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Discussion: some thoughts about our game for change

Posted Discussion
Oct. 30, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
some thoughts about our game for change
what do you like,and not like
1)get rid of the CR,or make it 2 per inning max or designate 2 players as the only ones to get them for that game.just to many teams using it for able body people who just happen to be slow,if your able to run to first you should be able to go the rest of the way.
2)drug test players,we are all getting older no sense in dumbing down our reflexes(by achcol,and drugs),or enhanceing them by steriod type drugs.this way we can keep our sport clean like all others do.also will reduce the liability factor for someone hitting you with a batted ball if your impaired,or increase it if you are on steriods, juiced as they say.
3)go back to ASA bats(or even usssa bats)get rid of senior bats and and keep our ball standards,yes i know what you all will say,that the cheaters will flourish then,but install a rule that anyone seriously hurt by a batted ball(and not just the pitcher)that seems just to fast,the bat is taken for testing.if found to be doctor,that person and his coach are banned for life and liable for the medical care of the person hurt.you can get batter comp testers,that a lot of the younger assoc's already use.personally i think all bats should be comp tested before the tourney starts anyways.
just a couple,what do you have you would like seen changed.
Oct. 30, 2009
Omar Khayyam
999 posts
mad dog, I generally agree with your perspective on many things in senior softball, but I have a different opinion on these three.

As to the courtesy runner, I think you are forgetting about the older players. I didnít begin playing senior softball until I was 60, so all my experience is with AAA and major teams in the older brackets. The CR has definitely allowed many older guys to continue to compete. Thereís the power hitter who blasts one to the fence, a triple for most, but for him, he barely makes it to first on bad legs. There is the hamstring-pulled catcher, pitcher, or first baseman who hobbles down to first on a good hit, but is a real liability to himself with further injury or to his team as a runner. And then there are situations when a normally able-bodied player, not fast, is on first and it is vital to get him around to third with a singles hitter at the plate. In goes the rabbit.

I have been victimized by the CR rabbits who donít even play defense or bat, just come in to run (especially in past years where guys could be on multiple rosters), but I have too much compassion for the gimpy players still out there struggling in their 70s to propose a ban. I like the idea of imiting runners per inning which brings some managerial strategy into the decision.

As to drug testing, it ainít going to happen. A lot of prostrate-challenged guys canít even pee when they should and want to...and now youíre going to drug test them? Nice idea to bring some personal responsibility into the equation when an injured player contributed to the sittuation by being doped up, but drug testing is unworkable.

As to getting rid of the hyped-up senior bats, Iím with you, both as a pitcher and as one who likes the other aspects of softball (fielding, strategy, base-running, etc.), even though it would spell the end of my brief home run hitting career. I love your idea of impounding bats when a player is hurt and drastic penalties if they have been altered, and I am in favor of testing all bats before a tournament and then identifying them with a seal or unique mark. But I am a nail on altered batsóI believe anyone who knowingly alters a bat or knowingly uses an altered bat should be banned from senior softballófor a year for first offense, for life if a repeat offense. Altering a bat offends me in so many ways, including bad sportsmanship, immoral cheating, and safety.

Good thread. Letís hope we get lots of contributors.
Oct. 30, 2009
Dirty
Men's 50
1375 posts
Good thoughts. Here are mine on those three:

1) No, no, no courtesy runners. Ever. I love guys who sit some form of a double, then cannot run the rest of the way. The same guys who get a runner somehow manage to play the field the next half-inning. Just silly.

2) Who is going to pay for this drug testing? Will NEVER happen.

3) ABSOLUTELY NO special bats. C'mon seniors, let's have some pride.
Oct. 30, 2009
Paco13
373 posts
Mad dog, U need to stop taking those cheap drugs that only gives U a headache rather than getting U high. Drug testing...who is going to pay for it...not the TD, real stupid idea, Omar point is very valid.

CR is needed especially at this age, personally I am still very fast and enjoy running for those that can not run as Omar said, does the CR sometimes gets abuse, of course, do I get mad sometimes when the coach ask me to run for somebody that is healthy but slow, of course, but the team might benefit if I score from second with a single...room to improve the rule? Yes, but OK as it is.

Now the senior bats have to go, Utrip bats and good balls is all what is needed, if old people decide to shave bats, they most likely were cheating when they were younger, nobody is going to stop them, they are what they are. Bat testing is hard, a well broken in bat will hit almost as good as a sheved bat, what is the answer, do not know and truly do not care. lets play ball, cheaters will be cheaters. Amen
Oct. 30, 2009
Dirty
Men's 50
1375 posts
Paco, please keep in mind that the concept of the courtesy runner is not to benefit the team by allowing a fast guy to score a run. THAT is an abuse of the rule, though I know it is done all the time. How do these guys who get runners manage to play the field? They aren't all catchers and EHs.
Oct. 30, 2009
OTE24
Men's 65
122 posts
Courtesy runners are allowed at all
levels,young and old. Anybody who wants
an injured player to run is a sadist.
Who cares? It's about participation,
having fun,getting some exercise. I
can understand the ball and bat discussions,but courtesy runners?
It's only a game and MLB isn't scouting you.
Oct. 30, 2009
BruceinGa
Men's 60
2664 posts
My suggestions:
1)One courtesy runner per inning. In the lowest skill level, which now is AA, unlimited runners.
2)Allow Senior bats. They keep our 99.9% of the altered bats out of the game.
3)Three divisions instead of four in all age groups.
4)Allow only one roster for all Summit associations. If you are on one roster you can't play for another team in the same age bracket.
5)Lower tournament entry fees. (kidding :))
Oct. 30, 2009
Dirty
Men's 50
1375 posts
Sadist??? LOL

How did the "injured" player swing the bat, get on base, and play the field. They aren't all catchers and EHs.

You play the game to win.
Oct. 30, 2009
OTE24
Men's 65
122 posts
Courtesy runners are allowed at all
levels,young and old. I don't think you play. You don't care about winning,
this is the only game for you. Get out,
take a walk,enjoy life.
Oct. 30, 2009
CRUSADERVB
Men's 65
272 posts
HEY MAD DOG, WITH ALL THAT RAIN YOU'VE HAD IN TEXAS YOU MUST HAVE A WATER LOGGED HEAD [LOL]
#1---NO WAY
#2---NO WAY
#3---NO WAY
I'M WAITING FOR JOE TO RESPOND ON THESE SUGGESTIONS!!!
Oct. 30, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
ote24,the younger assoc don't allow CR's,maybe in some of your local leagues and such,but no younger sanction assoc tourney allow's them,that i know of.if you need to win a game by having a rabbit run for you oh well,guess you really don't play,i do in fact play and play with the younger set also,oh i still run,even tho i'm slow,i still run.our younger leagues don't allow cr's.

crusader,yeah the rain over here has been a biotch,lots of time on my hands.JR responding is all we need here,another tirade on how we require the hottest equipment around just b/c we are old. LOL

bruce some real good points,still don't like the unlimited CR tho regardless of div,make it so you have to be responible on how you use it,not just willy/nilly. by the way see ya in jaks in feb.
Oct. 30, 2009
the wood
1085 posts
Mad Dog:
1)no, CRs are important to many and it allows guys to play that might not otherwise. If you don't want to use them, it's up to you... but don't legislate your feelings onto others. OTE24 is absolutely correct... it's really just recreation...
2)no, part of me presumes that you're joking about this. In case that you aren't... if this is a problem with your team you might wish to change to a different one. I haven't seen it as a problem with our players or those on other teams.
3)no, while I do not feel the need to use them per se, I do believe that it levels the playing field (as it relates to cheater bats). I play in a local senior league and we use single wall, aluminum alloy (no composites), single piece shells... I enjoy the game there as well.
My suggestion, aside from the extra time that you have, is to concentrate on the parts of the game that are problematic.
BW
Oct. 30, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
wood CR's are problematic,i see it being abuse so much.big able body that his only prol is he is slow,gets replaced on the bases with cr's,why,hey lets try and hit him around,or is that to new age of an idea.i don't say do away with CR's completely(injuries and such,are ok)but if a person is able to run they should run.
on the testing,just a thought,with the way everyone wants to sue now a days,why take a chance.i've seen guys drinking between games all the time,again why take the chance,for a law suit.we all know any drink will slow your reflexs down,thats why states outlaw drinking and driving.
i will say i'm not a teetotaler either,i've been know to have a brew or 2,these are just idea's(a lot of rain over here in texas,and a lot of time on my hands).LOL
on the bats,if we don't do something,someone will get hurt badly,and 1 is to many.we all know the PPR rule is useless.i play asa ball with the kids over here and ya know what,it is a game and not the hr derby's senior ball can become.i actually enjoy playing asa ball even tho there is not all the long balls of senior ball,we play Defence(i pitch) and it is a blast.
Oct. 30, 2009
the wood
1085 posts
Bob:
I understood what you meant when you first wrote it... I still disagree.
BW
Oct. 30, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
no prol wood,just throwing stuff out for discussions and looking for all differnet kinds of answers.in my thread you don't have to agree with me to post.LOL.
Oct. 30, 2009
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
We should allow any rostered player
on the bench to play any defensive position at the beginning of any inning.
This would give all players a chance
to be rested easily during a 103 degree tournament like Phoenix this year
preventing injury and lack of performance.
Oct. 30, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
nope no platooning allowed,if he's not hitting,he's not playing defence only,this is to prevent teams from loading up on defensive specalists that don't hit,and having the big boys hit only.if ya wanna do that make the big boys eh's,but you still need to have anyone who plays in the field hit,isn't that what you have been ranting and raving about here lately.
Oct. 30, 2009
JamesLG
303 posts

1. Allow pitchers 15' arch.
2. Larger matt
3. No HR limits for 55 and over. Dead ball singles
4. SSUSA staff needs to move teams up or down instead of changing the rules in an attempt to even the playing field.
5. Be very careful not to overmanage this very simple and fun game we all play.

Thank You:

James
Oct. 30, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
not bad there james,some good input there.
Oct. 30, 2009
BruceinGa
Men's 60
2664 posts
In response to James:
1. 3-10' arc, with faking
2. mat as wide as the plate.
3. no hr limits for M+
4. ok with that but have only three division, not four.
5. Agree
Oct. 30, 2009
bogie
Men's 55
154 posts
Great comments guys and I really would like to thank the SSUSA for giving us a forum and listening to some of our comments.
First, BruceinGa&Dirty..thumbs up.
1)zero to one courtesy runner per inning...agreed with either..If a team wants to load up with slow sluggers, make them run. Its part of the game and it helps negate the over the top power some teams bring. I usually get run for, but I think it would save the legs of the guys who work the hardest and bring some balance back by making slow power hitters a liability on the bases. Its brutal on your best players to constantly run and this should be changed. I would say for 65-70 and older, leave it be..there are guys who are run specialist there and health issues merit giving some guys a break. They are some special dudes that are still playing at that age.
2)Allow Senior bats. They keep our 99.9% of the altered bats out of the game...totally agree..alter the ball, not bat...cheaters will prevail
3)Three divisions instead of four in all age groups...AGree for 55 to 60 and older, this would be appropriate as numbers decline.
James LG..agree, no homerun limits I would say over 60. If those guys can hit them, god bless them..they get fewer and fewer as guys age.
Up in the air on Joes. If guys hit but play no d, why can't guys play d and not hit? It would involve more players but ultimately I think if you play, you should hit too.jmo
Kenvb roberts 55


Oct. 30, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
good post bogie,na bruce,you be to good a hitter,we need to help the pitcher out,fakes maybe,but not many can do that,make it a 3-15 arc and add the 3.5" to each side of the plate for the mat(24" wide by 36" long,would be nice),as that is the width of a ball,and the pitchers should be able to get a little more plate area to work with,hell MLB umps are giving pitchers out to almost 10" off the plate for strikes,now i know that is ridiculis,by hey.LOL
Oct. 30, 2009
JohnBob
Men's 60
248 posts
mad dog I agree that sometimes the cr is a problem it delays the game when a decision to use one is not made right
away,maybe we could put in that cr has to be put in before 1st pitch to next batter. But the cr is a must for senior ball 3 examples for our team in Phoenix this year in the heat.(1) our catcher has high blood pressure and his Dr. decided to change his Medication well it took all summer to get it right it was changed 2 or 3 times. Anyway there is nothing wrong with his legs but we run for him most of the time and all the time when its over 100. 2)We ended up playing 9 games and had only one Pitcher and he hit .700 so we ran for him ever time if he went down we were done. And then their Larry who just wants to be cr,he hurt his arm can't play infield anymore but wants to be with team so he runs. Plus a lot more cases where if we did not have this rule players would not be able to play. Someone could hurt their Knee mid season,can still hit and wear a brace get to 1st base and stretch a triple into a double lol. We see these and others examples ever Tourney.
As far as senior bats they are hear to stay imo and speaking about the what ball to hit. I remember about a year ago on this very board numerous post on ways to speed up the game because mainly in M+ and maybe M were getting to play only about 5 inning before time ran out. I don't remember all the suggestions posted but there were many, but it don't take a rocket scientist or anyone to see that the better the ball the longer each inning will take.
Oct. 30, 2009
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
Bogie, you animal.
Congrats to you and the Roberts Boys
for winning in Phoenix.
Lots of interesting and plausible
suggestions.
One courtesy runner an inning is enough.
I agree largely with James
and Bruce about changing the arc
rubber and plate
to help pitchers keep balls in the park.
I like the 1-1 count as it makes games
go faster and play with a faster tempo.
HR's should never be outs,
5 run innings and equalizer home runs
will keep singles hitting teams
in the game with bigger hitting ones
without penalizing big hitters
or endangering pitchers a la Bill Ruth.
Oct. 30, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
johnbob,in such situations as yours i can see it(have these players designated before game starts),but the prol is so many teams just bring guys along to run only and that is what i call abuse.2 an inning is not a bad comp i think,but when there is 4,5 an inning that is abuse.one to me thats is no fun,and with your guy with the bad arm,hey he can still hit,if he can't field anymore.i have played with guys like that,they catch,sometimes 1b.
Oct. 30, 2009
JohnBob
Men's 60
248 posts
I could live with 2 pur inning than at 65 or 70 go to unlimited but my point is the cr is a big part of our game. Larry does not want to bat,he'll go in if someone gets hurt he just wants to run and coach 1st base.
You know James G #5 hits the nail on the head for me,this is a great game that we have had a lot of fun playing for 40+ years and all this talk about rasing the arch limit,larger matt,1
+1 count,screen in front of pitcher and so on. Where did the game go that I started playing 14 years ago?
Oct. 30, 2009
bogie
Men's 55
154 posts
Great comments guys and I really would like to thank the SSUSA for giving us a forum and listening to some of our comments.
First, BruceinGa&Dirty..thumbs up.
1)zero to one courtesy runner per inning...agreed with either..If a team wants to load up with slow sluggers, make them run. Its part of the game and it helps negate the over the top power some teams bring. I usually get run for, but I think it would save the legs of the guys who work the hardest and bring some balance back by making slow power hitters a liability on the bases. Its brutal on your best players to constantly run and this should be changed. I would say for 65-70 and older, leave it be..there are guys who are run specialist there and health issues merit giving some guys a break. They are some special dudes that are still playing at that age.
2)Allow Senior bats. They keep our 99.9% of the altered bats out of the game...totally agree..alter the ball, not bat...cheaters will prevail
3)Three divisions instead of four in all age groups...AGree for 55 to 60 and older, this would be appropriate as numbers decline.
James LG..agree, no homerun limits I would say over 60. If those guys can hit them, god bless them..they get fewer and fewer as guys age.
Up in the air on Joes. If guys hit but play no d, why can't guys play d and not hit? It would involve more players but ultimately I think if you play, you should hit too.jmo
Kenvb roberts 55


Oct. 30, 2009
bogie
Men's 55
154 posts
Don't know how that got on here again!
People do say I repeat myself. sorry.
Oct. 30, 2009
diehard
Men's 55
245 posts
We have a guy on our team that has no arms, and just to get him some playing time we use him as a runner. I'd hate to be the one to tell him he could no longer play if they didn't allow the cr. We also have guys on our team that back in the 70's tested every drug out there, so it doesn't make sense starting that again, it will only result in injuries. We also have guys that do play the field and don't hit. Also, we all chipped in and bought a senior bat, and now our best hitters are getting doubles. Those bats are hot! Leave them in the game! And as far as the pitcher faking, like they do in USSSA, well, I'm against that. There's been a lot of faking going on in bedrooms across America for many years now, and it hasn't helped any marriages, so I don't think it can help softball any! I kind of like the game of softball that we now enjoy, and I'd hate to change it too much,we migh regret making some of he changes.
Oct. 30, 2009
JamesLG
303 posts

I need to add one more very important issue I would change.

We need to quit blaming the player for the senior equipment. We did not invent the Miken or Combat we just buy them with our hard earned cash. We buy the best because we want to be the best we can. Who made all the money off the bats? If the senior bats are banned in a year or so you can bet a new bat or bats will be out that is the "new" hot senior bat and we will pay again.

Thank You:

James
Oct. 30, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
bogie you getting that sometimers,LOL.
johnbob i understand,but there(as far as i'm concerned)so much abuse of the CR rule.why as a fielder do i have to try and throw out the fastest guy on the other team all the time.there should be some managerial decsions made for when it can be used,(and not just when you get a guy to second and want that run),so that does not always have to happen.i do know some leagues that i've played in mad it the last out made had to run(mostly local leagues back in cali with the youngens that allowed CR's).i do like the first pitch rule that is used by SPA and the huntsman games where if the runner is advanced 1 base he no longer can have a runner.
oh well its good to discuss here.
Oct. 31, 2009
doker
Men's 60
168 posts
You guys obviously don't coach a team!!!!...You have no idea how hard it is to come up with enough players to travel to different tourneys around the country....I don't know about you all but it cost approx $1000.00 each time to venture to phx/rno/atl/slc/las..to attend the really good tournaments...and that means everyone gets to play in every game.Players are not forced to run for anybody they do it because they want to and it is done because someone is slow or hurt or physically unfit to run.Not always to gain a competitive advantage and if so ..isn't that a part of managing a team during a game.The rules are there to use and they are good rules that allow more players to participate in the game they love and far beyond the time they thought they wud still be playing. All of us are not what we used to be and any rule and equipment we can use to get close to 'what we used to be' is good both for our physique and our ego. Which as we get older takes one hell of a beating...Bats,balls and mat have all been changed over the years...the mat is now 2inches wider at 19in and longer at 34.5in than it used to be. Cud it be bigger ...maybe.....but the ball we use in ssusa is great and the bats are the best made!! Why not use them???...Just my thoughts as a player and coach for the last 13 years in Senior Softball....DOKER
Oct. 31, 2009
doker
Men's 60
168 posts
By the way!!! I'm almost 63 and playing in 60aa ,coach of the Austin Lonestars a team i started myself after moving to Austin several years ago. I've played on more competitive teams but choose to play with buddys here in Austin and now play more for the fun and comraderie than for the competitive advantage..If i was in better physical shape i cud possibly play in the upper divisions but as i said...i choose not to....My point is... not all of us play the game as life and death anymore...just for the fun of it...so lets not change the rules!!!! they're pretty good as they are now!!!...DOKER
Oct. 31, 2009
Dirty
Men's 50
1375 posts
So now we should make more changes to the fundamental way the game is meant to be played just to accommodate insecure old guys' needs for special bats? Changing the arc and size of the mat to help keep the ball in the park? How about using non-special bats, and then if guys want to increase their power they can get on a regular lifting routine and actually accomplish something instead of just relying on the technology of others.
Oct. 31, 2009
JohnBob
Men's 60
248 posts
mad dog we have had way to much rain here in KY to,my fishing lake is all muddy and will be messed up for another week,anyway I've enjoyed the posts on this subject, no name calling,no heated remarks,just good opinions. I would think thats the way SSUSA thought seniors would act when they gave us this message board. What in the heck happened? lol
My biggest problem with the cr is team not having one ready and having to wait while they discuss who can still run etc. Don't you think most teams have a player/mgr in senior ball? (I am for ours)so this slows game down. I use cr a lot to rest my middle outfielders if its real hot and we have more than 2 games that day. Anyway does anyone remember last year all the hype about speeding up the game because M+ were only playing 4 or 5 innings before time ran out. Some said go to 1+1 count,have outfielders hustle in and out etc but I like what bogie said in above post alter the ball not the bats the senior bats help kept altered bats out. Also a lesser ball would speed up the game.No mishit hrs,no need for PPR, Pitcher and coner infielders would have time to make play on hard hit ball,would help put defense back in game .
Bruce as far as the 3 divisions I would do anyway with aaa. This being my 14th year mostly in aaa and major spend half a year in m+ couple of years ago and from what I've see there is very little difference between aaa and m but a big difference between m &m+ with speed and throwing arms in outfied one of the biggest gaps. Would be nice to get input from some of the m teams that got bumped up last year on this.
M+ teams are always complaining about not many teams in tourneys and I had idea of doing away with 55 age group and go to age 50-57 and 58-64 in m+ only most don't move up the year they turn 55 or 60 anyway this would create more teams in the 2 age groups. Few liked it some didn't most said nothing. I still think it would work.
Hey it stopped raining, I'm out of here HAPPY HALLOWEEN EVERYONE!!
Oct. 31, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
johnbob,thanks,i've been the same rain here and have that same fishing prol,ugh.haven't been out for a few weeks b/c of this junk.well hopefully i can get out this week.

i like the 3 div system,but you'll hear a lot of moaning about teams not being able to compete(the combo AAA/M div)or there'll be a lot of sand bagging for the ring in AA.i like that age break for the M+ in the 50's you have suggested.
Oct. 31, 2009
butch17
Men's 55
415 posts
As I reflect back on the year and I can only speak for the age groups I played in and am only speaking ss/usa, looking at the number of different teams that qualified for TOC and scores in different tourney's it seems that they were very competitive. There were a lot of close games and different winners. More balanced.
Did I like all the rules no but in my opinion the combination of rules, fields, ball and bat is what made this possible. This year instead of like past years we played a full 7 innings most of the time instead of 3 or 4 and believe that 3 or 4 innings is not a softball game and when I have played in them win or lose it is not a fulfilling feeling. Softball was meant to be 7 innings. IMO we could tweak the rules a bit but to benefit most players but not just for a few.
Before anyone asks yes it has been raining here also.
Oct. 31, 2009
butch17
Men's 55
415 posts
I would also like to add a thank you to everyone at ss/usa for all their hard work to put on all the tourney's they do, all umpires(good and bad), field crews and anyone else behind the scenes I may have missed. Without all of you I would have to take up fishing or honey-dos.
Oct. 31, 2009
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
Thanks to Fran and Dave
SSUSA tournaments this year
were for the most part enjoyable
and well run.
Thanks again Dave for allowing me
and helping me to play SSUSA
this year.
It couldn't have happened without you.
I was told there'll be significant
changes for next year's SSUSA
and am hopeful senior players ongoing needs and wants will be well served.
Perhaps SSUSA can/will use the site
to gather info and/or poll card carrying
SSUSA members about perspective changes
for next year.
It wouldn't be hard to do
and would be meaningfully representative
of our group at large
more so than a convention few can attend
for any number of reasons.
Hope springs eternal and thanks
again to everyone involved in putting on the tournaments
and to/for all the those I played
with and against.
Let's do it again.
Nov. 3, 2009
Webbie25
Men's 60
1981 posts
After reading this, I have to add my 2 cents. Our Desperado team has several players playing that physically can hardly run anymore, but want to play. A couple are well over 60 (We played 50-AAA in PHX and without the CR would not be out here). I know teams have 'rabbits', but penalizing everyone is not the answer. How about one runner can only CR 2 or 3 times a game? I know the nightmare of keeping track, too.
Also, why not go back to unlimited arc. I learned the game with it, and if a pitcher can hit the mat, let'r rip. Just limit the fast, low pitch. Also, a 20" plate would make it a bit more difficult, too.
Thanks to all running Senior Tournaments. I would be fat an TV bound if not for them!!!
Mark
Nov. 4, 2009
einstein
Men's 50
3114 posts
Hopefully, the Juggernaut
that was dominating softball to change
it to something much slower and less enjoyable given some
of our problems and issues
has been meaningfully slowed down
or stopped, but I'm not sure.
We need good or lively bat and ball combo to enjoy our game.
This is obvious, yet,
there are few who are willing to stand
up and be counted on the issue.
Is that because in society now
there are so few who are willing to stand up and be counted on everything from global warming to the middle east
to 150 mile islands of lethal ocean garbage to medical coverage to
terrible city schools.
Just cause it's easier to keep your mouth shut doesn't make it right
or the best thing to do, does it?
And we play for the FUN of it
or we should have retired a long time ago.
We must avoid the vacuum of leadership
and powerful self interests
who'd like to see our game
go to a lesser game for their benefit
and profit, not ours.

Most seniors enjoy hitting with a lively bat and combo and we must be willing to ensure that this will be so
and adjust other aspects like safety
or time of game concerns accordingly
without throwing the baby out with the bath water.
Look at LVSSA this year.
Most guys and players
had a blast not just the teams
who won.
Nov. 4, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
ok guys some very good thoughts here,1)CR i see as a prol here,most like it,but i wouldn't mind seeing some modifications to it.i don't mind it myself for people who honestly need one,but not the over wieght slow guy,who just wants to hit and not participate in the game.they eh and just sit back down,while some poor guy gets run to death.i think it takes away from the game.
some mention on here that we can only play with the hottest out there,why.i don't understand all the ego's.were you that big of a disappointment in you younger days that you are trying to make up for it now.we don't need equipment that is lethal to ourselves when there are alternitives and much safer equipment to use.
Nov. 4, 2009
butch17
Men's 55
415 posts
Joe,

I agree and disagree with your staement that so few are willing to stand up and be counted. You and I both have people calling or e-mailing with their opinions and we put them on the board because some think people will get mad and /or disagree with them. This is America and everyone is free to have an opinion free of being belittled. So maybe we should only post our opinions and let the others post theirs that way they can stand up and be counted.
Just my opinion:)
Nov. 5, 2009
taits
Men's 65
4387 posts
On the CR: I too like the how it's used in SPA and Huntsman. But it is also widely used as a tool like walking a batter is to get to another or load them up or at least two for the potential double play.
Place the faster runner on to have the better chance of him scoring over a slower guy.
Another variation to it use is if the batter makes it to 2nd or 3rd, he can't get one.
But it has its place. If you can't get the slower one out to begin with, there is doubt you'd be able to get a faster one out.
As for the mat size...It was fine before they enlarged it. No need to change it again.
Add some allowable height to the pitch to make it more interesting & give the pitcher time to move back, set up or adjust to that move better. Also more area to lob ball into height wise.
Last one, might be enforce the batters box area, many players run up to hit or are out of the 3ft area to begin with, as well as even in front of the frontal box area.
Nov. 6, 2009
Garocket
Men's 55
157 posts
If SSUSA wants to improve the game and make it safer for the pitcher, here is a few things that could be done
6-12 pitching is good. The one thing that would help but is a nightmare to keep up with is the batters box. If the batter is made to sat in the 3x7 box the pitcher has a lot more control ovewr where the batter is going to hit it. Back in the 60s and 70s the batter box was called, and as a pitcher I could keep the ball out of the middle until we wanted someone to hit the middle so we could turn a double play. Any pitcher that is any pitcher at all can keep the ball close to where he wants and if he keeps it on the inside half of the plate, with a batters box the batter is going to pull the ball. The exceptio is a good hiter can ibside out the swing, but that does take some of the power out of the swing and most pitchers can react to that swing. I know this is a nightmare to keep up with the box but some companies make a batters box marker thats almost like a suitcase handle with a chaulk holder that just needs to be bumped on the ground and it makes the lines

These could be behind the cather and used ever half inning that could be redone while teams are changing sides
only takes about 15 seconds per batters box

Just a way to get the game back under control
Nov. 6, 2009
Paco13
373 posts
Garocket, your idea is an excellent one, sadly enough that rule is rarely enforced...In Phoenix I was watching a game between windy city and ??? and one of the windy city guys took what it seems at least 5-6 steps towards the pitcher and hit the ball...the ump called him out and he almost have a cow...right call. If that guys by any chance had miss the ball and hit it at the pitcher there was nothing that the pitcher could have done...the PPR would have not help. The PPR does not do anything for the pitcher or the game. Pitchers please use some protection...please. God is good and he loves you all.
Nov. 6, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3937 posts
GR yep like this thought of yours,i have stood on the mound waiting for a batter to move into the batters box,and when i didn't pitch ump said to pitch.i tolded him i would when the batter got into the box(batter standing 5' out)he then said the batter is ok,so pitch.i also see guys stand with thier back foot a foot or so in front of the plate(usaully reall tall guys),unless they don't stride,how the heck can they stay in the box.the walkers try and start out the back end(looks like out of the box to me) and run up on the ball.now if we could do the pump fake it might help us,but who can tell.
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