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Discussion: High tourney entry fees and weak prizes...

Posted Discussion
May 16, 2011
tekdad1023
Men's 40
8 posts
High tourney entry fees and weak prizes...
You would think with 212 teams showing in Carson and Reno there would be some decent prizes. We played the states in vacaville last year and took 2nd place to Magic Unforgiven , our prize.. 15 red $ 5.00 hats.. What the hell. As players we spend alot of $ money getting to tournies and it would be nice if you would recieve some different prizes for winning. Better than that.. If you win along with the "blue" $ 5.00 hats and $ 10.00 carry bags, you get to buy your own ring. Where does all the entry fee money go..?
May 17, 2011
#6
Men's 60
1183 posts
tekdad1023,
This has been discussed several times on this board, and I see with only 3 posts you may be new to this site.
If your playing for "prises" or "awards", your playing for the "wrong" reason. Just my thoughts !
May 17, 2011
tekdad1023
Men's 40
8 posts
# 6 , we all play for love of the game however: wouldn't it be nice to get some sponser money to help out with travel, or maybe a bat or 2 since there are serious durability issues with senior bats...? There is alot of money being made at these senior tournies, isn't there..? What's wrong with breaking a little off for the winners. Many teams are self sponsered and I'm sure could use a little help. I'm wondering what you yourself have to do with SSUSA...? I have played almost 25 yrs now with some of the top teams so I think I play for the right reasons. At least buy the rings for the winners, geez.. That's all I'm saying...Just my thoughts. do you drive to the casino and spend your money because you enjoy gambling and could careless about winning, or do you like to win when your lucky...? Wouldn't it be nice to win some of your money back..? Mute point in my book. My team lacks a sponser so would you please help us out a little so we can all play for the right reason..?
May 17, 2011
mad dog
Men's 60
3935 posts
#6 i think tekdad has it right,we pay any where's from $300 on up to $600 for tourney's and get nothing in return,basically.wouldn't it be nice if we the players who support these assoc's get something back in return for shelling out these really hi tourney fee's.if i want to play just for fun why spend up to $750 for weekends(travel,food,hotel,tourney fee,etc) to play,when i can just stay here locally and do it for $15-$25.
May 17, 2011
Omar Khayyam
984 posts
Seems like there are two issues here: what does the winning team receive as an award and what awards are given to non-winners.

Winning team ought to at least get an award that is more than their entry fee. One local tournament routinely gives out nice windbreakers to first place—team name embroidered on, choice of color, choice of size. About a $30-35 value and for 16 guys on the roster, the $500+ prize is more than the $300 entry fee. Seems fair to me. Second place? Nothing.

Once played in a tournament where wheeled bat bags were given to first place! That was about $80 per player or a $1200 prize for a $500 entry fee. Great return. Second place? Nothing.

Very few tournaments that I go to give out a second place award, and if they do, it is usually a generic T-shirt. Lots of tournaments give out a T-shirt for first place—better than nothing, but not quite one's money back for winning.

I compete for the joy of it. I've had a good tournament where my team played well, where I was satisfied with my performance, where some good memories were made, where I had a fun Saturday night with the team, and we won nothing. Still a great weekend. For me, prizes are an afterthought. Frankly, I'd rather have lower tournament fees (we're self-sponsored) and no prizes, other than the satisfaction of winning.

In this area, SSUSA fees are the highest of all, and for a well-run tournament like Reno, it's worth it. For other tournaments, not always a value. Play for the pleasure, not for the prizes.
May 17, 2011
canIjack
Men's 60
321 posts
We play for the love of the Game, Bull Sh..
We play because we can't do anything else. We can't play football; most of us can't jump and run up and down a court. So this Love of the Game is OVER RATED. THIS IS THE ONLY GAME THAT I CAN PLAY. And when I can run anymore I'll take out those Golf clubs. We play to WIN! And the Awards have a lot to do with it. I go to Rings Tourneys, not the TEE Shirt Tourneys.
SPA has the best Awards of All the Associations.
Othe associations are always talking about, how many teams showed up, but never about what Prizes will given away. There was a time when the Association would advertise the awards being given away. The Awards was the Attraction. Its all take and no give now days. Greed!
May 17, 2011
#6
Men's 60
1183 posts
Omar,
I agree with you..........I play because I play with a bunch of great guys and that is a big enough reward for me, prizes come in second.

tekdad1023....I have nothing to do withh SSUSA except I play in their tournaments !!!!!!PERIOD ! Comparing going to a casino and playing in a tournament is a stretching it !BTW.WE DON'T HAVE A SPONSOR EITHER/

mad dog, this is where we disagree, you say you play in tournaments and get nothing in return........I seen your Dallas Spurs team play in several tournaments and you get just what we get out of them..the fun of playing with some good guys on the weekend. Who needs another t-shirt or cap ?
May 17, 2011
dooker
27 posts
Let's wake up, boys. These associations are put together for one reason: profit maximization at the expense of those who participate in and underwrite their tournaments. Losing discipline regarding the dispensing of awards/prizes and the like is not economically beneficial to their business plan. What do you think, maddog?
May 17, 2011
tekdad1023
Men's 40
8 posts
#6, first off I would like to say that I mean no disrespect toward anyone, just stating my opinion..My point is... SSUSA is posting that 212 teams @ $ 525.00 entry fee per team is going to the Reno area. Doing the math, that's $111,000 colected dollars. I know there are field expenses, umpires etc etc.. according to a good friend who runs many tournies, there should be in excess of $ 80,000 left after expenses. My point being this' if the association at least paid for the " Basic " rings for the winners of each division and refunded both 1st and 2nd place teams their tourney fees, there would still be a fat amount of money left over. I know there will be those that say, " save your money and stay home then" but that is not an option for my team. We play to win. It's the greed I have a problem with. Last year at states we had the worst parking situation ever and again cheesy prizes were given. wouldn't it be nice for the MVP and all tourny teams receive more than a patch...lol.. talking about all the teams playing and no mention of prizes at all. Prizes have always gave more reason to try your hardest, yes the comradey is a great part of the game but the $ 3,000 my team will spend on that weekend would be less felt if we receive paid for rings should we happen to win... Good luck to all and God bless all the Vets, I'm one of them.. Troy E Class Act Softball Norcal..
May 17, 2011
mad dog
Men's 60
3935 posts
oh i'm with you dooker,that assoc are not looking after their winners in tourney's.
the all age tourney's around here advertise what they are going to give out for prizes first than let you know what it is gonna cost for tourney fee.
ssusa is just the opposite,suck you in with telling you how great a tourney it is gonna be,but you never know what the winners prize is gonna be(most likely a $10 tee shirt/hat)until you win,if your that lucky.with most of their ring tourney's you are given a piece of paper so you can pay another $250 dollars on top of what you have spent just to get there and play.

#6 yes it is fun getting together(mostly fidel's in georgetown as they are way cheaper than the others)but when your paying close to $400 for just qualifiers,it gets kind of old if you get next to nothing in return if you happen to win.
May 17, 2011
THECAT
59 posts
Ok, finally some real action may be in order.
Let us see if the SSUSA can send to every manager playing in the RENO tourney a breakdown of expense to justify awards either given of not given at this tourney.
The managers paying this entry fee should be able to get answers for their entry. Or are there some new rules that may keep the organization from printing this out to participating teams.
To much to ask for, may be the answer we may get!
The love of the game is what keeps us coming back. Let's spend some of the monies on the participating teams.
May 17, 2011
Gary19
Men's 50
2617 posts
THECAT, good luck with that request.

Next time you go to a restaurant try asking the owner for a breakdown of his expenses to justify the cost of the meal.
May 17, 2011
doker
Men's 60
168 posts
ALL RIGHT GUYS!!!! THIS HAS BEEN DISCUSSED MANY TIMES BEFORE!!!!!!! ...SSUSA IS THE BEST ASSOCIATION IN SENIOR BALL HANDS DOWN!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THOSE PRESENTING THESE TOURNEYS ARE PRETTY STRAIGHT FORWARD IN THEIR APPROACH TO US PLAYERS THAT THEY ARE OUT THERE TO MAKE MONEY AS AT THIS STAGE IN LIFE THE SETUP OF THESE GAMES IS THEIR JOB!!!!..AND I FOR ONE THINK THEY DO AN EXCELLENT JOB!!!! THINK ABOUT ALL THEY HAVE TO DO TO MAKE IT HAPPEN....THERE MIGHT BE 222 TEAMS IN RENO BUT THERE ARE IN THE MENS ONLY APPROX 20 SEPARATE DIVISIONS..OF THOSE 222TEAMS..THATS 20 1STS..SECOND AND THIRDS....FIELD SET UP IN DIFFERENT LOCATIONS ALL OVER THE AREA AROUND RENO /SPARKS AND CARSON CITY...UMPIRES FOR ALL THE GAMES /FIELD GENERALS FOR EACH COMPLEX...ALL THAT THIS ENTAILS IS MIND BOGGLING TO ME!!!! AND I'M SURE I HAVEN'T EVEN TOUCHED ON ALL THE PARTICULARS....AGAIN THEY DO A GREAT JOB OF IT!!!(MY OPINION)......LOCAL TOURNEYS OF 10-15 TEAMS CAN BE A NIGHTMARE....JUST ADD 200 MORE TEAMS TO THAT?????????????.....DAVE /TERRY /FRAN.....YOU DO A GREAT JOB!!!!....AND PLEASE CONTINUE TO DO SO...AS THIS TOURNEY THING IS MY DRIVING FORCE(OTHER THAN FAMILY) AT THIS POINT IN LIFE!!!!.DOKER
May 17, 2011
doker
Men's 60
168 posts
AND YES I AM SHOUTING!!!!!!!
May 17, 2011
dooker
27 posts
Doker - Do not disagree that SSUSA puts on a good tournament for the most part. They get you involved early with the publishing of teams involved (which a lot of guys like to know as early as possible) and they get schedules out in a fairly timely manner The do, however, have their shortcomings (as I stated earlier with this year's TOC). However, their shortcomings pale in comparison to those of SPA. Playing in a tournament in Plano this weekend and we can't even get a list of teams involved. Just received the schedule for the first day's play yesterday. Seems they like to keep everything a secret up 'till the eleventh hour.
May 17, 2011
#6
Men's 60
1183 posts
mad dog,
See what you have done, you have doker screaming and a person in his shape shouldn't scream.....LOL. Love you Dokester
May 17, 2011
tekdad1023
Men's 40
8 posts
Listen, Reno/Carson City are gambling cities that are struggling with a slow economy. When 222 teams come to the area there is plenty of money being spent by the players. If you don't think that these cities do whatever they can to accommodate SSUSA. Your sadly mistaken. What is wrong with helping the winning teams out with some future travel money. I realize that there is allot of work involved but these people are making enough money throwing these tournies that I'm sure they don't mind the extra work. Yes I'm all good with the American Dream and by no means do I support socialism but please, quit being so damn greedy and hand out some respectable prizes.. Geez take care of us small ones down here in Whosville, Grinches...lol
May 17, 2011
LP
276 posts
ssusa, spa, and other orgs. are a business and without them all there would be is the local tournaments and we wouldnt get to play teams from all across the nation. but, and there is always a but.when we won our division in 2009 at the vegas winter world tournament, other than havibg to buy your own ring there wasnt any awards given out that even showed we were there.

so its play and take whats not given out or just play local, me i like going out of state and playing and meeting fellow ball players.
May 17, 2011
#6
Men's 60
1183 posts
LP,
Well said.........See you Friday.........
May 17, 2011
mad dog
Men's 60
3935 posts
lp,6,doker and he rest of ya's,it would be nice if they would at least give the winner's something nice for winning a tourney,and not just a $5 hat.as one said there are approx 20 different div,to me if you give the winners something nice that would be real nice with only 20 div.2nd and 3rd can get something less as all tourney's do that.hey give the winning team its fee back,that would be real nice.for the money we have to shell out something should be done for us if we win.

for the ones who say play for the love of the game,well how about paying for my expenses to go to these tourney's,then i'll have no prol going and playing.
May 18, 2011
#6
Men's 60
1183 posts
mad dog,
I have seen you play........no way would I pay for your expenses........you eat too much.......lol.
May 18, 2011
stick8
1261 posts
Dooker, if the associations don't make profits they won't be able to put on the tournaments. Then what? Stay home and deal with our wives all summer? Yikes!! lol
Honestly I'm fully aware some prize packages could be more innovative. But there is more than nice prizes to judging the quality of a tournament. Scheduling of games, field conditions, tournament staff, staff at the facility, umpires, the surrounding area to mention a few.
May 18, 2011
mad dog
Men's 60
3935 posts
#6 why do you keep begging me to play for ya's then,maybe if you didn't drink buttwiper,maybe i would........DOH,LOL.....

stick why pay upwards to a grand for a tourney when i can get what you are talking about with only paying maybe $100 max(traveling up to 150 miles) and sometimes get bats for tourney prize and stay local.
yeah they need to turn a profit,but not gouge us.
May 18, 2011
stick8
1261 posts
Mad Dog I can't speak for SSUSA tourneys because I'm not familar with their expense reports. I can tell you the expenses I've seen locally in USSSA run events. Based on the intake of entries matched against expenses sometimes we're lucky to make anything. Perhaps we don't charge enough but we're not in the softball business.
Usually when bats or something on that order is offered as a prize it's usually donated by the bat company as part of a deal with the association.
May 18, 2011
mad dog
Men's 60
3935 posts
well with the assoc with mfg'ers that ssusa has,why can't they do that.

the ones that do offer bats,mostly charge $200-250 per team and do require a certain number of teams(usually 12)and yeah they either get them at a way reduced price or they are donated,mostly reduced price.its like 10 bats spread out between the first 4 finishers(4-1st,3-2nd,2-3rd,1-4th).



May 18, 2011
#6
Men's 60
1183 posts
mad dog,
That was befre I saw you play in the last tournament, how many times did you get burned, we lost count......lol Ed SAID YOU HIT .300
May 18, 2011
#6
Men's 60
1183 posts
mad dog,


"before"
May 18, 2011
grizzly
5 posts
Here is a good test for the theory that Prizes and awards are more important than good competition with lots of teams.

This week in Beavercreek, Ohio SSUSA is running a tournament for $350 and giving a free bat to all teams who attend.

Twelve miles away in Kettering, Ohio SPA is running a tournament for $395 and giving nothing for just attending.

Both have great softball complexes. I think the only difference in teams attending is the SPA is only AA and AAA while SSUSA allows majors.

It will be interesting to see which tournament draws the mosr teams.

By the way this is the first year for both tournaments.

May 18, 2011
stick8
1261 posts
"This week in Beavercreek, Ohio SSUSA is running a tournament for $350 and giving a free bat to all teams who attend"
Grizzly did you mean to type free hat? If it is a bat I'd be curious to know which bat. If it's a senior bat someone is being pretty generous
May 18, 2011
stick8
1261 posts
On second thought maybe I misunderstood Grizzly. Is it one bat per team? It's still being quite generous.
May 18, 2011
stick8
1261 posts
Mad Dog I don't know for sure but I would guess SSUSA has some kind of arrangement with Miken.
May 18, 2011
grizzly
5 posts

This is what is on the SSUSA web page.

FREE NEW ComBat for EVERY TEAM!!
ENTER THE OHIO FREE BAT CLASSIC AND YOUR TEAM WILL A NEW CENTENARIAN ComBat!

It will be interesting to see if other SSUSA qualifiers will also offer the "free bats"
May 18, 2011
Wayne 37
192 posts
Wow, I think...............
May 19, 2011
thndr1
Men's 50
29 posts
Sounds like something Big Mike has a hand in.

Cliff
May 19, 2011
RedEye
Men's 55
92 posts
Last word on the street was:
Dayton had 20+ & Beavercreek had 10+
Could of been a nice 30+ at either place.
Both 1st year tournaments.
May 19, 2011
dooker
27 posts
Grizzly - Just curious, but who's putting on the tournament in Kettering, OH? That's where I happen to have developed my incomparable softball expertise as a youngster and I still have some buds playing back there. Right on the incomparable, heh Maddog? You've seen me play!!
May 19, 2011
Ho
226 posts
The Kettering tournament is a SPA tournament.

Ho
May 19, 2011
RedEye
Men's 55
92 posts
SPA tourn is in Dayton @ Kettering Fields, NW of Kettering.
Local ASA Shorty Brewer & Lou D. are running it.

SSUSA is in Beavercreek @ Rotary Park, SE of Dayton.
Not sure who is running it.

dooker, are you from Kettering?
May 19, 2011
dooker
27 posts
Red Eye - Born and raised. Graduated from Fairmont West back in '65. After a stint in the militry, got my undergraduate degree from Wright State. You ever come across a guy named Mike Marinelli? How about Gary Webb?
May 20, 2011
RedEye
Men's 55
92 posts
dooker- WOWeeeee I graduated from Fairmont West in '69, my parents still live in same house by Town & Country.
I know both Mike & Gary & just saw them this week. Mike plays for the Dayton Legends 60 or 65 team, he will be playing in Dayton. Gary is a LD @ Delco Park.
Small world.
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