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Discussion: Fly zone Repealed

Posted Discussion
Dec. 23, 2009
GT
Men's 60
162 posts
Fly zone Repealed
Thank you SSUSA for listening to the managers and players about this rule. The way you have it now, is perfect. Wear or don't wear, its the pitchers option. A good step to bring back the game to us. Very much appreciated.
Dec. 23, 2009
starry17
4 posts
hey GT this is LP i guess i'll have to put the fishing on hold for awhile
Dec. 23, 2009
turn2
484 posts
So if you hit a missile by the pitcher are you out or safe? Still we are depending on the umpire to make a judgement call. Just let the pitcher use his glove and catch the ball like it should be.
Dec. 23, 2009
Dbax
Men's 60
1243 posts
Turn2, what don't you understand? The no hit zone has been repealed.
Dec. 23, 2009
butch17
Men's 55
415 posts
Donnie,

It's only if the batter intentionally
hit's at the pitcher. Most of us know when it is intentional.

Happy Holidays

Butch
Dec. 24, 2009
turn2
484 posts
Butch and Dbax
If I come to bat and hit a bullet a foot away from the pitcher and I out? All I am saying is how do you know if it is intentional.
A couple of years ago on Vegas, I think, Clatter hit one up the middle and broke Joe's arm. It was not intentional but what will the umpire call. Would he be out or safe.
Nobody ever tries to intentionally hit the pitcher.
That is my problem with letting the umpire have to make that call.
Dec. 24, 2009
Dbax
Men's 60
1243 posts
Holy cow. Turn2 you will only be out if it is considered intentional. Now how will that be determined? The only way is if there is some sort of argument and you tell the pitcher that he better watch out cuz you are coming after him, and then you do it. There is no other way it could be called intentional. And your statement that no one ever trys to intentionally hit the pitcher is B.S. It has been said many times on this board that if the opposing team goes after a pitcher, the "middle is open" and the other team will retaliate.
Dec. 24, 2009
Dirty
Men's 50
1375 posts
Dbax, as a pitcher who has only been hit at once that I know of, and that didn't go so well for the batter, I would NEVER allow my team to retaliate at the other pitcher.

If I have an issue with a batter, I will take it up with him. NO need for anyone else to get involved, and certainly no need to bring in an innocent third-party (i.e. the other pitcher.

If someone sucker punches you in a bar, for example, are you going to hit his friend or him?
Dec. 24, 2009
SteveSimmons
66 posts
To all interested parties:

1.) For action taken on the "pitcher protection rule" please refer to the discussion from the SSUSA rules committee dated December 4, 2009; designated as a priority item; and highlighted in red / pink at the outset of these entries. The eighth item, under actions taken by the rules committee, states the "pitcher protection rule" was repealed.

2.) For action taken on the "middle no hit zone rule", the new rule resulting from the rules committee meeting at the SSUSA annual convention on December 2-4 in Nashville, TN, please refer to the discussion from the SSUSA rules committee dated December 22, 2009; designated as a priority item; and highlighted in red / pink at the outset of these entries. Item number one in the seventh paragraph states the "middle no hit zone rule" was repealed.

3.) In that same December 22, 2009 discussion an explanation is given of the new rule that is in place that addresses pitcher safety.

Hope this helps.

Merry Christmas and we're still playing ball inside three domes here in Minnesota.
Dec. 24, 2009
GT
Men's 60
162 posts
Let me say in reference to guys intentionally hitting at a pitcher. If its never happened to you, then your very lucky. I have had it done in tournaments and in my own league play. Don't think for one minute, it doesn't happen.
Just my 2 cents on this topic.
GT
Houston
Dec. 24, 2009
Dbax
Men's 60
1243 posts
Dirty, I agree with you. The point is, turn2 stated that no one would intentionally hit a pitcher. That is ridiculous. Happens a lot.
Dec. 24, 2009
Omar Khayyam
984 posts
In a tournament this summer, in six innings, the other team hit 11 balls at me. Five I fielded for outs, one bounced off my glove and hurt, two were wicked hops that I couldn't get my glove on, one was on my pitching hand side belt high that I dodged, and the other two were screamers close to my head.

Was the other team hitting at me? I don't know. Seemed unlikely because I had played against them before and they seemed like nice guys. But almost two an inning seems a lot. What would the umpire have concluded?

On the other hand, playing against a young bunch of toughs about 35 years ago, my weaker and older team was ahead and they started hitting at me in the fourth inning and laughing about it. They narrowed the score but didn't win.

Yep, there are players who hit at the pitcher for intimidation, for retaliation, for a higher average, or just plain mean!
Dec. 24, 2009
BruceinGa
Men's 60
2616 posts
It happens, not as much with seniors as with young guys, but it happens.
Omar, we had the same thing happen this summer, we were up on an open team and they started hitting at our pitcher, a 65 yr old, and laughed about it. Their first two batters tried to take me out at first, running into me while I received the throw. The first hit me, causing no injury to me but causing him to fall, the second I avoided.
I've never seen this from a senior team. The umpire finally warned them to stop hitting up the middle.
Dec. 24, 2009
JamesLG
296 posts

When I first started playing senior ball 7 years ago I remember one of the leaders on the team telling me it is wrong to hit middle in senior ball. On that team it was very rare a guy would hit middle because the team made a decision the game is not worth hurting an apposing player. Last year hitting middle was rampant and it happened several times a game. I saw Bill Ruth the day after he was hit and it is a terrible sight. Many very good ball players use the middle and have been hitting that way for 30+ years. I don't like the no hit zone but but seeing a pitcher get whacked is hard to forget. A mask may not be a bad investment.

Thank You:
James
Dec. 26, 2009
Mr. Manassas
225 posts
There is nothing wrong about hitting the middle. I do not think that anyone should avoid hitting the middle especially if that is there best shot.
Dec. 27, 2009
LP
276 posts
if you dont think some players go after the pitcher you live in another world, i hav seen it donr and had it done to me.
watch out if you play a team from texas called the silverbacksin 2008 they went up the middle 8 times in a row hit the pitcher 3 times . two pitchers in same tournament had to leave the the game and didnt come back cause of injuries.
my point is that some teams and or players dont care who they hurt as long as they get a win.
Dec. 28, 2009
ill41
Men's 60
11 posts
I agree with LP.It seems every team has its headhunters.There sole purpose is to knock you out of the game.Seen it many times the last 42 years of pitching.
Dec. 28, 2009
wagon487
Men's 50
516 posts
ill41, does that mean you have someone one your team that is a headhunter?
You said every team has one.......
I know you are new here and have been pitching for 42 years but that is a crazy statement. NO ONE on any of my teams try to hit the pitcher.
I live in the middle, just ask Mr. Manassas:) Can't remember the last time I hit a pitcher.
Dec. 28, 2009
TOMAR77
Men's 55
193 posts
As a manager of a senior team if I were to find out one of my players was trying to hit a pitcher I would tell him to forget it, if he refused I would kick him off our team. There is no room in this "game" for head hunters. It is up to the managers and fellow teammates to keep the hot heads in check. I have experienced on a number of occasions where a pitcher has been a real JERK, they know who they are. It is a part of their game, best thing is ignore them, stay focus, get the hit and win the battle! Bottom line is we must control our own behaviour not let someone else dictate inapproriate action.
Tommy, Git-R-Done
Dec. 28, 2009
butch17
Men's 55
415 posts
LP,

You must have the year wrong because according to Joe that only happens when home runs are outs and they were still singles in 2008. lol
Dec. 28, 2009
LP
276 posts
soory, it was nov. 2008 in dallas , i was watching the game we were going to play them next. i saw that they had brought in 4 or 5 new players that werent there on sat. and the fireworks started. both benches cleared but just some shoving went on. the team playing the silverbacks and the other three teams in the tournament forfieted there games against them. they werent only out to win but to hurt other players.
and in half century tournaments they allow 5 HRS if my memory is right, didnt matter to that team they were after some trophies, heads that is.
Dec. 28, 2009
Mr. Manassas
225 posts
Some of you might think that I'm crazy but I actually try to get the batter to hit at me so I can be the hero....even the "Wagon". I believe that most batters are not trying to hit it at me because they have a better chance of getting a hit if it is away from the batter. I know that when we take BP we get upset if we keep hitting the screen.
Dec. 28, 2009
Mr. Manassas
225 posts
OOPs!!!! I mean pitcher
Dec. 30, 2009
outlaw
Men's 50
24 posts
When I started playing senior ball in Florida i didn't hit the middle because of the age of players. As a pitcher I spent the first two months bobbing and weaving as balls flew by and at me. So, of course, I went back to my natural swing which is between the 2nd baseman and shortstop. It may , at times, be very near the pitcher. Doesn't mean I'm trying to "hit" him.
I've seen players and teams deliberatly try to hit pitchers in both league and tournament ball. Actually happens all the time, even in senior ball.
Dec. 30, 2009
Dirty
Men's 50
1375 posts
outlaw, if all you are doing is "bobbing and weaving" you might want to consider a position change before you get hit/hurt.
Dec. 30, 2009
outlaw
Men's 50
24 posts
Dirty....you are truly an idiot....
Dec. 30, 2009
Dirty
Men's 50
1375 posts
You willingly put yourself in a position where you don't describe even trying to catch the ball, as they are "flying past" you while you bob and weave, and I am the idiot? LMFAO
Dec. 30, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3935 posts
lets see dipty,do you catch every ball hit within reach,do you ever flinch when a ball is hit near you or at you,if not then why did the senior team you tried to play with cut you,,mmmmm.
Dec. 30, 2009
Dirty
Men's 50
1375 posts
sad puppy,

"do you catch every ball hit within reach"

No.

"do you ever flinch when a ball is hit near you or at you"

Never have. When I do, I will switch positions or hobbies.

"if not then why did the senior team you tried to play with cut you"

As I have said before, I did not play well during the time with them, as the team did not play particularly well during that time either. It just didn't work out.
Dec. 30, 2009
mad dog
Men's 60
3935 posts
well at least dipty you finally gave a direct answer to a question,i do have to throw a BS flag on not flinching,not a person around that i know that has never flinched,we all do at one time or another, no matter what position we play or how good we are.
Dec. 30, 2009
E4/E6
Men's 60
850 posts
I thought my name was Ole' for years, until a team mate told me what it meant.
=)
Dec. 30, 2009
outlaw
Men's 50
24 posts
Hey Dirty...you don't know me? Why don't you just surf the forums and mind your business. I've watched you comment and downgrade everyone else's comments for a year. You, and people like you are the reason I don't bother with most of these public forums. Its not a discussion with people like you, its a confrontation. For you to denigrate and bully people you know nothing about, and have never met is, to be quite honest with you, not very bright.
Don't expect to see anymore responses from me on this platform as I will not take myself down to your level........
Dec. 30, 2009
Dirty
Men's 50
1375 posts
I have been direct about that numerous times before.

Throw whatever flag you want. The ball is coming directly at the pitcher, NO need to flinch. There are NO surprises. And if you are surprised then it just might not be the position for you. No shame there.

E4/E6, do you come complete with a red cape? :)

Denigrate? LOL I was honestly just trying to give you some advice before you get hurt out there. If you want to put yourself at that much risk, and if you want to get hurt, hey you are right that is no business of mine.

And by the way, you don't want to have an intelligence or quality of education battle with me, so for your sake don't go there.

Yea, don't come "down" to my level. It would be hard for you anyway with all of the bobbing and weaving you seem to like to do. ROFL
Dec. 30, 2009
E4/E6
Men's 60
850 posts
Yes Dirty,

And one of those neat little hats.
Dec. 30, 2009
wagon487
Men's 50
516 posts
Is this a ban Dirty thread? I'm in.....
Dec. 30, 2009
the wood
1075 posts
I've read the SSUSA retraction of 12/22 (No Fly Zone) and thought that perhaps it would be good to wait until some other opinions came in... what a disppointment. They came in all right.
Almost everyone suggested that it's real good that they did away with the NFZ... ok, I agree with this.
Hardly anyone has brought out that instead of the NFZ we now leave it to an umpire, many of whom clearly have personal agendas, to decide whether a man intentionally hits the ball at the pitcher. to me, this is a bit like MBL where the umpires issue a warning to both dugouts over the act of only one pitcher.
Yes, this is better than the PPR (dumb) in many respects and better than the NFZ (dumber)in most respects. But if this were the first step in the rule change it would have been met with serious opposition.
Come on, who the hell can tell when it is an intentional effort on the part of the hitter? And for him to face possible suspension?
I know, some of you guys are also umpires and I do respect that. But who among you are qualified to know the hitter's intent?
As far as the 'mandatory equipment' goes... more BS, just spelled differently. SSUSA doesn't give a rat's ass whether you wear it or not... as long as they are not held liable. Are you guys that gullible? GT, wake up! 'the way they have it now is perfect'... you can't be that dumb. IMO, the only positive about this rule is that it does bring the onus to the pitcher to seek protection. But then it gives a third party (umpire) the authority to ban someone based upon the third party's opinion of what the hitter was thinking... presumably, the actual ban would come from the umpire's judgement and some add'l non-players in the SSUSa office (unlikely to have actually winessed the incident).
Yes, this is a step up from the PPR and the NFZ unless you or your teammate gets banned. Come on, folks, you can do better than this.
As Forrect Gump said... 'stupid is as stupid does'.
BW
Dec. 30, 2009
Dirty
Men's 50
1375 posts
Yea, those hats are nifty. :)

Ban for what? Wondering why the guy seems to purposely put himself in harm's way?
Dec. 30, 2009
taits
Men's 65
4305 posts
BW,
Forrest Gump:(umpires)... life was like a box a chocolates, never know what you're gonna get.
But you're correct.....
Liability issue; back door approach. (door number 3)
Dec. 30, 2009
E4/E6
Men's 60
850 posts
Crap, now we will need written statements from players who were present and witnessed the pitcher being hit. That shouldnt slow the game down, MUCH.
That is a very good point Bob.
Dec. 30, 2009
Sluggers wife 44
5 posts
Hey to everyone...my name is Becky Fredieu,Larry Fredieu's wife. I'm posting tonight to ask for prayer for Larry. He's been diagnosed with "suspected carcinoma" colon cancer. He's scheduled for a second colonoscopy Jan. 4 and surgery to remove the tumor Jan. 8. The first colonoscopy wasn't 100% conclusive, so his surgeon wants another to determine whether it's a malignant or benign tumor before he removes it. Please rememeber us in your prayers.
Dec. 31, 2009
#6
Men's 60
1183 posts
Sluggers wife,
You and Larry are in our prayers,please let us know how is doing.
Tanel360/Bud Light of Austin over 60 team.
TAKE CARE,
Kenny
Dec. 31, 2009
Sluggers wife 44
5 posts
Thank you Kenny. I will post any news we recieve.
Dec. 31, 2009
the wood
1075 posts
Mrs. Fredieu:
There is a lot of room for optimism based upon what you have written. I have had similar circumstances in the past (5-6 years ago). I have a strong family history of colon cancer as my father and all of his siblings had it at one time or another.
Because of this I have periodic check ups (colonoscopy) and there have been suspicious polyps.
The key for this is early detection if it is, in fact, malignant. It sounds as though your husband's doctors are on top of it.
I know that the uncertainty is difficult for you and I will keep the two of you in my prayers.
Bob Woodroof
Dec. 31, 2009
E4/E6
Men's 60
850 posts
Mrs. Fredieu,

I dont know your husband, but I do know this community and the strenght we have when it come to one of our own. In this case I am sure I can speak for the majority when I tell you our thoughts and prayers are with Larry!

John Miller
OC Mustangs
Jan. 1, 2010
Sluggers wife 44
5 posts
John,
Thank you for praying! How well I know the tight-knit community of softball. It's the reason behind me posting here. There's no greater group of guys than in the softball world.
Bob,
I read aloud your post to Larry (as I do all of them)and it brought us hope to hear the outcome of your situation. Larry's mom was diagnosed with stage 3 colon cancer 4 years ago, with it returning last year. After completing chemotherapy and radiation for the second time just 3 months ago, and with much prayer and faith, she tested "cancer free". Thank you for praying.

Becky Fredieu
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