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Discussion: Sliding into Home? Your thoughts...

Posted Discussion
June 14, 2009
OmahaChuck
Men's 50
21 posts
Sliding into Home? Your thoughts...
Our Senior League has a rule that a runner cannot slide into home plate for safety reasons. We use two dishes and a commit line.

Since the catcher is removed at least 10 feet away, what's your take on this rule? Does your senior league allow sliding into home plate?

I see it as a risk assumed by the runner just as an infielder or outfielder diving for a ball.

Chuck
June 14, 2009
ill41
Men's 60
11 posts
Why would a runner want to slide into an unmanned plate?Sliding would just slow down his momentum.
June 14, 2009
Joncon
289 posts
Especially if you are an old guy :)

Some people think that sliding head first give you a split second advantage. They would be wrong.

A local guy broke his wrist doing this. I believe he was called out for sliding.
June 14, 2009
OmahaChuck
Men's 50
21 posts
Why? Some like to slide, some like to get dirty, some feel it is the fastest way to get there...

Regardless if studies show it slows down momentum or speed, my question was focused on if your league permits it or not and that since the risk is assumed by the runner only (and puts no one else in jeopardy), why can't they slide?

There is greater risk of injury sliding into second or third for more than one person rather than home plate.

June 14, 2009
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
Why. Is he showing off. That is the only reason I can think of to slide at home.

We Seniors have a lot of ego issues don't we?
June 14, 2009
OmahaChuck
Men's 50
21 posts
That was never an interpretation at all Fred. I witnessed the play from the stands, it was a player in his first year, and he made a nice slide. I don't see how sliding is showing off.

It's a skill like fielding a ground ball back handed or hitting to the opposite field. Some can do it, some can't but those who can shouldn't be assumed to be showing off.

Everyone has an ego; those who say they do not are not being honest. Some egos just require a bit more feeding than others, unfortunately. I don't believe ego was an issue here either. It was a good, clean play that was ruled an out and I wanted to get some insight on what other leagues do and why there is harm in sliding into an uncovered plate.

Chuck
June 14, 2009
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
Your right. Wrong choice of words. There is nothing wrong with it but you would think after a couple of games he would be familiar with the home plate rule.

Not many have a bigger ego than me when I am pitching. Problem is it gets me into trouble sometimes as I start thinking I am better than I am.
June 14, 2009
Omar Khayyam
989 posts
In our association, more than 90% of the fields do not have a home plate, they just have a line one must cross. There is no advantage to sliding across the line; in fact, it can be a disadvantage if the ump doesn't think you crossed the line in time. It is much faster to run full speed across the line.

But on those few fields with an actual plate, I think the rule is that you have to touch the plate—whether you touch it by stepping or sliding doesn't make much difference. Never saw a guy sliding home, but can't imagine the ump would call him out when he is far from the catcher (unless the catcher drifted from the real home plate and the slide is intended to injure him).
June 14, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3929 posts
there never has been a study shown that there is an advantage in sliding into a run thru base(1st or home),to slide you need to slow down to do it.so my question is why would you want to but to avoid a tag or to keep you from over running a base.
June 15, 2009
Fred Scerra
Men's 80
542 posts
mad dog: There was on TV a while back on the program Myth Busters and they ran a series of test that showed running to the base was quicker than sliding.

I like the plate better than the line because of the fact in a rare cases the runner may miss the plate and if the ump is awake you have yourself an out. With the line you don't have that.

Well off to the Ohio Classic.
June 15, 2009
OmahaChuck
Men's 50
21 posts
Fred, I found the link on mythbusters but the test was confirmed that sliding in to 2nd and 3rd gets you there faster than running/standing.

http://mythbustersresults.com/episode83

From the site:

On bases that you can’t overrun, it is faster to slide into them.

CONFIRMED

While a popular tactic used by baseball players, some speculate that sliding will actually slow a person down due to the friction being exerted between their bodies and the ground. With some coaching, the Build Team learned how to slide like baseball players. They then timed how long it would take to run to a base and slide to a base. The results showed that all Tory, Jamie, and Grant reached the base faster by sliding rather than running by several fractions of a second. The reason was because as they ran, the Tory, Jamie, and Grant had to slow down at the last second so that their momentum wouldn’t carry them past the base. With such definitive results, the Mythbusters agreed that sliding to a base is faster than running.

June 15, 2009
salio2k
Men's 60
548 posts
OmahaChuck.........Don't forget that you are talking about seniors, many of whom still play with flat bellied kids. If you tell seniors that they can slide at home, they will still slide at the real home plate where the catcher is standing. They will try to take him out just as they would in their open league. In the head of the moment, you don't think of sliding into an unmanned plate.
June 15, 2009
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
606 posts
Sliding is an insurance risk which is why an umpire should never tell someone that they have to slide. They slide and get hurt, and then everyone gets sued. Personally I do not have a pony in the race, but you should always check your rulebooks before you decide what is appropriate.

From SSWC: Sliding or diving into first base or the Scoring Plate is not permitted, and such players will be called out. However, a player may slide or dive into second and third bases and when returning to any base, except the Scoring Plate or Scoring Line.

From SPA: In running or sliding for the scoring plate, he/she fails to touch scoring plate and makes no attempt to return to the base, when a fielder holds the ball in his/her hand while touching home plate and appeals to the umpire for a decision.

From NSA Senior: Sliding is permissible at second base, third base and returning to 1st base. No sliding at home plate or going to 1st base the first time.
EFFECT: The runner is declared out.

I could go on all day. Of course this is an excellent example of why umpires get so confused because of rule differences.
June 15, 2009
Gary Heifner
248 posts
I knew about the no sliding at home but not at 1st the 1st time.

Question: What if an infielder throw forces the 1B to jump and the jump carries him to the orange side and the only way to avoid a collision is for the runner to slide. What is the call?
June 15, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3929 posts
fred,i think i mis-stated the way i wanted to say it.what i wanted to say is that it is faster to run thru then slide,like mythbusters did.OC the reason it may be quicker to slide at 2b,3b is they are bases that you can not run thru.you have to slow down there for the base or you can over run them and be tagged out.sliding there most likely is avoid a tag or break up a DP.
June 15, 2009
Joncon
289 posts
"""No sliding... going to 1st base the first time."""

You (or whoever made this rule) didn't think that one thru all the way.

Occaisionally, a slide into 1B is required. When the throw is off target, up the line, and the 1st baseman has to tag the runner, the runner should be allowed to slide/dive.

Might want to consider ammending that one in the name of common sense.
June 16, 2009
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
606 posts
Gary, if the rule is no slide, then there is no other option. Now depending on the association, a throw that takes the fielder to the orange bag (or not) can allow the bags to be switched for offense and defense.

Joncon, I am with you, but the gentleman that taught me how to umpire always calls a slide at 1st out because he says, "it is stupid". This is probably why I do not when the runner is there first if the association allows a slide. Believe me it is not funny when you have to look at your hat to make sure to enforce the "right" rule.
June 16, 2009
Dirty
Men's 50
1375 posts
Why is sliding into home or first, where there are two bases/plates, more dangerous than sliding into second or third where there is only one base each?

And Chuck, if sliding is faster why don't sprinters slide across the finish line?

Yet more dumb senior rules. Just play the game the way it was intended.
June 16, 2009
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
Hi Nancy.

The greatest base stealer of all time
slid head first, Ricky Henderson.
June 17, 2009
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
606 posts
Hey, Joe. That is an interesting fact. My buddy still would call him out at first if he ever caught him sliding into it. One of the gnarliest injuries I ever saw involved a head first slide, but it is more of a parking lot story (I am guessing that softball players do the same thing there as here after the games).
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