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Discussion: New ASA bat standard

Posted Discussion
Feb. 17, 2008
diehard
Men's 55
245 posts
New ASA bat standard
My team plays in some ASA tournaments throughout the year. Since the Freak is no longer legal in ASA play, I need a new bat. But, I heard that ASA is lowering their bat standard once again to 94mph. This is supposed to take place sometime this summer. Has anyone heard of this new ASA bat standard? Is this rumor true? I sure would like to know something before I spend the money on a bat that is going to be illegal!
Feb. 18, 2008
BruceinGa
Men's 60
2646 posts
What I heard a couple of months ago was that ASA had a new standard that at best the bats must be below the 98mph standard. This means that they must start around the 94 mph you stated. I also heard that the current bats would be grandfathered for 2 or 3 years. Maybe some could confirm this.
Feb. 18, 2008
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
It is my understanding that all bats APPROVED after, I think June 1st have to be approved with the new standard.

The only change being made I beleive is that they are testing the bats broken in. In some manner (like rolling them??) they are breaking in the bat before they test it and and that point it can't exceed 98MPH.

I can't find the article that explains this so I am going somewhat by memory.
Feb. 18, 2008
diehard
Men's 55
245 posts
The question that comes to my mind is why? Why not keep it the way it is. If I got a bat now and it isn't going to be one that is grandfatherd in, then I will be stuck with a bat that I couldn't use in ASA and wouldn't use elsewhere.
Feb. 18, 2008
angus73
Men's 50
97 posts
I'm sure that issue is going to be explained as Safety first, and while I agree stances for player's safety are important. I can't help thinking there is collusion between the ASA and the bat manufacurers.
Feb. 18, 2008
taits
Men's 65
4357 posts
Didn't you misspell a word here, I think it's spelled "corruption". imo
Feb. 18, 2008
SCRAPPY6
55 posts
ASA BAT STANDARDS FOR COMPOSITE BATS- CORRECT THE BAT MUST MEET THEIR 98MPH AFTER IT IS COMPLETELY BROKEN IN. WHAT THIS MEANS IS THAT THE BAT WILL HAVE TO COME FROM THE FACTORY AT ABOUT 91-92 MPH SPEC. (BY THE WAY A WOOD BAT IS ABOUT 92 MPH SPEC).
YOU WILL BE USING A BAT TO START OUT WITH THAT HAS LESS POP THAN A WOOD BAT. IT WILL IMPROVE TO THE 98MPH SPEC AFTER USING IT LONG ENOUGH.

BATS PURCHASED BEFORE JUNE WILL BE GRANDFATHERED IN UNTIL 2010 FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND. IF YOU HAVE TO PLAY ASA I WOULD RECOMMEND GETTING ONE BEFORE THEN. THE COMBAT ANTI-VIRUS IS A GOOD ONE.

IT APPEARS THAT ASA IS GOING OFF THE DEEP END AS FAR AS SAFETY IS CONCERNED AND TAKING THE FUN OUT OF SOFTBALL. IT'S LIKE ANYTHING ELSE IF YOU WANT CHANGE WRITE LETTERS AND PROTEST.
LAST OPTION---DON'T PLAY ASA AND GET YOUR REC DEPARTMENTS ETC TO GO WITH USSSA, NSA, OR WHATEVER.
SCRAPPY6
Feb. 18, 2008
diehard
Men's 55
245 posts
Well I sure will do my part to discourage my team from playing in any ASA tournaments. Our league is USSSA, and to play in around 3 tournaments, at an average entry fee around $ 400.-$ 500., plus hotels, food etc.just dosn't seem worth it if I have to compete with less than adequate equipment. Thanks for all of the help and good luck to all in the coming year.
Feb. 18, 2008
MaverickAH
59 posts
1. The ASA is not going to a 'new' standard. It's the same 98MPH standard that's been in place since 2004. All they've done is added an additional test to ensure that bats perform within this limit thoughout their lifetime.

2. As far as bats being grandfathered...... I don't know. I do know that contractually, they're under no obligation to grandfather anything since they haven't changed their bat standards. Still, maybe they will do it to ease some of the pain if the bat mfgs. get caught not contractually adhering to the 98MPH standard.

As far as anything else goes.........

It's competition that makes softball fun! If you're only interested in the game because of how hot a bat you can use, you're playing for the wrong reasons. Maybe you should just stop playing altogether.

"Less than adequate equipment"??? How much help do you need? You make it sound like only your team will be playing with whatever bats come out of this whole thing intact. Everybody will be using the same bats so ultimately a game will still come down to who plays & executes the best.
Feb. 18, 2008
pete88
Men's 50
46 posts
I give up. What the heck does "Grandfathered in" mean? Could someone take the time and explain this to a curious simpleton?
Feb. 18, 2008
WOW
197 posts
We played in Palm Springs last weekend. Vicki runs her tourn. by ASA standards. I was able to use my Freak because my bat is a model MSF not just MF [as the ASA Non-approved bat list says]. I think they were wrong BUT my whole team used it..........

We are also not going to play any more ASA tourn.

"less than adequate equipment" most likely was an overstatement. I would agree with him that if one has a choice to play where new technology equipment is allowed, go for it !!!!!!!!!!.

Ask any golfer about using the old clubs vs new ones.
Last but not least. don't let anyone tell you your playing "for the wrong reason" just because you want to augment your play with the best bat. Do you think Tiger would be happy using an old wooden driver..........
Feb. 18, 2008
diehard
Men's 55
245 posts
Maverick
It was stated by Scrappy6 that the new bat standard will be the same as a wooden bat, so all that I meant was that to me, that would not be a piece of equipment that I would want to use. If wooden bats would be fine with you, then by all means go play in a wooden bat league! I guess I'm different than you! I don't get on this website to seek out people that I disagree with and attack them, like you! I didn't at all make it sound as if only my team would be playing with that equipment!! A BMW and a Yugo are both cars ,they both get you from point A to point B, but if I had a choice to drive one or the other I'd take the Beamer! If you gave me a choice between an Ultra II and a wooden bat or it's equal, I'll go with the Ultra II. I don't think I'm alone.
Feb. 19, 2008
Fred@1
Men's 75
6 posts
MaverickAH is right. They are changing nothing in the standards. They are just testing the bats as they would perform broken in, just like the bat in your bag now.

They always had a retesting program after the bats were broken in but it was random. If you look at the approved list on the ASA site you will see that all the Mikens were retested in Jun 2007.

WOW:

What is the MSF model. I can't find that on any approved list and they all only list one Freak.

Usually an F on the end means FastPitch bat.
Feb. 19, 2008
Fred@1
Men's 75
6 posts
WOW:

I think I found it. That TD wasn't up to date on their bats. I believe that is the new Freak Limited Edition and that doesn't have an ASA Stamp on it.

That is a good reason I don't go by the Banned List because all non-approved bats are not always on that list. Which is why I always go by the approved list. If it is not on the approved list and doesn't have an ASA stamp on it then it is not legal in ASA.

So it looks like you got away with one.
Feb. 19, 2008
E. Ness
122 posts
I guess the fact that all the bat companies have stopped making the 98 mph bats now means that ASA has not changed the bat standards.

I guess the fact that the new ASA standard states the bats cannot exceed 98 mph after break in means there are no new standards. If the ASA bat standards have not changed then why are all the bat companies now forced to make bats that start at 92 to 94 mph rather than 98 mph.

Bottome line is this ASA has used smoke and mirrors in their approach which makes it seem as though nothing has changed but change has happened. If you do not believe this post then call and ask the bat companies.

I have talked to three Combat, Miken, and Worth and all agree the new ASA bats are no going to be close to the old 98 mph. They cannot afford to have any bats exceed 98 mph under the new standard. Where as before a 98 mph could be 100 mph after it was broke in now it cannot.
Feb. 19, 2008
Lecak
Men's 55
1006 posts
Ness what I have heard is the new ABI standard will go into effect July 1. Any bat you have they will honor the warranty with one of the new bats. Also I distinctly heard an ASA official announce they were close to introducing an inexpensive portable bat testing gizmo that would test for wall thickness, I can imagine this would coincide nicely with the new bat standard. Also check out pricing on the Original Easton Extended that bat which is an excellent ASA bat has really jumped up in price recently. My guess would be they will clean up the major tournaments but all hell will break loose at the league level.
Feb. 19, 2008
taits
Men's 65
4357 posts
Lecak, there are hand held devices that have been on the market for years. Basically an ultra sound device not unlike what they use on pregnant women or used as fish finders in boats.
Cost range from a few hundred to over a thousand. Older ones are available that you can get chips to convert to other needs as well. i have an older version but never went and got a chip to use for this. I got mine off ebay.
Newer versions are most likely more accurate, given the new composites. thicknesses they will or can do are the thinnest walls to about an inch depending on which one a person gets. Usually for specific materials.
Feb. 19, 2008
E. Ness
122 posts
Lecak,
You are correct. That is how it will work per the bat compaines. I tested one of the new 92 mph ASA bats with the new balls and all I can tell anyone is to keep their present 98 mph bats in good shape. We put 2000 swings on the bat and it never reached the Level of the old 98 mph bats that had less swings on them.
Feb. 19, 2008
taits
Men's 65
4357 posts
Once again ASA (Absolutely Suck Ass) takes the fun out of games. Screws the bats and balls up all over . IMO one must be hard up for a game to play in those. It's unfortunate that leagues are usually inclined to use their rules, when they don't have to.
Most modify them anyway, so why not shop around for something that suits the players for a change.
If it's insurance their worried about, SSUSA provides a solution. Have them read the latest newspaper, Page 17 is where the info is.
Super Blue\Red dots used to be good enough with great alum bats. What happened, not enough pay-ola coming in.
Wiffle balls with plastic bat games are next.
Feb. 20, 2008
WOW
197 posts
I wonder if EVERY Senior Softball team avoiding ASA tourn. would have any effect?

I know a lot of Nor-cal teams that are avoiding any ASA tourn........
Feb. 21, 2008
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
I just can't seem to understand the big thing over ASA bats.

Not going to a tournament because it is ASA just doesn't make much sense to me.

I play for the love of game and want to play every game or tournament I can get and don't worry about what bat I can use.
Feb. 21, 2008
bohack
13 posts
when we let asa tell us you can't use certain bats , and were playing senior ball then we play some were else for the enjoyment of the game
Feb. 22, 2008
DCPete
234 posts
Fred, it's not a question of having fun vs not having fun. The issue is that it's more fun playing with better equipment. And contrary to what a few others might have said, fun is the #1 reason for us to participate. All the singles hitters on my team use Ultra IIs whenever possible; not to hit home runs but because these bats have a bigger sweetspot and allow everyone to maximize their chance of getting a basehit which is more fun than walking back to the dugout. Sure defense is important too; but that's why everyone also uses the best glove they can find instead of some small or worn-out mitt from the 60's.
Feb. 22, 2008
DesertGuy
Men's 60
224 posts
I've been following this topic for a week or so and now think I'm pretty much in line with Fred S's thinking. I'm not at all concerned with the bat standard any tournament might use. But I am concerned that we are on a level playing field. If it's an ASA tournament, I'll use an ASA approved bat. Not because it's the best senior bat out there. It's not. But because the competition is the thing for me. Let's just play the game for the fun of it.

I'm not in my 50's anymore. And when I was, the technology on bats didn't make even a marginal hitter a home run threat like it does today. I enjoy being in a game where softball is actually played. Htting for average and base hits. Moving a runner up or knocking him in. Making a good defensive play. Hitting a cut off man and stopping a run from scoring. I sure enjoy that more than watching the hot-bat events in some of the younger age groups. Those events are just hitting exhibitions and are as close to playing softball as a driving range is to playing golf. Just my $.02 worth.
Feb. 23, 2008
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
DCPete: Your right in a way. But what I am getting at I go to a tournament for the competition meeting new people and trying to win a tournament.

I am a singles hitter also, with the ability to go deep once in a while to keep the outfielders honest but it doesn't bother me whether I can use my Launch 510 or my MUT98 and I just don't understand all the frenzy with someone can't use an Ultra II.

It is the man behind the bat not the bat and have some fun whatever bat you use.
Feb. 23, 2008
smooth01
Men's 50
121 posts
You can more than likely look for these standards to change every couple years, don't think for a minute that these bat makers aren't behind this either, as they love selling everybody a new arsenol of bat's every couple of years, The only way I wouldn't believe this would be if the bat manuf. offered exchanges when the standards change or otherwise discontinue the manufacturing of the new ASA standard bat's .But look at it this way, if you want to play ASA, why spend $299.00 for a 94 MPH bat when you can go to WalMart and buy one of those Easton Hammers oranother cheap bat for $30.00?
Feb. 23, 2008
diehard
Men's 55
245 posts
I would agree that most people on this website love playing Senior Softball. I know that I do ! I enjoy the competition and the friendships made. But if you want to see how your team stacks up against the top teams in your field, whatever age group, whatever level of play, then you should play tournaments in all of the associations. To be considered one of the best, you must play the best. Equipment, to me, plays a large part in this. So a player who plays in all assoc. probably has at a minimum of 3-4 bats in their bag. And one for each assoc.. Good bats aren't cheap! But they're like gas, no matter how much the price goes up we keep buying them. Why? Because we want to stay competitive. Bat manufacturers know this . The associations know this. So maybe the answer would be for the associations to agree on the same bat standards. And I believe that that standard should be dictated by the people who play the game!
Feb. 23, 2008
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
smooth01: Lets not get foolish. You are saying an Freak 98 or any of the top of the line ASA bats are no better than a Hammer.

I don't think so.
Feb. 23, 2008
smooth01
Men's 50
121 posts
I'm not being foolish, I think ASA is bieng foolish,and anyone who agree's with them. If you think a Freak 98 will pass the 94 MPH testing after broke in ,you are wrong..With the new testing ,there will not be any decent bat's to swing, so you might as well buy them at WalMart, and I do not work at WalMart and am not endorsing them,just a place to buy a $30.00 bat that will pass testing.
Feb. 23, 2008
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
Since Senior ball is going on the opposite direction with bats
as Ultra 2/Combat seems to be the gold standard
there's not much for us geezers to worry about
regarding all this "dumbing down" of bats.
ASA, ShmaySA.
Plus, it's the ball as far as I am concerned.
If we swing single wall bats
the "bleeping" ball better be good and stay good in the hot weather
and tournament directors better supply enough of them
to keep the caliber of play high throughout the tourney.

I think there's too much money involved for the bat companies
to allow dropping the bat standard too low.
As was stated above
they'd be giving up their lucrative market in 300 dollar bats.

Lastly,
many of us gauge the correctness of our swings
based on how well we are hitting the ball
at all points though a tournament.
So, it's integral to swinging/playing well
to have a bat/ball combination
that allows well hit balls to look, feel like
and act like they've been hit well.
It also encourages guys to make/learn positive adjustments to their swings
during tournaments out of choice or necessity
and become better hitters "in real time" if the ball they swing at in the game
responds directly and accurately to the quality and force of a swing.
Feb. 23, 2008
smooth01
Men's 50
121 posts
Fred- Do you know of any 98 MPH bats that will pass the 94 MPH standared
Feb. 23, 2008
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
There is no 94 MPH standard it is still 98 MPH. And for you info all the Miikens were retested by ASA and passed in 2007. ASA has always had a retesting program in place for random testing of bats in the field.

I still think it is foolish for grown men to get worked up over nothing.

And as einstein says it is the ball that has the biggest impact on performance.
Feb. 23, 2008
smooth01
Men's 50
121 posts
we are all entitled to our own opinion, you know exactly where I'm comimg from, and "Einstein "is only a knickname.
Feb. 24, 2008
E. Ness
122 posts
Fred if there is no 94 mph bat standard then how do you explain that starting July 1 of 2008 all ASA bats must not exceed 98 mph? The 2007 test allowed all ASA bats to start at 98 mph and then after they broke in they were allowed to be a + or - of 2 mph which means the broke in Freak 98 could test to be 100 mph and still be legal.

After July 1 the bats cannot exceed 98 mph if they do the bat company could see a whole bat line banned thus the reason why bat companies are going with the 92 to 94 mph per ASA. This way the bats will have no chance in hell of going above 96-98. I tested these bats with the new balls and both the bats and the balls suck. We tested in 60, 70, 80, and 90 degree weather. All I can tell you is you better hope you play in 60 to 70 degree weather.

Now the old 98 mph bats did hit the new balls better but as Joe said this new ball is the problem. Combine it with the new bats and it is not good. I would also add these new balls go soft rather quickly. Thank God ASA has died around my area. I love playing the game but if we are going back to wood bats or even single walls then we need to go back to good balls. The latter of which will never happen in ASA.
Feb. 24, 2008
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
Hey Ness,
I like your comments.
I love the 1-1 count as it creates a faster pace
and makes everyone more aggressive.
I would keep the mat bigger and increase the arc limits to
15 and 3 and
if the lower pitch
crosses the batter between knee and shoulder
it can be called a strike without having to hit the mat.
Extend the pitching box backward 6 feet.
All these will help limit scoring and keep the games from getting out of hand.
All you have to do to keep the big guys from getting silly with long balls
is give a good pitcher more opportunities to make the batters have to adjust.

Jim Carey, this is a terrific idea, a step in the right direction and can help SSUSA and other associations
learn what conditions we want/need when coming to their tournaments.
I heard that flying into Dallas is more expensive than flying cross-country
for most.
Feb. 24, 2008
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
E. Ness: that is the same situation as it is now. If in retesting in the field the bat exceeds 98MPH on a regular basis then I would assume it would be banned like the LV and a Louisville FP, I don't remember what model,

With all the problems in the world I am not going to worry if my bat is 94 MPH or 98 MPH

In fact if you put some pre July bats with some post July bats and blank out all the marking how many would actually know the difference hitting them in a blind test when you don't know what you are swinging.
Feb. 24, 2008
smooth01
Men's 50
121 posts
Why didn't ASA think of that??
Feb. 24, 2008
DCPete
234 posts
Does anyone have anything in writing from ASA or a bat company regarding this testing revision?
Feb. 25, 2008
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
Pete: The following link is the testing method that they use. I am not sure if this is what you are looking for:

http://www.astm.org/cgi-bin/SoftCart.exe/DATABASE.CART/REDLINE_PAGES/F2219.htm?L+mystore+punk1019+1203948604
Feb. 25, 2008
E. Ness
122 posts
Fred you are still missing the point. Last years test allowed for the bat to break in beyond 98 mph this year test does not.

Because it does not and the bat companies are worried about the idea of a ban they are bring the starting point down so the bats do not EXCEED 98 mph. Which means per these bat companies Combat, Miken, Worth they do not want their bats to exceed 96 mph. The type of testing you mentioned is how we do it. No one knows which one of the black bats is the old 98 mph bats until we hit them. After that it does not take long to figure it out.

Try this how many on here really love the Vel 2 as their bat of choice (no shaved one allowed)? Now think of a bat a little worst than that. You might as well get a good single wall bat and not spend $300 on the new ASA composites or be smart and keep the ones you have in good shape.

The bat companies make money everytime ASA does this but the companies I talked to and work with were real happy with what they had for ASA bats and were not real happy about the new standard they have to use. Now if you still believe there is no new standard then what you are saying is all the bat companies shut down production of bats that were selling to make lesser bats on their own with no direction from ASA. If that is what you believe then nothing I will say can change that. But I can tell it cost Combat an arm and a leg to retool their new Anti-Virus 94.

Joe I am with you. I like all the ideas so far and hope we can get this new division going.
Feb. 25, 2008
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
No I am not missing the point. Where does it say that. All bats can't exceed 98 MPH. There is nothing in the ASA rules that say otherwise.

The only thing they are doing is instead of random testing bats broken in they are testing them already broken in.

Time to move on to something else. This thread is now just going around circles with what players are imagining what is going to happen. At least wait till it happens. Maybe you would have a better argument then.
Feb. 25, 2008
E. Ness
122 posts
Fred believe what you want but come July 1 you will see. Remember ASA also told all of us that the grandfather rule was forever.

I would suggest since you do not want to believe me you try calling any of the bat companies. Combat is a good place to start. Talk to anyone in costumer service. Ask them why they can no longer make their Anti-Viruse ASA bat like they did last year. Combat did not want to change the Anti-Virus but now they must. I wonder why? The number for Combat is easy 1866combats.
Feb. 25, 2008
diehard
Men's 55
245 posts
The reason that this thread was started in the first place was because a friend who bought a bat recently was told by the retailer that the ASA standard was indeed changing around midsummer, he was told to get the bat while they were still available. I just assumed that the retailer would know since they are in close contact with the manufacturer. I also assumed that the manufacturer was in close contact with the ASA. The only people not in the loop are the players !
Feb. 27, 2008
E. Ness
122 posts
Your friend was told correctly. If you want bats made under last year specs you need to buy them now.
March 17, 2008
Stevens1
3 posts
In looking over this thread, most of the responses involve, “I heard that…” or “It is my understanding that…” or “A guy told me that…”.

So I went to the ASA website. I looked under the following sections: 2008 Rule Changes and Comments; Rule Clarifications and Plays; Certified Equipment – ASA Testing and Certification Program (updated March 6, 2008); and Press Releases. ASA has made about 50 press releases since the first of the year and not one mentions any proposed change in bat standards. On January 7, they announced that the Combat Lady Virus would no longer be approved, but that is the only press release that dealt with the subject of bat standards.

To follow up, I contacted the Commissioner of our local ASA. He advised that all rule changes for 2008 were posted on the ASA website. He added that ASA continues to enforce the 98 mph bat performance standard, but that he knew of no proposal to change the standard.
March 17, 2008
Lecak
Men's 55
1006 posts
Stevens1 from Anderson bats maybe Trumpball can verify this.

ASAs Policy Regarding Composite Bats

ASA has recognized the performance increase of composite bats as they are broken in. This performance increase takes current 98MPH rated bats over their tested MPH rating, thus negating any data obtained during testing. In an effort to spearhead this, ASA has introduced a new procedure called ABI (Advanced Break In) that they will be including in their BBS testing. The new ABI technique will insure that NO bat, no matter how many times its been hit, can reach a performance level that exceeds 98MPH.

Along with this new testing procedure come some rules as to how the manufacturers are to handle their current stock of ASA bats that have not been ABI tested and approved. These non ABI bats can be manufactured and shipped to the dealers until July 1st, 2008. After July 1st, 2008 the manufacturers must stop production and sales of these non ABI bats. The second rule allows manufacturers to ship non ABI warranty bats until October 1st, 2008. After October 1st, 2008 ALL non-ABI bats must be donated or destroyed.

Currently approved non ABI bats can be used by players until they break or until they appear on the banned list (whichever comes first).

Recap of dates and rules:

- July 1st, 2008 Manufacturers have to stop producing and shipping non-ABI bats to dealers

- October 1st, 2008, Manufacturers have to stop shipping non ABI bats to customers for warranty returns

- Players can use currently approved non ABI bats until they break or are no longer approved by ASA

- After October 1st, 2008, any non ABI bat in the manufacturers possession must be donated or destroyed.
March 18, 2008
Stevens1
3 posts
This statement is circulating on other softball boards and comes back to a guy who identifies himself as “Nate” from Anderson Bats. He seems to be legitimate, but when pressed about his “facts”, Nate responds, “I will leave the OFFICIAL statements to ASA”

This is the reason that I question the validity of all of this. Neither ASA nor any of the bat manufacturers have made any OFFICIAL statements about new bat testing standards. If you search “Advanced Break In – ABI” the only hits are on softball message boards…no hits on ASA, Worth, Easton, Miken, Louisville, Anderson, etc.

Nate may be 100% accurate, but I would give more credence to this information if the statement were to come from ASA, itself.
March 18, 2008
Lecak
Men's 55
1006 posts
I'm not going to argue with you, you sound more knowledgeable than me on the subject. We will see when the dates come to pass. Good luck to you the good news is that here in Vegas ASA has no presence other than an odd rec league. All tournies are NSA or UTRIP. Not saying ASA is bad just don't need to worry about what may or may not happen equipment wise. There is a part of me that would like to see equipment dialed down a little after some of the shots I saw in Palm Springs this past weekend.
March 18, 2008
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
I will take anyone serious who can tell me the BBS of the last bat they bought and what the BBS is on that bat after it is broken in.
March 18, 2008
taits
Men's 65
4357 posts
Stevens1
Nate is a great guy. Knows his stuff and yes does work for Anderson. He post on 2-3 boards. I have met him more than once.

As for the standard, I do not think they are "changing' it but are rather changing the way they go about reaching it.
As for the BBS (better bull C(S)hiT) Metal bats only improve only about a +2 for this, where the composites increase at least that to around a +6 the ball speed off the bat. Trouble here is the more powerful hitters are going to have theirs increase faster and more than the average guy out there. So who is going to be doing all this a average machine or real people. The majority of players are average. where is the line drawn.
Then you have ball types, and all temps your playing in.
So are they going to take an average of temps, ball types and hitting power (what ever that might be) and use this as a new 'standard".
what ever it is today will change next year anyway, given their history and evolution of bats, balls and all.
One way to protest is to boycott their functions. But they do, in my area anyway, give the best awards.
March 18, 2008
MK39
Men's 50
333 posts
Lecak:

You have the story right all the way to when the bat companies have to have there wharehouses clear of current models and right up to when they have to stop giving current models for returns and will start giving the newer models for returns. ASA and the bat companies will tell this story when they are good and ready to but i feel that now is the time for the consumer to be made aware of it. I put the following message on all my ASA Composite bats last week to start giving a heads up to the consumers interested in ASA bats and have been answering a ton of questions on the phones and through email.

Get this ASA 98 mph ASA Approved bat while you can. This bat will be never be made again for ASA. Starting July 1st all new models of bats for ASA will be subject to new ASA test procedures. ASA has notified all bat companies that all (2009 Models) will have to undergo a new test named the (ABI) Advanced Break in Technique test which is actually ASA rolling the bat with a compression machine on the barrel. The bat would then be put to the 98 mph test and if it fails then ASA reserves the right to ban the bat. This has forced the Bat companies to make the bat around 93 to 94 mph in the wrapper to begin with instead of how they have been making bats like this as close to 98 mph in the wrapper as they could. All current models like this one will be grandfathered in indefinitely and will not be subject to the new ABI testing. So get them while you can.

Mike Kelly
Kelly's Ultimate Sports
March 18, 2008
DCPete
234 posts
This explains why major companies like Miken & Combat aren't making 2008 ASA-approved bats. This seems like pretty disgraceful conduct by ASA (again) for all the ASA league players who will walk into a Dick's or Sports Authority this spring and buy an ASA bat unaware that they won't be allowed to use them in a year or two.
I agree with an earlier poster who suggested that ASA was keeping this change under wraps to keep from losing any more fees from existing ASA teams/leagues.
ASA continues to show a callous disregard for the slowpitch softball community.
March 18, 2008
DCPete
234 posts
This explains why major companies like Miken & Combat aren't making 2008 ASA-approved bats. This seems like pretty disgraceful conduct by ASA (again) for all the ASA league players who will walk into a Dick's or Sports Authority this spring and buy an ASA bat unaware that they won't be allowed to use them in a year or two.
I agree with an earlier poster who suggested that ASA was keeping this change under wraps to keep from losing any more fees from existing ASA teams/leagues.
ASA continues to show a callous disregard for the slowpitch softball community.
March 18, 2008
diehard
Men's 55
245 posts
I believe the ASA has backed themselves into a corner. They will lose revenue due to the lowering of bat standards. It is the players who decide which tournaments that they wish to play in. If the players feel the ASA is not where they want to play because of the bat standards changing, they will go elsewhere and play!
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