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Discussion: Stick8 what is the right call?

Posted Discussion
Feb. 5, 2011
Eddie12
14 posts
Stick8 what is the right call?
The other night playing with the kids in the Scottsdale city rec. leauge. I came to bat with the bases loaded and no outs. I hit the first pitch right down the line just on the inside of it. On the balls second hop it jumped up right towards the man on thirds head. He raised his arm up to protect his face and the ball hit him in the forearm and deflected to foul territory. The runner never left the base and was in fair play. I ran to first base but the umpire called dead ball. When I returned to home plate I asked him what his call was. He then went into this big explanation by going down to third base and showing everyone that our runner had jumped of the bag into foul territory and then on his way back to the base he was hit by the ball before he made it back to the base and since he was back in fair play he was out. Well none of us argued with him because we know he is a new ump and his account of what happend was so contrary to what had actually occurred. Stick I would like to know what the call should have been with the ball hitting the runner while he remained on the base in fair ground and then going foul off the runners arm.
Thank you, Ed Gorry Fangrabbers/Lonesharks Sanchos #1 Fan and Houdinis buddy.
Feb. 5, 2011
mad dog
Men's 60
3929 posts
eddie,depends on where the ball is when it hits the runner(ball in fair territory it is fair,etc),as long as he is touching the base,he is safe,not sure whether it becomes a dead ball or not,if i remember right i think its play on,as in live ball.
Feb. 5, 2011
DMac
Men's 60
185 posts
If runner is in contact w/ the base, dead ball, runner safe, everyone forced moves up one base. Bases loaded, runner on third scores, still have bases loaded. Second and third, no one scores, you now have bases loaded. If the ump believes the runner on third intentionally let the ball hit him then dead ball,runner is out, batter goes to first, all other runners move up one base if forced.
Feb. 7, 2011
stick8
1264 posts
Eddie12 the runner on third is not out if he maintained contact with the bag when he was struck. Two questions: 1)When the ball struck the runner was it in fair or foul territory? 2)If the answer to #1 is fair territory, you stated the ball went into foul territory after the runner on third was struck. Did it go foul in front (infield side) of third base or beyond (outfield side) of third base?
Feb. 9, 2011
Eddie12
14 posts
Stick8 the ball was in fair territory. The runner is new to softball and no one had told him to stand on the foul side of the bag. He put his arm up to protect his face because the ball on the second hop jumped up at him from all the top spin. The ball went off of his arm to the fence at the end of the dugout and may have rolled a few feet past the base at third (outfield side)

Thanks Eddie
Feb. 9, 2011
stick8
1264 posts
Eddie12, the key is when the ball deflected off the runners arm to the dugout fence did it roll in front of third base into foul territory or roll behind third base into foul territory? Since you say it struck the runner in fair territory which makes it fair (and it doesn't sound the runner intentionally deflected the ball) if it rolled in front of third base foul it's foul. If it rolled behind third base foul it's fair.
Feb. 9, 2011
birdie
Men's 60
680 posts
stick8, I always thought that the ball hits the bag it is a fair ball. I have never seen it happen but if the ball hits the front of the bag and goes directly left but not pass the bag is it fair or foul? I would have to say fair ball. So if that is correct then would not the runner be considered part of the bag thus if he gets hit would it not be a fair ball no matter where the ball ended up. Thanks Harry
Feb. 9, 2011
Webbie25
Men's 60
1964 posts
Birdie
If a ball hits the first or third base bag and deflects into the stands or out of play it is a ground rule double. Once it hits the bag it is deemed a fair ball for any further play. I cannot think of a situation where it is not.

Here is a call for you. A batter hits a line drive at the mound and it hits the rubber and shoots directly back over the plate, over the backstop, and out of play. (I saw this in baseball once). What is the call?
Feb. 10, 2011
birdie
Men's 60
680 posts
Webbie, It would be a foul ball because the pitching rubber is not base the first or third bag.

Is the runner considered part of the first or third base bag. if the ball hits the runner and goes into foul territory, I think it is a fair ball. Thanks Harry
Feb. 10, 2011
stick8
1264 posts
Birdie if a batted ball hits the bag it's a fair ball no matter where it goes. Is the base runner who has maintained contact with the bag and was struck (as per the example)considered part of the bag? On further review of the play I'm going to say yes so the ruling would be a fair ball--unless the umpire deemed the base runner to have intentionally deflecting the ball.
Feb. 10, 2011
stick8
1264 posts
Webbie25 that's a foul ball.
Feb. 10, 2011
birdie
Men's 60
680 posts
Should have been past the bags, sorry about that. Harry
Feb. 10, 2011
Webbie25
Men's 60
1964 posts
It is a foul ball, but a lot of guys don't realize it. I saw it happen in a baseball game and they argued for a ground rule double. The ball has to pass a base and this one does not.
Stick8-as usual I agree with your assessment on the other call, too.
Feb. 11, 2011
stick8
1264 posts
Your right about that Webbie. It's just like a grounder that hits a rock or a hole in the infield then carroms foul in front of first or third base. Or if the wind blows it. I've seen both happen a few times.
Just a quick note: I hope no one gets the idea I'm some great umpire. In reality I'm remarkably average!!
Feb. 14, 2011
Webbie25
Men's 60
1964 posts
Hey stick8-me too, but here we can be supermen!!!!!! lol
Feb. 14, 2011
stick8
1264 posts
Yes I suppose we're all keyboard experts/all stars lol
How'd you guys do in the TOC?
Feb. 14, 2011
mad dog
Men's 60
3929 posts
stick the runner is not considered part of the bag per say.if the ball is over foul ground when it hits him and he is still on the bag,but body is in foul territory that is hit, it is a foul ball,over fair territory it is a fair ball,like you have said it is location,location,location...LOL


how about the guy who argues that the ball is foul that hits the foul pole.....LOL he says it is foul b/c it is a foul pole.....LOL


webbie the mound one is one i use to win bets with all the time...LOL

stick last i seen webbie and his team were getting lucky..LOL they were in the champ game and had to be beat twice.
Feb. 14, 2011
Webbie25
Men's 60
1964 posts
Guys-we won it 21-10. They were pretty tired, but we played better than I've ever seen us play. Thanks for coming by, mad dog--I won't out you yet-......... you base hitting little guy!!
Feb. 14, 2011
stick8
1264 posts
Your right mad dog, that's why I asked where the ball went after it hit the runner. Webbie, congratulations! What prizes did they give out?
Feb. 14, 2011
Webbie25
Men's 60
1964 posts
Thanks--A nice plaque, jackets are part of it, I think, and the ring is paid for.
We had a blast despite the cold (and my U@ broke internally against NY Motion after 3 hard shots between first and second and I didn't catch on for 2 games). That makes 6 U2's since beginning of last year-may have to go homeless to play anymore.
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