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Discussion: LVSSA 2007

Posted Discussion
Oct. 1, 2007
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
LVSSA 2007
Wow.
I'm still hung over from all the whole event.
The heat, the exhaustion, the comraderie
the super competition and the long balls.
And I'll start out by saying congratulations to the Mavericks for playing terrific softball and winning the 50 and over major plus championship.
Congratulations Ken, Georgee, Bam, Wayne,
Mke A, Rusty, Billie and the rest.
That's the best Maverick's team I've ever played against and we'll have another go around in Phoenix.


Hollis from Florida had the best collection
of slammers I've seen in a long time
and were very tough to beat.
Al Estes played great team ball and we went 1 and 1
with them.

On to the long ball.
Mike Burbank hit a ball against Al Estes on Saturday
field 3 at Lorenzi Park that went over the retaining wall
next to the parking lot in deep left center, almost center field.
500 feet if it was an inch.
Stoneman has measured that park
many times and can testify to what I'm saying.
And it didn't have any height.
I would be surprised if it went out at a 45 degree angle.
It's the best shot, the hardest hit ball I've ever had the pleasure to witness under game conditions
and the experience, given a long ball enthusiast,
of a lifetime.
Thanks, Mikee.
What a shot!

Rick Perez hit one that went over the retaining wall as well
at the same fielddown the left field line but hit it so high it got tremendous carry from the wind that was blowing out and could have been just as far.
How blessed am I to be on the field with these
monsterr hitters and men of Senior Softball.
Thanks Rick.
Keep it up the good work.

The balls were good.
The umpiring was OK to good.
The weather was perfect.
The fields hard but in great shape.
The bracketing and organization of the tournament was horrible.
You're going to hear from a bunch of players
about the lack of meangingful organization.
My main beefs were no concession stand on Friday and early closing on Saturday.
And not knowing our schedules until the day before
and then, they were changed for some of the guys
when the got to field screwing up many plans made for wives and families.
If you're going to run a tournament,
or ASSOCIATION, even one that only exists to make some money for it's travelling team
you need to do it right to avoid the horns.

Let me end by saying this was the most competitive
senior softball event I've ever played in
since being in senior ball.
All six teams could have won the 50 major plus
and this was the best and bigget collection
of great ball players I've ever been around.
What a treat and special thanks to Mike Kelly
and Leonore, for making it all possible
for all of us on Kelly's.

Thanks Rabbit, Pete D, and Bobbie from Al Estes,
and Curtis, just to name a few
for the helping me experience
the true spirit of friendship and comraderie
that helps make these events so worthwhile.

Next week, the 55's in Vegas.
Can't wait.
Oct. 1, 2007
BruceinGa
Men's 60
2614 posts
Sounds like you had a great time. Did you say that they used 50 cor balls? JK
See you this weekend.
Oct. 2, 2007
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
Hey Bruce,
It seems like some of the comments made about the tournament from guys who experienced it
are on other threads.
Why don't players like the guys from Boaz I talked with
just use this thread to make their points.
The LVSSA guys need to hear the feedback
and hopefully it won't fall on deaf ears
for next week
or next year.
Bruce,
If Burbank hit a 50 core ball
the damn thing could have gone 600 feet!
What a shot!
Oct. 2, 2007
Cognac Lite
Men's 50
32 posts
Congratulations go out to all the participants. I send a special CONGRATULATION to the Mavs. Thanks to Rick Perez, Stoney, Einstein, Utah Mike, and the rest of you bums (LOL), you made sure that we didn't get a chance to play against the Mavs. I do congratulate the Mavs.

STONEY, my dear brother, it was great seeing you. Einstein, how did I not put two and two together. You look just like that genius, Genius. I remember you from Huth...., KS. If I recall correctly, you took a shot of the body there too. You are definitely a BALL MAGNET. Hell, I would still be whining had I taken a shot like you did off of Mark Martin's bat. I think you need to buy my get-out-of-the-way video (LOL). It was definitely a pleasure watching you play.

Rick P, I hope you reconsider the statement you made to me. You are playing so well. The GAME of softball will definitely miss you. I am so sorry that you made the plays you did against us, but as a lover of the game, they were AWESOME. No wonder you aren't in jail for stealing, you have the quickest hands I have seen in a while.

I will now apologize to the pony tail man out of California. It was a pleasure meeting you, but I don't remember your name. Please refresh my memor.

Oh yea, Mike Burbank-----If you ever throw me a quick pitch again, you better make sure that it is my last at bat. If it is not my last at bat, I will find me one of those altered bats from the West Coast and aim for that little Vee Tip hanging in front of your waist (LOL). It's always a pleasure.

As for my teammates on Hollis, things didn't turn out the way we had anticipated, but I REALLY ENJOYED IT!!!!!!! I really enjoy playing with you guys.

Can anyone tell me how to acquire a fake ID? I would love to play in the 55's. I know you guys are going to have a wonderful time.

SSIAB

Senior Softball Is A Blast!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Oct. 2, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
500 feet????????????

And people think that the Senior game uses both necessary and legal equipment? Hey, I don't know Burbank and I have heard from MANY places how good he is, but I do know 500 feet. IF he hit that far, the equipment is waaaaaaay out of hand.
Oct. 2, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
500 feet????????????

And people think that the Senior game uses both necessary and legal equipment? Hey, I don't know Burbank and I have heard from MANY places how good he is, but I do know 500 feet. IF he hit that far, the equipment is waaaaaaay out of hand.
Oct. 2, 2007
Jano23
Men's 50
95 posts
Hi Cognac Lite,
I am the CA guy you met. It was nice meeting you, too.
See you next time,
Jan (a.k.a. Jano)
Oct. 2, 2007
rabbit
Men's 65
295 posts
It was great to meet Einstein, watched him play,he can play many positions and can play them all well I may add. I also met Jano23, great guy, double DD, Old Pro, and many other nice guys who post on the this board, plus I also met the Stoneman- seems to be a nice guy, but he left me speechless,!!!.
I was able to get there on Weds afternoon to hit with mt good friend Steve Imlay and Jerry Hester of the KIds ur us team, Jerry use to play with me when we were in our 20's, he played left field and I pitched, we did not lose many games back then either. It was good to see both of them,.
There were some other guys I met , sorry I cannot remember all of your names, but it was great to meet you,

as far as the tourney , it was the worse ran tourney I had ever played in as far as the schedule and times of games, the very first game was at 8 am Friday, and the team we were playing did not know they were suppose to play ,they were told 1030?

I knew when they wanted to have the managers meeting before the tourney starts at 730 am, when it started at 8 m , it was going to be bad. and the fact he changed the schedule 3 times before FRidays games

The umpires, were fair to good, but there was a lot of bitching by some teams, on all fileds, the fact is, you should never have just one umpire for each game,I was told they were having a hard time getting umpires,they were so short the matienace supervisor called our first round game from 20 feet away from the plate, and I was told after one of our games the unpire was doing his very first game??? not sure about this, but he almost threw me out of the game and I hardly ever say anything, except when I am sure I am right? Ha


The fields were ok ,except we played 4 of our games on field one which was the diamond with the light poles in the middle of the field, and the fench was 315 ft away, Why was the 50AAA playing on the largest
field?
The Balls were great.

My main complaint was the schedule, we were on the ball field for over 8 hours Friday for 2 games, over 12 hours on Saturday for Three games, I never got a chance to do a lot in Vegas, was were out from standing around. Sunday I helped them getting the schedule righted so they could be done , people had air planes tickets for 6pm and they had the IF game schedule for that time, but I think they got it dome before that, because there was no one there going to beat the Wong's team out of California, they could have won the Major 50 easy

By the way the 50 AAA division was very good, the top 8 teams probably can play Major 50 and be competitive, I though we played well , but were beaten by the End Zone by one run and CJ & S Express by 4 runs, after winning our first two games , in pool play we were only beaten by Full Count 20-19 in 8 innings, the two teams we beat in pool play, were the two teams that beat us on sunday, so we ended up in 5thplace out of 14 teams not bad, but should have did better, I really do not think, anyone could have beaten the WONG"s unless you were on fire the whole game.

Our season is over , hope to see you all next season, God willing, we will start off in Feb at the Tourney of Champions in Lakeland,Fl

Have a good winter, Rabbit, Indiana Classics, 50 AAA
Oct. 2, 2007
Jano23
Men's 50
95 posts
Hi Rabbit,
It was great to meet you, too. Have a nice winter!
See ya,
Jan
Oct. 3, 2007
DoubleL10
Men's 65
809 posts
Great comeback by Spicer/Turn2! Once they got by us (Boaz/ASI), they got on a roll and were not to be denied. Great ballclub and even better people! Our course I'm biased having played many years with Clatta, Billy Rice and Hutch. One of the things I enjoy most in any of these tournaments is visiting with old friends and making new ones. As an aside, best wishes to my friends AC Linde and John Tercheria who are having knee and hip replacements later this year. Here's to a speedy recovery!

As another good man, Einstein, might say, I digress....

My takeaways from the tournament overall:
1. The competition was great in the 60 Major + class played at Lorenzi. It seemed like every game we played came down to which team performed best in the open inning.
2. The tournament organization and communication to the team managers/players was poor to non-existent. We showed up to take BP at 7AM for 9:15 and 10:30 games. When I saw the team on the field we were supposed to play on was not The Farm (our first opponent), I advised our manager. At that time, he went to the tournament folks and that is when we learned we did not play our first game until 1PM! Not only that, we did not get to play back-to-back as originally scheduled, we had a game break. That, together with the fact that the games were so far behind schedule, made for a very long Friday. Needless to say, that shot ALL our plans for the afternoon. To make a bad situation worse, the attitude of the Tournament Director seemed to be "if you have a complaint, get in line" which was certainly not the appropriate position. My perception was he wanted to hide and not be held accountable for the scheduling debacle - not just for the round-robin games, but the whole weekend. In addition, our second game did not start until almost dusk and by the time we batted in the first inning, the lights needed to be turned on. Not a problem - right? WRONG? The tourney folks had not planned to be playing under the lights so no one was there to turn them on! However, someone from the city did turn the lights on our field #3 but that was because it was RENTED to a local rec league team.
3. We were supposed to play the Old A's on Friday which got "lighted out" and Ruth on Saturday morning. Instead, we started the double elimination with a draw out of a hat for seeding purposes. The Kidz got the bye and did not play until Saturday evening. The other 3 teams played at 11:45 and the losers were done until Sunday! That's why Spicer had to play and win SIX games in a row on Sunday. Most well-run tourneys have three or four teams coming back on Sunday, our group had all seven teams out there Sunday morning.
4. Before our second game on Friday, I went to the concession stand for some refreshment about 4 o'clock. It was locked up tigher than a drum. Thanks to the lady who came around with snacks, water and Gatorade that afternoon. She may have kept several players from having problems AND she did not gouge on her prices!

I really enjoyed the competition, players and wives. Vegas ain't so bad either! Hopefully, the problems will be ironed out before the 55s and 65s start playing later this week. If we continue to hear more horror stories, we will have to re-think coming back.

Larry Lopez
Boaz/ASI
Oct. 3, 2007
tattooball
604 posts
Joe which parking lot? The one with the lake next to it or th long one. I can measure it by google earth.
Oct. 3, 2007
tattooball
604 posts
Joe which parking lot? The one with the lake next to it or th long one. I can measure it by google earth.
Oct. 3, 2007
turn2
484 posts
Larry,
you are correct. the competition was wonderful. each team had to fight and scrap for every win.
it was a poorly run tournament. it will be interesting to see if they have any problems this weekend in the 55's. if so, it could be a long weekend for all the teams.
good luck to all the 55 major plus teams.
later
donnie
turn two
Oct. 3, 2007
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
Hey Kevin,
Some guys from Hollis walked it off from the wall
which is 500 feet in most left center.
It went over the wall, and over the tree in the yard of whomever lives there.
They said 525 or so and I say they're right.
An unbelievable shot in game conditions
with 2 strikes and a pitch more outside
than Mike likes to swing at, normally.
What the shot didn't have was back spin
because if it did it would have gone farther.
Ask anyone who was there, Kevin
about that shot.
It was awesome.

Rabbit, Cognac and Jano
what a treat meeting you guys in person.
Cognac, you got game.
See you next week or in Phoenix.
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
Anyone still think special Senior bats are needed? If true, we are talking further than anyone has reportedly ever hit a ball in a game. Includes Meade, Elliott, Macenko, Androff, Rose, and on and on. At his age!

Yea guys, Seniors need better bats. LOL
Oct. 3, 2007
tattooball
604 posts
Joe,
I don't doubt what you say, let me know which field and I can measure it.
Oct. 3, 2007
Norq44
57 posts
Einstein, (Joe) , thanks for the Post! It really made me homesick. I'd like to know a little more about the bomb that Mike hit. Which light pole was it closest to? My son "Dan" hit with you guys one day last summer, do you remember? Well, last spring Dan hit two balls in a row between the left and left center light poles on that same field, one off the roof of the house, and the other in the top of the tree in the same yard. ( Steve Hurd and Stoney were there too). I checked the length and came up with a distance in excess of 500 feet. I saw Mike Burbank hit another ball in Palm Springs( and it was a SOCK, 40 Cor. ) in excess of 450 feet. Mike Burbank could hit with a broomstick! And no one hits the ball higher than Rick Perez. And you say he also cleared that wall. Way to go Rick!! I wish I had been able to be there to see those bombs.
Oct. 3, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
TNG:
Macenko hit one 550' in LV about 20 years ago. Burbank is a large guy, who is well built and appears to be a very good athlete on top of it. When other seniors hit one 425' it is extremely noteworthy. He is known for hitting long shots... with or w/o a Senior bat.
I don't remember anyone asking Macenko to use lesser equipment... or Wheeler, Meade, Elliott, Parnell, etc.
BW
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
wood, I also don't remember him asking for special bats that only he could use. (yea, I know his might have been altered, but in all honesty I don't know that Burbank's wasn't).
Oct. 3, 2007
4x4
Men's 65
592 posts
Kevin - I think it was field #3 at Lorenzi. The one with the houses on the right field side and the linear parking lot on the left/left center side. While I didn't get to see Mike's shot I did get to see the 2 hit by #93 on the Hollis team. The one to left center cleared the wall of the industrial complex and one of the Estes guys walked it off to 490' to the base of the wall where the ball went over as indicated by the guys patrolling the parking lot shagging the HR balls.
With those two teams hitting it was an awesome display of power.
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
Yes sir, let's keep pushing for special Senior bats. LOL

Just curious, were those guys hitting the ball THAT far when they were 30?
Oct. 3, 2007
Lecak
Men's 55
1005 posts
Trumpball I was siitting and watching and saw the HR. I don't know the field number but it was the field by the basketball courts it would be opposite the lake. If you have a map facing east you would be heading towards Rancho Ave. An aside from the vantage I had it was rising as it cleared the light standard in LC. It was the Southeastern most field. Before the game he was talking to a friend and it happens to be a mutual friend although I do not know Mike Burbank personally, I thought I heard I think I can hit one over the cinder block wall.
Oct. 3, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
TNG:
I wasn't in LV either time but friends of mine were. I take it that you also weren't there either time. Do you believe that Burbank used a bat that others couldn't use? Did someone point this out to you or is this just your hunch (from 2.000 miles east)?
Ron Parnell was also there this past weekend and he hit some balls a long way as well. Yes, he hit them a long way at age 30... and 40... and now at age 50.
This is typical of you in that you discount events that you didn't even attend. You need a new gig... this one is old and tired.
By the way, an altered bat is by definition 'a special bat that only he could use'... (YOUR statement about Macenko's bat). I don't know if he (MM) used an altered bat or not. Why don't you ask him since you seem to be the best of friends?
BW
BW
Oct. 3, 2007
tattooball
604 posts
OK the wall between the 2 basketball courts 498.13 ft.
So if it cleared the wall it is well over 500 ft.
To the wall at the basketball court closest to left is 467.15 ft. To the wall on the farthest court farthest corner is 518.76 ft.
All of them are bombs no matter what part of the wall they cleared.
Oct. 3, 2007
Lecak
Men's 55
1005 posts
Norq44 I have hit with your son Dan. Just a few months ago on the field with the light poles Lorenzi he hit one damn near to the picnic area. I was shagging some of the HR's and parked myself under a tree about 500 ft from home plate because it was hot and I was getting tired of ruuning back and forth. He hit one of the branches on the tree I was standing under. We still talk about that one.
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
wood, I am willing to bet he used a bat that no one under 50 is allowed to use in a sanctioned game.

Discount? Hardly. But if these guys are doing things now that they couldn't in their 20s and 30s, and it is a pretty basic physiological fact that guys do not physically improve through their 50s in anything, what do you attribute it to?

Let's have a Senior dunking contest! I will bring the trampoline.
Oct. 3, 2007
tattooball
604 posts
Are you talking about the field with the gazabo in center?
Oct. 3, 2007
Lecak
Men's 55
1005 posts
Trumpball yes, we walked it off at about 485'. I would say Gazebo was probably about 30 to 50 feet behind me. I'll look this weekend to clarify.
Oct. 3, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
TNG:
I called my friend that played on the Shubins team that was pummeled by Steele's in LV. It was the spring of '86 and they lost to Steele's because Steele's hit 68 HRs and scored over 100 runs. The score sheet of that game ended up in Sports Illustrated. The 10th hitter of Steele's went 10 for 10 with 10 HRs. Relevance? I'm not sure there is any but I thought this may interest you.

You have repeatedly made your feelings known about the bats that we use in SS. Others have offered their feelings, some of which coincided with you and most didn't. You may not like it but, from all I hear, they are here to stay.

I would suggest that you trek on down to your local senior center and heat the men up down there for using Viagra. I will bet that many are doing things in their 'golden years' that they couldn't do in their 30s. I'm certain that some will tell you that they go 'Au Naturale' and others might say that they only use it because they competition does. You may find one guy that really stands out (so to speak) that is rumored to have spiked his pills, making them special indeed.

You might also check to see which has the greatest market share, senior bats or erection stimulants. My gut feeling is that the latter will be hard to beat. They may also have a website that allows for customer interaction. Your code name will be a huge hit there.

einstein:
Pardon the interuption! :-)
BW
Oct. 3, 2007
playnball
7 posts
In answer to Burbank's HR, I know for a fact he did not use a alter bat. He had just broken two 27oz. bats, one of which was mine. He then borrowed my only remaining 28 oz bat which has only ever been used in my girls tournament. He hit that home run with my bat, which he returned to me and is now back in my possession. So see.....He even did it with a girls bat!
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
wood, some interesting comments. I do remember that game, and the information that was in SI about it.

I don't doubt there is more Viagra sold, but at least around here I have not heard of anyone who is using it running around talking about their "accomplishments" as if they are John Holmes or Ron Jeremy.

Hey, as long as the 19 is interpreted as nches and not milimeters I will be happy. :)
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
playnball, a fast pitch bat????
Oct. 3, 2007
playnball
7 posts
Next,
NO!!! I play in the Master's Division in Senior Softball it was my Ulta 2. (which most people were swinging all weekend)
Oct. 3, 2007
Lecak
Men's 55
1005 posts
playnball is that you Angie? If so it was nice seeing you. If not I apologize.
Oct. 3, 2007
playnball
7 posts
Joe, No.. It not Angie. But good friend to Angie.
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
Thanks, you threw me when you called it a girls' bat.
Oct. 3, 2007
playnball
7 posts
As long as I'm here, I might as well jump in up to my waist. In regards to older players being able to do at a older age what they could do at a younger age, I'm going to use Mike Burbank for a example, since he seems to be the topic of conversation today. I have know him and his family for years. When Mike Burbank was 38 years old, he got a divorce and because didn't drink, smoke or party. He went to the gym 6 days a week and lost him self in softball. At that time he weight 195 lbs and gain 10lbs every year since then. until he reach 265lbs were he is close to today.
So obviously, there are circumstances were a older player can not only do as well as when they were younger but even better
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
Then perhaps in his case, but he would certainly be an anamoly. And perhaps this could be in part because the act of hitting slow-pitch is not very difficult compared to many/all other sports.
Oct. 3, 2007
tattooball
604 posts
Home plate to the front of the gazabo is 474
Oct. 3, 2007
playnball
7 posts
TNG,

If thats the case, then how come every senior softball player is not playing Major Plus, hitting 500ft HR and batting 1000 (including you and me) :)
Oct. 3, 2007
playnball
7 posts
TNG,

If thats the case, then how come every senior softball player is not playing Major Plus, hitting 500ft HR and batting 1000 (including you and me) :)
Oct. 3, 2007
Lecak
Men's 55
1005 posts
Trumpball I think there is also another picnic area to the right of the gazebo if your facing home plate now that I remember because there was a structure directly behind me in Left center. I recall being either directly equal or a little behind the gazebo in center directly to my left. I'm going off memory there is also a bathroom or a solid structure behind the gazebo. Don't mean to meander. No need to google it sounds like my number of 485 for Norq44's son's shot was pretty accurate.
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
Of course some do it better than others, but do you really believe that the act of hitting a rather large ball moving pretty slowly is difficult?

Name another sport/game, or any aspect of such, that is easier. You guys are telling me that Burbank and other Seniors can basically hit with the top-level kids. Name a 50+ guy who can golf with Tiger, get a sack past Walter Jones, get Ichiro out, or guard Kobe.
Oct. 3, 2007
Lecak
Men's 55
1005 posts
playnball Angie was the mutual friend I spoke of in my previous post, the interesting thing I thought is that calling a shot like that means you have done it previously, no way you can think of something you've never done before. If you play with Angie good luck next week I understand her team is playing next week. She was telling me about some of the hitters on her team. I'm going to make a point to come by and watch.
Oct. 3, 2007
tattooball
604 posts
The bathroom is 664 ft.
Oct. 3, 2007
playnball
7 posts
Lecak, I knew you where the mutual friend. Angie told me what he said he was going to do for her. Burbank has hit some bombs before and I have witness a lot of them but I think that was longest I ever seen. Thanks for this weekend..
Oct. 3, 2007
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
Hey Kevin,
The ball went over in almost center field
as far as the wall extended maybe 10 feet from the end.
It then carried the tree on the other side of the wall.
I thought it was going to hit the tree but it went clean over it
So, that 525-530, the Hollis guys walked off
sounds pretty accurate.
I was at PacBell Park last year
when Jeff Hall, with special equipment and .47 core
525 balls hit bombs one of which was estimated about
510.
This one by Burbank, was a gem
and puts him forever with the longest, best softball hitters
of all time.
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
That one ball puts him with Galloway using wood or Arndt using 38 oz. metal bats? Wow, such hyperbole.

I am sure the guys is very good, but why the need to drool?
Oct. 3, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
I have seen Mike Burbank and I have seen Don Arndt, God rest his soul. Don was an amazing HR hitter 30 years ago but I never saw him hit one beyond 330'. I didn't follow him around but I did play against him many times from 1978-1980.
Mike, on the other hand, is the all-around athlete that Don wasn't. He is bigger, stronger, more athletic, etc. than Don was. This really isn't a very good comparison.
There are guys playing today that have played with both. One of them is Don Clatterbough. I can tell you that he his the ball harder and farther today than he did 30 years ago... w/o a senior bat (he uses a Worth PST- ASA version).
Had you said Craig Elliot, Brian Greer, Dennis Myers or Rick Wheeler, I would understand the comparison better.
I never saw Jim Galloway play but had heard many things about him.
You don't need to drool over Mike's HR. You really don't need to do anything when it comes right down to it. You don't even have to believe it.
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
I didn't follow him either, but my point was you also did not see him swing the kinds of bats that Seniors use today. I am sure Burbank is very good, but in the history of softball Arndt is an all-time great and Burbank probably isn't. And one ball sure won't put him there as your buddy is trying to say.

I saw Galloway hit a storage shed in Parma in probably '66 or '67 that was measured at 375' by park workers that my brother knew. With wood. And a cork-centered ball.

By the way, whatever bat Clattebough is using today I am sure it is a MUCH better bat then he was using 30 years ago. MUCH better balls too.
Oct. 3, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
Nice try on the 'better ball' comment. We had much better softballs back then.
Mike B is a man among boys in some ways. Every senior guy that uses an Ultra 2 is free to hit it 500'... only Mike has done it. Doesn't this mean something?
Yeah, Arndt was well known for his accomplishments years ago and he set some fairly high records along the way. Ron Parnell then came in (mid 80s forward) and broke all of them. He played in LV last weekend but didn't hit any balls 500'... he did hit some a long way though.
Don't be ashamed to give this guy his due. No one else is doing what he did.
BW
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
THIRTY years ago???? What were you using? Cork-centered Harwoods around here.

If you guys who were there say so, I cannot dispute it. I was not there, and I don't know him, but I do know 500' and it just seems a bit much to me with stock equipment. But again, I wasn't there. I just hope this doesn't turn into a fish tale over time that winds up having it at 650' uphill into a gale force wind.

High school kids now run much faster than Jesse Owens did, do we now wipe him out of all the books and put these kids in instead? All we can ever do is measure someone against the times in which they lived and in this case played. I have seen many guys since him hit balls further than Galloway did, but NONE were better.
Oct. 3, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
Worth 'Killer balls', for one. 50 COR red dots, too. Worth was a huge part of the ball R & D.
Mike doesn't replace Don Arndt any more than Ron Parnell did. Ron 'merely' broke his world series records in ASA and USSSA.
Don was a true pioneer in the space of adult slow pitch and, for those of us that played with/against him, he will never be forgotten.
But not everyone knows who Jesse Owens was anymore. The same is true of Mickey Mantle and Red Grange... how many kids today know who 'Zeke from Cabin Creek' was/is?
Conversely, I have no idea of who the great young sluggers are today in slow pitch... and I don't care. But I will hold on to Arndt's memory as best I can. Stan Harvey's, too... and 100 other guys from my early days.
Oct. 3, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
I was just starting out then, and wish we had had the balls like you must have.

I agree 100% with your post.
Oct. 3, 2007
audieh
Men's 60
241 posts
There were some amazing shots in Vegas this weekend but there were some natural conditions that allowed this. One of my buddies, Jimmy Decker, hit 2 home runs and hasn't done that in 25 years. Another fellow we played against in the 50 major plus division hit 3 home runs and according to his coach had not ever hit any in a tournament. One of our players, Mark Martin, hit one that went at least 500 feet. So what gives with all of these Titanic shots, many of which I witnessed?

Well, the wind was blowing a minimum of 35 MPH with bigger gusts, the elevation of Las Vegas is 2028 feet above sea level, the air is very dry, the balls were excellent, the bats were good, and all of the players were outstanding. You put that together and you have a "perfect storm" for softball hitting distance.

This tournament had by far the best talent I have seen in the 50 major plus and 60 major plus divisions. Congratulations to all of the participants.
Oct. 3, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
Wow! Two different guys hit the ball 500'. I stand corrected when I insinuated that only Mike did this... this amazes me even more.
I personally witnessed Dennis Myers hitting two balls (in the same game) over the left field light tower on field # 3 (Apr, 1979 v. Campbell's Carpets). He, of course, said that he 'didn't get all' of either of them. :-) knowing Dennis, he may not have.
Audie, I look forward to meeting you this weekend. Hopefully, the wind will die down some.
BW
Oct. 3, 2007
MK39
Men's 50
333 posts
Audieh:
I would first like to say what a pleasure it was to meet you and to compete against your team of most excellent ballplayers. Not 1 bad word or 1 bad attitude in any of the games we played each other over the weekend. Nothing but respect was shown both ways just like it should be. Looking forward to another go round with you this weekend in the 55's.
You have described the field conditions, bat and balls conditions perfectly. It was a true hitters field and the big boys showed up with the big shots.
Wood, this is for you. There were 3 balls hit in the 500ft range in this game. Burbanks was no doubt the longest and Mark Martin was next over the wall to slightly left center field and Rick Perez hit the 3rd one over the wall to dead left field. Both sides knew it and we all enjoyed it a ton.
I will see both of you gentlemen on firday.
Mike Kelly Kelly's Sports 55 Major plus
Oct. 3, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
you guys have to stop this... I cannot keep correcting myself... it's almost like the old adage, 'the first liar doesn't have a chance'. :-)
but, if it's 3 of them, all the better.
I guess that answers the proverbial question... will the ball carry this weekend or not?
I'm surprised that the scores weren't astronomical.
Mike, I may see you at the mgrs meeting.
:-)
BW
Oct. 3, 2007
STONEMAN
Men's 50
535 posts
NORQ 44: The S E or field # 3. Mike's, ball hit the small tree just past the wall. The tree was just left of that fence that keeps the cars out of the Basketball Court.

Great Swing....... The STONEMAN...
hOW IS UR Knee??????
Oct. 3, 2007
Jano23
Men's 50
95 posts
Einstein,
I was very happy to meet you, too.
See you next time!
Jano
Oct. 4, 2007
Norq44
57 posts
Stoney,
I was confused about Mike's shot because somewhere I read that it landed in someon'e backyard. Knowing the Mike hits right handed I naturally assumed that it was on the same field that Danny hit those two bombs with my 585.
My knee is not getting any better. I have been told that I am bone on bone, that I am a prime candidate for knee replacement surgery. I have arguably the best orthopedic surgeon in Northeast Florida. He told me that he would not want me playing any more softball if he replaces my knee. He suggests a knee brace until I am ready to quit for good. I guess I will try the brace. I have been hitting on a limited basis with the Hollis brothers ( great guys by the way) , but until I get the brace, I am unable to really swing the way I can. Call me one of these days.
Don
Oct. 4, 2007
hitt2
354 posts
TNG/ G19 "Your being a Jerk again"
Oct. 4, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
I think I have a stalker. Well, counting "einstein" I might have two.
Oct. 4, 2007
hitt2
354 posts
Stalker? I think not that implies I want to get to know you better in some form or another . Understand this I don't but I am having fun messing with you like you do others. Ride the tide.
By the way using a term like Stalker, "Your being a jerk, again".
Oct. 4, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
Now I am going to have to go into counseling.

Gee, maybe I will see you-know-who there. :)
Oct. 4, 2007
hitt2
354 posts
I think counseling is a positive choice you've made for yourself. I don't know who you'd expect to see when you get there, good choice.
Be very careful you don't know me or anything about me so don't imply things that are false.
I'm having a little fun at your expense for a change of pace it must be getting to you as I'm not part of the as you put it Establishment. I'm just another ball player.
Oct. 4, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
Getting to me? LOL

You are right, I don't know you, but you appear to be someone who gives yourself waaaaaaay too much credit.
Oct. 4, 2007
barko34
19 posts
I was kind of lurking in this thread, minding my own business when a name popped up in the discussion of long homeruns....Jim Galloway. Replying to the Wood, anything you heard about him is true. Don't believe me, but if you see Sportsplex this week in Vegas, ask Gary Richter or John Davide. They played with him and saw it first hand. Remember this, however, and I saw it at least a dozen times. Playing third base, backhanding a ball over the bag and whipping it backhanded to Joe Petriello or Charlie Forte to start a 5-4-3 double play. With 60' bases. Davide and I talk all the time about what Jimmy would do with today's equiptment, if he was still playing. I think it's safe to say that on several occasions, you would have trouble seeing where the ball landed. There are people in Vegas who played with him and against him. Ask them. Also, with all the talk about the 500 foot homers, last week, what about Davide and Clatterbough each hitting .944 (34-36) for Turn Two?
Oct. 4, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
Galloway was simply the best ever. Could make any play at 2B, 3B, and even pitched at the highest level.

And his hitting, nothing more needs to be said. There was Babe Ruth. There was Jim Galloway.
Oct. 6, 2007
Jawood
Men's 50
788 posts
Thanks, Wood for your list of great players from the past. I remember them all. Do any of these guys play anymore in the Seniors?
Oct. 6, 2007
Cognac Lite
Men's 50
32 posts
Well well well,

It's me again. I am sitting here watching college football, and obviously, I am on OUR site. I have read about Arndt, Clatter, Galloway, Burbank, Martin, and the others. I have been fortunate enough to play with or against all of those guys. Yes, I did play against Howard when I was 19 years old. I was definitely impressed with the guys of the early years. I am also impressed with the guys of today. When I say that, I am talking about the young guys of now and the MATURE guys who are still playing.

I have read a lot of the messages here on this site, and most of the guys mentioned are from the East or the West. I have a question. What about the guys from the Midwest? Even though I started playing this game at an early age, probably the two guys who helped me the most were from the Midwest. They have never ever been mentioned. Einstein, in one of his messages to the board, stated that I had game. Again, thank you for that compliment. I must attribute that to Herman (Captain Crunch) Rathman of Leavenworth, Kansas, and Matthew (Chic) Downing of Atchison, Kansas. Do any of you guys remember Flightline of Arkansas and Nelson Painting of Oklahoma?

I have seen quite a few players in my life. But, the Captain may have been the best clutch hitter I have ever seen or played with. Even with bad carriers (knees), he was awesome. He has told me stories about all of the guys mentioned. How can anyone not mention Herman Rathman?

And then there's Chic--Chic was a 6'8" lefty who could dink a ball to the left side and beat it out. At any given time, he could drop a BOMB. I am sure some of you vets know who they are.

Even though I am in the East, I had to give props to the guys in the Midwest.

Any reponses?
Oct. 6, 2007
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
Hey Terry,
There's a larger issue at stake here
vis a vis the "who's banned and who's not",
situation and that is the credibility
and ongoing development of associations like
SSUSA.
Remember most importantly
the senior softball community is ours,
belongs to us, all of us and not you, Terry.
And I remember a number of conversations regarding some of your rulings and choices in the past
that were thought of as provincial in nature.
self serving, that is.
That you tend to listen to only a few executives
and executive friends when making important decisions.
Decisions like who's suspended and who's interest was furtherred most by them.
Decisions like who's ellligible to play and who's interests are perceived to be being served in result.

I'm not trying to bring up old arguments to begin again
but rather to state that you have the opportunity
to do as you seem to have been trying to do,
especially through the excellence of admistrators
like Dave and Fran Dowell, to continue to recognize
and effect changes that have to do with all of us
and what is best for senior softball itself.

You have the opportunity to help members enjoy and feel secure posting on your site ideas and things that are positive and postively enacted
that will only help all concerned/involved with the site, i.e
advertizers, members, players and friends.

You have banned a member for being contradictory to the best interests of us and the site and you were right
and what has changed?
He's back with a different name but is the same guy
and you can justify doing nothing and you think
that is representing the most, best of us
and what is in our best interest going forward?

As you continue to do nothing
you show your lack of involvement in the kind of organization and accountable with both need
and deserve in the Senior Softball community.

Perhaps you take us, and our true concerns and well being too lightly.

Actions speak louder than words, Terry
and your clock is running.
You are being judged as a "stand up guy
in stand up organization or
as something less.
We need you to stand up.
It's really up to and about you, now.
Not me, not Gary or Pete or Dave
or anyone but you and the SSUSA.

What's it going to be?
Show up or not.
It's up to you.
Oct. 6, 2007
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
Hey Horace,
I thoroughly enjoy interacting with you
whether it's on the field watching you throw and hit
with the best of them
or reading and listening to your comfortable
yet thoughtful oft interesting and enlightening,
positive input, insights and conversations.
You make softball richer and more meaningful
for all of us.
My attachmenty to the past is through Denny Jones
one time thought to be the best hitter in the nation
and currently a member of USSSA Hall of Fame.
I love hearing stories about him and his exploits
on and around the softball diamond both from him,
players who both knew him and played with or against him
and fans around the country who were usually amazed
at the prowess of the guy with the ponytail.
Oct. 6, 2007
TheNextGeneration
Men's 50
307 posts
"gump", you might think senior softball belongs to you, but clearly this site doesn't. Get help, codger, get help!
Oct. 6, 2007
Cognac Lite
Men's 50
32 posts
Einstein,

Denny Jones is another one of those players that I have played with. Yes, the pony tail man (no offense Jano) is one of those VETS I have had the previledge of playing with. I owe that all to Mike Burbank. Interesting enough, we played together in the Black World. Yes, I was recruited by a White Man to play in the Black World--Go figure. I wish that I could have ssen DJ last weekend. If you see him, tell him that I said hello.

Damn! I wish that I was there watching you guys this weekend. I told Audie Hollis this morning how I wish that I could be there tol see ALL of you guys. Tell the Stoneman, the other half of the Booze Brothers, that I send my greetings.

I am pulling for you, Einstein, except when you are playing Hollis.
Oct. 7, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
Cognac;
I remember both Fliteline and Nelson's. Chick downing played for Fliteline in '78 and then Nelson's in '79, Softball City in '80. I saw him hit a ball out of the Kinston, NC, minor league field in RC (about 365') in '79 with a Bombat.
I defintely remember big Herman Rathman. He hit an HR off me so high and far in the NSPC (Fenton, Mo, 1978) that before he finished his trot the infield was damn near flooded. They called the game right then and we started it all over the next morning. It wasn't even raining before he batted. This is a true story. I really liked him and liked playing aginst him.
Denny Jones was a great player, too... he still is.

Jawood:
Dennis Myers did play about 5 years ago even after a knee replacement. Rick Wheeler played up until 1999 in 40+. Ron Parnell plays for the Seacrest Mavericks. Clatterbough plays for _______________ (fill in the blank)... he's very active in 50,55 and 60. DJ last played for Kelly's last year. I have no idea of what Craig Elliott is doing... only played against him, never knew him. Charles Wright played for Kelly's last year, too. Bruce Meade played 55s last year for the current Hollis Appraisal team. Elby Bushong is involved with a AZ 55 team but doesn't play (neck surgery, knee surgs, etc.)... still loves the game. Donny Furnald was playing 60s until he had a fatal H,A, 2 1/2 years ago. I've probably missed some guys.
BW
Oct. 7, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
Re: Decreasing number of teams issue
Oct. 7, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
Re: Decreasing number of teams issue
Oct. 7, 2007
the wood
1075 posts
Sorry for going "Mel Tillis' on you... what i meant to say was that we had 8 major + teams in the LVSSA 55s. This isn't a reduction at all, quite the opposite. We have, in this division, felt that a 6 team field was the optimum for the past 3-4 years. That is what we had in KC this year and Plano for the past 3 years (only 5 in '05).
They had 7 teams in the 60 major + as well. From my perspective, things are looking up.
If you find that there are less teams where you are playing, you might consider going to the ones that have better participation.
I had the opportunity to meet Taits and AudieH... see Stoneman, Einstein, Bruce from GA... I'd already met them. Taits just came by on his way to the Huntsman Games but I was able to see the other guys play... and speak with them a bit. They can all mash. This is one of the reasons that I keep doing it... the camaraderie. These are all good guys as are most of the other 100 or so guys that were there in our division. A lot of mutual respect.
Other than bringing all 8 teams back on Sunday, I felt that it was a well run event. We didn't have any of the 'field delay issues' that they had the previous weekend. Most of the games came down to the last inning.
BW
Oct. 8, 2007
tcadmw1
Men's 55
62 posts
I had the opportunity to play both weekends and it was very clear that the first weekend was a complete mess as far as organization and communications were concerned. Some rumors blamed the lack of organization on turnover in the leadership in LVSSA. What ever the reason it was the most unorganized LVSSA event I have ever attended. Second weekend was better because there weren't as many teams needing to be accommodated.

Teams in the Major+ divisions were the strongest I can remember ever seeing. Great teams, players and even better people. Senior softball is the best to play because the players, coaches and organizers care about the program and each other.

This tournament demonstrates what I believe is an answer to the problems of so few teams in the Major+ division: 1) To many Senior Softball tournaments. 2) High cost of travel and destinations selected for these events. 3) Winning at any cost means everyone thinks they should be playing in a lower division.

In spite of the problems thanks LVSSA for hosting this tournament where the best of the best can get together every year. Special thanks to all the teams who showed up and played their hearts out!!!!!

Mike Walker
July 19, 2013
kndkcook
3 posts
To: The Wood

Who was your friend that played on Shubins in 86? My father, Kent Cook played on Shubins in 1983 84 87 and 1988. He might have played on that team in 1986 too -

He also played on The Merchants, Reb's Boy's, The Rodeo Room, Screw Magazine and a few others.

I am looking for video & pictures of the games and/or teams he played on. If anyone has any info on where to locate it on the net it would be greatly appreciated.
July 19, 2013
curveball
Men's 65
400 posts
kndkcook, don't have any of the things you are looking for, but must have played against your dad in the mid 80's. We traveled from Portland OR and played them in a big tourney in Modesto CA. Don't remember the guys, but very hard to forget team name, "Screw Magazine".
Good luck in your search for his memorabilia.
July 19, 2013
the wood
1075 posts
KNDKCOOK:
I knew your father... played with him here and there. If I recall correctly, he was a catcher in the Pirate organization. We called him 'Opie Taylor' because of his hair cut. Since I'm from Orange County, I mostly played against Kent when he was on the Anaheim Merchants and Rodeo Room. One of his Rodeo Room teammates took up with my ex-wife and I was never able to properly thank him. :-)
I had several friends that played for Shubin's. Rick Wheeler and Ron Galvan come to mind as likely guys to have been on the '86 team.
I lost touch with Kent so I have no idea if he's still living or not. I knew that he had a bad back.
Bob Woodroof (Blinky's, Association, Capitol Insulation, Bemco)
July 19, 2013
Mango
Men's 50
86 posts
KNDKCOOK
In the 1980ís I played with your father on the Shubinís team you mentioned as well as Rebs and the The Breakers. I have a picture of one of our Shubinís Teams on the wall in my game room that has your father in it. If you would like I can scan it and send you a copy of it if you give me your email.

I played with and against him starting in the late 70ís through the late 80Ēs. Your father was an excellent pitcher and fierce competitor. He was a bit of a character as well.
Mango
July 19, 2013
the wood
1075 posts
Swing:
We played in Cal Cup, too, and it was a little cooler than when you played. Still, there were zero HRs in 3 days... not in our games, not in any games that I witnessed. So the Trump Stote ball is no box of chocolates.
The make up of the 52/300 ball is such that it doesn't lose its compression as 44/375 balls do.
I don't work with Kevin nor do I have any interest in sales of softballs of any type. But I do trust him.
I also know Mad Dog to be a straight shooter.
The things that are proponents of the 52/300 ball are...
injuries are less severe...
doesn't lose its compression in higher temps (when compared to 44/375)...
it seems to respond to almost all bats in the same way (cheater bats seem to have no advantage)...

Obviously, it has its downside, which you and several others have pointed out.
Bear in mind that I'm speaking generically, not about a particular brand.
How do I feel?
I would be OK if we went back to 47/525 and aluminum alloys. I'm ok staying with what we have. I don't really care. But traveling 500 miles to play in 95+ temps, with the Stote balls and having one other team to play won't work.
BW
July 19, 2013
kndkcook
3 posts
Mango - Would LOVE to have it! Kndkcook at aol dot com. My name is Kandi. Whats your name so I can tell my Dad who you are? My Dad is still in touch with Dan Everts. We miss Wayne Shrimplin & Billy Coats. Am trying to locate Terry Murmur, Rick Pally, Bull, Rich Tachine, Skip, Weiterman and Reb Sawitz.

The Wood - Kent says wasn't it Schaffer from Capital Insulation??

I have a few videos of various games from the 70's and 80's with Capital Insulation, Steele's, Charlie Tuna ect. Am going to put a collection together on DVD. Want a copy? Would be happy to share.
July 19, 2013
kndkcook
3 posts
OOOPS!!!! Typo. Billy Kope - not Coats
July 20, 2013
the wood
1075 posts
No, it wasn't Mark Schaeffer. He never played for Shubin's... just Capitol & Bemco.
Skip Young? He hasn't played in 25 years that I know about. The last I heard is that we was working for Ganahl Lumber in Anaheim.
Bull plays for the Nighthawks, still in great condition, still a force.
I do not know the whereabouts of any of the other guys.
Yes, I'd love to have one of the DVDs. My email address is awtgroupsc@aol.com
Tell your dad that I said 'hello'.
BW
July 20, 2013
Mango
Men's 50
86 posts
Hi Kandi,
I just sent you a team picture of Shubins from the California ďAĒ state championships as well as a couple of action shots from a 4th of July tournament in Albuquerque. If you donít get the email let me know and I will try again.
Mango
July 25, 2013
the wood
1075 posts
Kandi,
I tried to reach you but your 'voicemail box was full'. If you wish to speak with me call me on my cell phone, 714 325-1017.
Bob Woodroof
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