https://www.vspdirect.com/softball/welcome?utm_source=softball&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=partner

 
SIGN IN:   Password     »Sign up

Message board   »Message Board home    »Sign-in or register to get started

Online now: 6 members: Astros40s, Papajoe56, ShortStuff28, monsoon1, slugger23, youngen; 293 anonymous
Change topic:

Details for Nancy Allen


Real name:
Nancy Allen

Location:
Indianapolis, IN

Division:
Men's 55

Messages posted by Nancy Allen »Message board home   »Start a new discussion

Oct. 22, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: General and miscellaneous
Discussion: rule of play...please help

Well, Coop, at least you were out playing the game that you love. Sorry that your bat wasn't behaving. With what I call heart rules, no amount of explaining or examples will change a person's mind because they believe something else. You are more than welcome to send him to me, but he probably will not change his mind if he really believes that it is where the fielder is. Only the ball matters. It sounds like Bruce also enjoyed his time with you and your team. At least those ball fields were still there after the hurricane. Panama City did not have as good of luck on that.
Oct. 22, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: Stepping out of the front of the box?

lowprofile, I always did the plate meetings for Coachie. I won't say what tournament we were at because Dave might figure out who the umpire was, but he said if you do this or this, I will call you out. The this that he was doing was kicking the lines away. Most out of the box calls that I have had were stepping on the plate or all of the way in front of it. In the many games that I have done, I have only ever had the one that I described that ran way up in front of the box to go after the pitcher (out of home runs). I would like to believe in senior softball that no one is trying to wipe out a pitcher on purpose. In young guys, you hear them say things like "Buzz the tower" or "Watch your Chiclets" or name your saying that you have heard. I have never heard any batter talk like that in senior softball. I will use the box if one is marked, but if not, I will not pretend that I know exactly where the lines were. I do prefer the box not being marked because we have almost zero issues here without one.
Oct. 22, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: General and miscellaneous
Discussion: rule of play...please help

Coop, this belongs to that set of rules that I call heart rules. You just cannot convince some people about what is correct no matter what you say. So you were causing trouble in Myrtle Beach too? I hope that you had a great hitting weekend.
Oct. 22, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: General and miscellaneous
Discussion: rule of play...please help

lb16, my umpire partner and I ran into this in a state tournament in northern Indiana. He was like, "Watch this". Yes, those umpires actually all believed firmly that it was the position of the fielder, not the ball. I know that a lot of players believe it as well. "Oh, but he's in fair territory." Well, yes, he is, but the ball is not. This is a perfect example of why clinics are important. Unless of course they all learned it consistently wrong in the same clinic.
Oct. 21, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: Stepping out of the front of the box?

Gary, this is my opinion only, but I am inclined to agree with you. Most parks here do not put down batter's boxes, and we have very little trouble here without them. Also in my opinion only, senior softball has even less need of a batter's box because of the fixed strike target.

Txnighttrain, I have tried to explain many times that 21 square feet is huge especially when you consider that it is greater than that because the foot must be completely out to be actually out of the box. The fact that most parks here don't mark batter's boxes has almost completely eliminated those discussions/arguments.

Oct. 21, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: batters box

lowprofile, yes, the rule should be enforced. That being said, if the box is marked, the batters are going to have to be in it and stay in it. Once it is gone, then I am going to only worry about the obvious out of the box calls. I am not going to do the grounds crew work or think that I know the dimensions exactly by guessing. Delaying a game or acting like a jerk is not my nature and certainly not in my contract. Umpires do not need to stir up more controversy than is already present in the game.
Some players get very passionate about thinking that batters are out of the box. I will never be able to change their mind anyway. I go by the principles of common sense and fairness. You look great too.
Oct. 19, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: CHOPPED / TOMAHAWKED BALL

Thanks, guys, I am finding this very informative. They just do not do it here, and I have not run into it in other places that I have been, officiating, playing, or observing.

lowprofile, thank you that is sweet and appreciated. I am actually a widow. Coachie and I were together 28 wonderful years, and he gave me this awesome legacy of softball. So how many kids were you planning on?
Oct. 19, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: batters box

lowprofile, I am pretty much not getting into the out of the box discussions because it belongs to that category of what I call heart rules. Everyone has an opinion, and you just can't change theirs. Rookie umpires in particular get really rattled when players start on them about the possible out of the box on a batter. For me it is always going to get called if the batter steps on the plate or all the way in front of the plate. Remember if they still have 1/10,000th of a cleat in that box (as long as the other foot is not completely out), they are still in the box. I had one really crazy one in league play where she was completely out on the outside of the box, but given that other than the situations above, I have only ever had one that I called in a B World Series years ago. He charged the ball outside the front of the box and tried to hit the pitcher. I called dead ball out immediately. He of course tried to challenge me. So you don't think that I realize that you are out of home runs and trying to hit the middle instead? You are really dealing with the wrong girl, sir. In senior softball I think that walking or running the box is not a great strategy as a with a fixed strike target that a smart pitcher will pitch to the back of that target, causing the batter to over walk their "mark" to effectively hit the ball.

From what we do here in Indiana, my vote would be to stop marking boxes all together. There are people who are probably standing out of it a little to start, but to me a little common sense goes a long way, and we have almost zero problem with the out of the box situation other than the two legitimate examples that I used about.

These are my opinions only.
Oct. 16, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: CHOPPED / TOMAHAWKED BALL

lowprofile, thanks for the discussion. No, in my 31 years of softball, playing, scorekeeping, coaching, umpiring, directing, and sometimes just watching a game with friends and an adult beverage, I have never seen an intentional chop hit. I have had 2 times that I remember very clearly where a batter went after an inside pitch because he had two strikes on him that might have qualified as a chop, but I thought about them but did not call them because he was just trying to get a bat on the ball worrying about a third strike not intentionally chopping. If I ever see someone chopping the ball as a strategy, I am pretty confident that I would call the dead ball out (DBO). I like to think after all of these years that I can recognize situations fairly well. I am thinking that it is just not something that happens here. There are a few other things that I have noticed over the years that I have seen in other parts of the country but not here. The reverse is true as well. I didn't think that you were whining. I hear it a lot on a slap hitter at times. I won't repeat the word that they use about it. You are definitely good with me, and very little makes me mad. I appreciate you having a concern about that. I love to discuss softball because I am passionate about it. We don't learn without discussion. Thank you for the compliments. I like to think that I usually apply common sense in when dealing with situations. I hope that is true.

You look nice too. Thanks.
Oct. 15, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: CHOPPED / TOMAHAWKED BALL

dud, you will probably never find tomahawked in any set of rules. In a day and age where a professional team feels like they have to change their name from Indians, you will never see that word used in any context. The definition is the same as chopped except with the American Indian connotation. There is no difference mechanically.

Garocket, I have about 10 years less umpiring experience than you, most of what you termed young mans' ball. I have never seen a ball chopped intentionally. I have seen what could be considered a chop after someone reacted to what might be strike three. I personally don't get the advantage except for an unorthodox movement on the ball as with what you said a very fast runner. I do know that teams will whine and cry on a good slap hitter, but that is a completely different approach. I am sure that a chop has happened before, or it wouldn't be in all of the rulebooks.

Rick35, I apologize, but I do not agree with your definition of a complete swing. In Indiana, Kentucky, and Tennessee as well as many other states, I have never seen an intentional chop. If I did, I would kill it just as the rulebook says to. Does it happen a lot in Illinois?

B.J., I also have some reservations about the definition of a full swing but am happy with it is not being squared up and without movement like a bunt. You and I have both seen slap hitters. It is very effective to those who know how to do it. You hear lots of flack from the defense including some less than nice names, but he turned his wrists and didn't square up; so it doesn't bother me. It is just a tool that the batter has mastered.


Oct. 15, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Players looking to join a team
Discussion: Looking to hone my skills age 65+

If you click on his member name, it says that he is from Valencia. I do not know that area well enough to state how close that is to Santa Clarita but am guessing that is where he plays softball.
Oct. 14, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: CHOPPED / TOMAHAWKED BALL

BJ, I have never called it or seen it called either. I have seen a few at bats that I thought were more of a downward swing, but I did not think that it was a deliberate chop, just a reaction to already having 2 strikes. The chopped ball is usually bundled with a bunted ball. I have only had that happen once.
Oct. 12, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: General and miscellaneous
Discussion: need a player for Myrtle Beach 55/over (Oct 19-20-20)

tg69, yes, Bruce is such a rookie...maybe to my Coachie. He would be 70 this year. We met Bruce years ago when he played for the Pensacola Hit Men. I actually umpired his game. It was an NSA Senior World Series. Somehow his team found every obscure rule in the book for outs. These friendships last a lifetime.
Oct. 11, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: General and miscellaneous
Discussion: need a player for Myrtle Beach 55/over (Oct 19-20-20)

mck71, you are talking about Myrtle Beach, right? I sent a couple of messages about Panama City Beach, but I have not seen anything back yet. I think that this might be their first year as I don't remember seeing it listed before. Of course my memory is not what it used to be.

Bruce, it's nice to "see" you. Coop was lucky enough to get you? I am his absentee scorekeeper. So we are all on the same team. Hopefully all of our paths will cross again soon.

Good luck, Coop.


Oct. 11, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: General and miscellaneous
Discussion: need a player for Myrtle Beach 55/over (Oct 19-20-20)

Coop, hopefully it is still there when you are supposed to play. Years ago we went to a tournament in Pensacola, and they lost an entire diamond, not damaged but gone right before the event. The ISA Senior Fall World is that same weekend in Panama City Beach. I have not heard yet if that has impacted them.
Oct. 7, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: Is this scenario a force out?

BJ, that was my guess on director. He cringes when I use the term force play. I do the same when he uses base line instead of base path. We can discuss that over an adult beverage some day.
Oct. 7, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: Is this scenario a force out?

BJ, I agree. Our clinics only used the term timing play in regards to whether the run scored or not. So Florida, Indiana 1-1.
Oct. 7, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: Is this scenario a force out?

Ouch, you had to add the director qualification.
Well, if he got to that next bag, and the ball was caught, he had better get back to the previous bag or hope that the umpire didn't notice him leaving early.

I only use he and him because us girls never do any of that when we are playing. ;-)

Only related to force plays, not force outs, I am thinking of all of the runner fiascos that I have seen on infield fly over the years.
Oct. 7, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: Is this scenario a force out?

BJ, exactly. I was always taught in clinics that it is called a force play on a runner getting back to the bag when they leave early before the ball arrives there. A force out can only happen when running bases in the correct order, counter clockwise. I am laughing to myself a little because I watched some friends play backwards bases in a tournament yesterday. You and I have a mutual friend who hates when I call the leaving early a force play. Was anyone else taught that in clinics, or is it just here? Anyway what Turbobob is describing to me is a force play, not a force out.
Oct. 7, 2018
Nancy Allen
Topic: Rules of the game
Discussion: Is this scenario a force out?

lb16, in his defense, there are many expressions that are misused or misunderstood in softball. Force out and force play are just one instance. Other ones that come to mind are base line and base path, interference and obstruction, and four base award and four base error. So I get where he was going.
Older messages »
Senior Softball-USA
Email: info@SeniorSoftball.com
Phone: (916) 326-5303
Fax: (916) 326-5304
9823 Old Winery Place, Suite 12
Sacramento, CA 95827
Senior Softball-USA is dedicated to informing and uniting the Senior Softball Players of America and the World. Senior Softball-USA sanctions tournaments and championships, registers players, writes the rulebook, publishes Senior Softball-USA News, hosts international softball tours and promotes Senior Softball throughout the world. More than 1.5 million men and women over 40 play Senior Softball in the United States today. »SSUSA History  »Privacy policy

Follow us on Facebook

Partners