divison player are quitting 90% of the players IMO that play AA play there just to play ball and do not want to advance to the next level of play I feel the TD's need to look at the Summit rating system and try to pair team playing down only or up one divison of play.
Don Ward
kayson Grill 55's

Nov. 2, 2006
ms softball
5 posts
Typical Men. Never bother to read before they start writing.
The conversation concerning Team Florida took place between players at a table near the concessions. I was not relaying my thoughts but rather those of the men playing and Arizona Bobcats or Texas Titans does not equate to Team Florida. I think the implication was that no one else says they are Team Arizona or Team California. As far as the ED drug, that was a part of the conversation and had nothing to do with my thoughts or my husband. It is rather interesting that you can display such a blase' attitiude towards cheating, etc. It is this type of complacency that contributes to an overall problem that doesn't really exist according to you.
It is a fact that lawyers eventually get involved in everything. Ignorance of this fact is what makes it so easy. That and you admitting to illegal equipment on these posts and conversations about people learning 'to dance' if they want to pitch. The NFL and NHL are perfect examples of what happens when extreme change is instituted. This world is now all about litigation and liability in case you haven't noticed and its about to rear its ugly head in the softball community.
Where does all this come from? Thirty years of tagging along and listening.
Nov. 2, 2006
Gripit&Ripit
31 posts
I wanna party w/you "ms softball". Will you be in las vegas this month??
Nov. 2, 2006
biggeorge
Men's 60
25 posts
And you Gary should be quite thrilled to know you are part and parcel of those who wish to kill the messenger. My husband is not a litigation attorney and is quite concerned for softball. Again, I am merely repeating conversations. I guess none of you have ever heard the gossip that occurs at tournaments. A lot of the time that gossip reveals true feelings. Perhaps you just don't like hearing it from a woman. At any rate, a parrot is a parrot and the thoughts conveyed are those of the men players. Oh and by the way when one say's Arizona Bobcats, Arizona is a descriptive adjective advising of place of origin. In Team Florida, team is descriptive of what type of orginization is representing Florida, but thanks for all the meaningless fontala.
Nov. 2, 2006
Lecak
Men's 55
1005 posts
WOW bigeorge and ms softball appear to be the same person.
Nov. 2, 2006
ms softball
5 posts
I wish to thank my wife for giving us all an English lesson from my office computer. We have all heard the rumblings at the fields. For the most part the concerns expressed have merit. The problems with the super teams is they are looking for competition. Unfortunately, there is not much around especially in local tournaments. It is one thing to say there are only two major+ teams and therefore they will play a 2 out of three for the title. Why? Because its unfair to play them against lower class teams. Someone could get hurt. Well doesn't that same philosophy apply to seeding games? Years ago when the giants such as Nelco and Jerry's and Detroit Caesars became too big, they formed their own association, the NSPC. That leveled the playing field for a while. In seniors, the physical differences in the age brackets is unreal. To go even further, when seniors play ay night, their abilities are further eroded. There must be some way to achieve some type of parity although it looks like an impossible task. We must always bear in mind that there are many more recreational players out there than competitive players and they usually don't it seriously enough to be heard on a board like this.
Nov. 2, 2006
biggeorge
Men's 60
25 posts
And it all just goes to show that the message gets lost in the who's who. Very typical!
Nov. 2, 2006
Lecak
Men's 55
1005 posts
Grip and rip it are you still interested in that party?
Nov. 2, 2006
Gripit&Ripit
31 posts
Why do you ask???
Nov. 2, 2006
ms softball
5 posts
What a total waste of rhetoric.
Nov. 2, 2006
Ken
Men's 55
462 posts
Not to mention the Cialis.
Nov. 2, 2006
the wood
1075 posts
Ms Softball - 'a needless waste of rhetoric'... bit of an irony there. As far as snack bar, parking lot, bleacher or dugout dialogue goes... many of us have learned to turn a deaf ear to it for the most part. Most of it is just talk... aside from play ball, this what we do... our only actions are on the field.
The real point that you made is, of course, the AA/AAA teams playing major/major + teams. This is clearly wrong and, if it were me, I'd take it directly to the assn that put on the event.
The fact that some team decided to use the word 'Florida' in their title seems like something that would mostly interest Floridians. That is also the place where you could find a proper solution.

Big George - The NSPC was instigated in 1978 for the purpose of avoiding the ASA v. USSSA battle, for profit and to have a single national champion. Detroit Caesers was not a part of this as it played in the pro league... NSPC was an amateur game (ostensibly). It was not created to 'level the playing field' for teams that couldn't compete at the open level. There were already A,B, and C divisions within both ASA & USSSA. Nelco (presumably Nelson's Painting) was one of the NSPC founders as was Jim Snyder of (Snyder's), which was from the Detroit area.
Nov. 2, 2006
E. Ness
122 posts
The Wood covered what I was going to post in a long boring post. I would add however that using the state of Florida in a team name is not a big deal.

The husband of Ms Softball stated "It is one thing to say there are only two major+ teams and therefore they will play a 2 out of three for the title. Why?" Answer because it is a world tournament or just a tournament and they paid the money to play and they have the right to do so. You are a lawyer and you should know that. What is your solution to get rid of the division all together? Ok fine but what are you going to do with the players?

I agree AA/AAA teams should not play Major + teams but until the regional rules are relaxed at that Major + levels there will be very few teams and thus this could happen again. Remember while you may dislike the Major + division they are seniors players too and they have a right to play.

Lastly Big George since you give is such a fine english lesson I thought I might add a little history on the Bobcat.
The Bobcat has a broad range of habitats from the Canadian/USA border down through to Mexico. Bobcats are found in coniferous and mixed forest to the north, swamp areas in and around Florida, and desert and scrubland in the southwestern states of the US. They are however absent from the highly cultivated areas of the northern mid-states. Despite its smaller size, the bobcat is an aggressive animal.

Thus almost every state other than those of the northern mid-states have bobcats and so it would be only natural for a team from any of the states that are positioned in the broad range of the Bobcat habitats to use it as a nickname. Add to that while many states have Bobcats the southwestern Bobcat is somewhat different than the Midwest or Western Bobcat. It does not grow as big. So I would suggest the team is using the state to separate itself from other states that have Bobcats.
Nov. 2, 2006
Gene22
Men's 55
78 posts
biggeorge & ms softball:

Please do not take heart to the past posts. I, for one have been shot at so often on this board (lately), that at times I feel like Swiss Cheese. Is it not human (MEN) nature to make lite of or run and hide, when faced with a serious problem. Sooner or later, most likely sooner, someone or some entity will feel the bit of the snake.

Gene D. Riddlebaugh
Ohio Silverado #22
Dayton, Ohio
Nov. 2, 2006
bashbro1
Men's 60
266 posts
Good points E. Ness.
Here some more cat stuff:

The Name Game!
How about the Florida “Panthers”?
The Cougar or Mountain Lion as we refer to them here in Washington State, is a rather large and mostly solitary cat found in the “Americas”. However, they are both really a Puma. In fact in the English language the Puma has over 40 different names. Here are just a few: Panther, Catamount, Painter, American lion, Mexican lion, “Florida Panther”, Silver Lion, Red Lion, Red Panther, Red Tiger, Brown Tiger, Deer Tiger, Ghost Cat, Mountain Screamer, Indian Devil, Sneak Cat, King Cat, and Painted Cat.

So feel free to call your team the Puma’s or any one of it’s aliases.


From: The Name Game
Shirley Ellis

The name game!

Shirley!
Shirley, Shirley bo Birley Bonana fanna fo Firley
Fee fy mo Mirley, Shirley!

Lincoln!
Lincoln, Lincoln bo Bincoln Bonana fanna fo Fincoln
Fee fy mo Mincoln, Lincoln!

Come on everybody!
I say now let's play a game
I betcha I can make a rhyme out of anybody's name
The first letter of the name, I treat it like it wasn't there
But a B or an F or an M will appear
And then I say bo add a B then I say the name and Bonana fanna and a
fo
And then I say the name again with an F very plain
and a fee fy and a mo
And then I say the name again with an M this time
and there isn't any name that I can't rhyme

Arnold!
Arnold, Arnold bo Barnold Bonana fanna fo Farnold
Fee fy mo Marnold Arnold!

But if the first two letters are ever the same,
I drop them both and say the name like
Bob, Bob drop the B's Bo ob
For Fred, Fred drop the F's Fo red
For Mary, Mary drop the M's Mo ary
That's the only rule that is contrary.

bashbro1 (60's Representative for the Senior Bomb Squad 2007)
Nov. 2, 2006
Stones 1B
Men's 55
52 posts
Yo BashBro1...you got too much time on your hands Buddy.
Join a league, go to the batting cages or do something.
Not to recite the Name Game by Shirley Ellis.

Life...as in Get one. Go Yard BashBro1
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