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Online now: 1 member: TABLE SETTER 11; 44 anonymousDiscussion: Do we pay to play by the hour??
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| April 11, 2016 Adiktiv6 Men's 60 90 posts | Do we pay to play by the hour?? Hey guys, just asking for opinions here. So, I was thinking about this awhile back and here is my question: When a team pays their entry fee for a tournament, do they pay to play by the hour or pay to play by the games? I ask because last time I looked, a game in men's slow pitch softball is a "7 inning game", not a 50, 60, or 70 minute game! With there being a limit on runs in the first 6 innings I can't see there being any 2 hour games (unless the visiting team starts hitting the crap out of the ball in the 7th/open inning, scores 25 runs and the home team has to hit to win). As you can tell, I have a problem with this time limit thing they place on us as they put our hard earned money in their pockets! Hey, there's that $$$$$ in those who control the game issue again!! Anyway, just sayin!! Anyone else? A dik |
| April 11, 2016 1bounce Men's 55 35 posts | Sure you can pplay 2 hr games. Just double your entry fee. 2day tournaments will b at least 3 days. So field rental fees go up. Umpires if doing a 2 hr game...double the price there. Hotels still your staying longer will cost more. So you need to eiher start playing in a baseball league where they last longer or be realistic |
| April 11, 2016 The Screamer5 Men's 60 69 posts | You have to have some type of time limit on the games in a tournament or you would never be able to keep the tournament schedule running in some kind of orderly organized fashion time-wise. A tournament is going to naturally run a little behind schedule anyway as it moves through the day. You can't have game times behind 2, 3, 4 hours or you'll never get it finished. One of the problems I see is the slow pace of the game. I know we as senior players, tend to move a little slower at this stage in our playing days (no offense to anyone)...but to your point Adiktiv6, we need to somehow speed the pace of the game up so more games would actually reach 6 or 7 innings in that allotted 50, 60, or 70 minutes. Most games I've played in at the 50's level might make it to 4 or 5 innings then the open inning. Other games I've seen at some of the older levels are lucky to thru 4 innings plus an opening inning. These are just a few ideas I've heard discussed....starting your At Bat with a 1 - 1 count (with a courtesy). This would force batters to go up to the plate hitting. Now, starting 0 - 0 gives batters time to be very patient and selective. Most really good hitters I've seen and played with will almost always take a strike or two before hitting. Another idea I've heard is making the strike mat a little bigger. This will give some advantage back to the pitcher and also make hitters more apt to swing earlier in their At bats. Lastly I think the some umpires need to do a little better job in "game management." (Getting teams on and off the field and innings started promptly, less time explaining calls, etc., etc.,.... |
| April 12, 2016 OZ40 549 posts | No we do not pay by the hour to play. The entry fee covers all aspects of the tournament, not just the actual games. Right now non-sponsored teams bringing 12 men to a tournament can pay around 30-45 dollars per man to play. With a 5 game guarantee that's around 7-8 dollars per man per game. All other related expenses aside it's a bargain to play the actual games. I can't speak for other sports but try renting just an hour of ice time at your local rink..... I don't necessarily buy the argument that starting the count at 1-1 saves time because not every batter takes the count full every time at bat and yes, I do like to be somewhat selective in my pitch selection when at bat. But if my pitch comes in the first toss I'm swinging. Time would be better saved by BOTH teams hustling on and off the fields between innings. If each team shaves off just 15-20 seconds between innings that can amount to that inning you may be missing. And that hustle shouldn't be up to the umpire, it's up to the players. |
| April 12, 2016 Fred S Men's 85 297 posts | If you really look at it most of the time wasted is between innings. There was a study done (I wish I had kept it) where they played 15 games with and without the 1 and 1 count and the total difference was 15 min. |
| April 13, 2016 Adiktiv6 Men's 60 90 posts | Seriously Bouncy-bounce, have you ever played a 2 hour game in Senior slow pitch softball? Be realistic here!! A dik |
| April 14, 2016 Webbie25 Men's 70 2413 posts | A dik-when I was with Joe Brown's-60 M+-we went to Dalton a few years back and played 3 games in one day and spent over 7 hours on the field, with the long one being a 48-37 loss to Line Drive that took three hours.The others were a 33-24 win and a 38-26 loss-we scored 96 runs in 3 games and went home. Yeah they can happen. |
| April 14, 2016 Joncon 328 posts | """I ask because last time I looked, a game in men's slow pitch softball is a "7 inning game", not a 50, 60, or 70 minute game!""" Where did you look? The rules will specify the time limits. Should there be no time limits? For the sake of one game, of course. That's why the championship games are a full 7 innings. For the sake of the tournament, one game can influence and inconvenience a LOT of other people so there has to be some time structure. |
| April 14, 2016 Joncon 328 posts | And, it's not just a 2 hour game that caused scheduling headaches. A few games that run 15 minutes long create a back up that can turn into an hour really quickly. One game that is ten minutes over can start to snowball. Toward the end of the tourney you have players waiting an extra hour and a half to play their scheduled game. That always makes grumpy old guys happy :) |
| April 14, 2016 BruceinGa Men's 70 3233 posts | The solution for that is to allow more time between games. Many times we are through playing early in the evening when another game or two could have been played. |
| April 14, 2016 Joncon 328 posts | That would be the solution Bruce. I suppose the organizers want to make the game fit in the minimum time slots so they can schedule more games. For the players benefit, they really should schedule around a maximum time. Of course that drags out your waiting time between games so some won't be pleased. To properly address the issue, you would really have to look at the data (if any is compiled) and determine the best time to allot. It's been a while since I've played Senior ball. What is the normal game time? It seems like it was 1.5Hrs? In league ball we get 7 innings in under an hour 95% of the time. |
| April 14, 2016 BruceinGa Men's 70 3233 posts | Joncon, most of the time we see 1 1/2 hrs, sometimes 2 hrs. Our league games are scheduled 1 hr apart with each game 55 minutes with the open inning after the time expires. I believe Tuesday evening with games scheduled 7, 8 and 9pm, the last game probably ended around 11. In my opinion another way to speed up games is to increase hr limits. Now after the max hrs are walks. If hrs would be increased the innings would end sooner (except for the open inning, lol). |
| April 14, 2016 Jawood Men's 50 943 posts | A 1 and 1 count would shave about 8-10 minutes off of standing around watching batter's take 3-4 pitches and allow us to get that last inning in most of the time. |
| April 14, 2016 Duke Men's 65 908 posts | A 1-1 count is the best solution to get the 7th inning in. A little hustle in and off the field wouldn't hurt either. Have your courtesy runners ready in advance too, or no courtesy runners allowed. JMHO, Andy Smith 65 Major |
| April 15, 2016 BruceinGa Men's 70 3233 posts | I propose to start each batter with a 2-2 count, better yet lets just play one pitch. Why the rush to play faster? |
| April 15, 2016 Perl 212 posts | Watched the young guys playing the HOF dual last night. They play seven innings games. They have no time limits They have no 5 runs an inning limit Thier HR limits range from 8 to 16 depending on classification match ups Playing 7 Inning games is possible and should be the norm but seniors have been programmed to except the 5 or 6 inning games. If the young guys in the Conference can get in 7 innings it makes no sense why seniors can't. |
| April 15, 2016 Lester 5 posts | never understood why 7 innings was so important. I think at our age games that last an hour and a half is plenty. especially if you happen to play three or more games. Between batting practice and games we are spending 5-6 hours on the field. That's a good day |
| April 15, 2016 BruceinGa Men's 70 3233 posts | Lester, do you play golf? Have you ever played 36 or 45 holes in one day? Probably not, you left after 9 holes. |
| April 16, 2016 Webbie25 Men's 70 2413 posts | Bruce, you are too much. But you are right. I bowled a perfect game last week, but I stopped in the 7th frame. Does it count? Lester, you are right that it is a good day. but it sure feels better to finish the full 7 innings. On the other hand, if we just play for an hour and a quarter, maybe we can play 8 innings. |
| April 16, 2016 BruceinGa Men's 70 3233 posts | Wow, lol. I wonder what someone with that mindset would say if they lost their first game in Vegas and had to play 8 or 10 to battle their way back to the championship game. :D) |
| April 17, 2016 Lester 5 posts | Bruce Actually I dont play much golf but when I do 18 holes is fine. Perhaps because I get as many strokes in as a normal golfer would get in 36. And actually you make a good point about battling back through the losers bracket. If you had to play 3 hour 7 inning games there wouldn't be that many teams that could make it back. Again Im not so sure what is so special about 7 innings when the game has already been altered so much. Are you in favor of the 5 run rule because it gets you closer to 7 innings? Would you like to see a rule change to 2 outs an inning to get the magic 7 innings in? |
| April 17, 2016 Joncon 328 posts | Lester does raise some very good points there so, I'm going with him. We do play by the hour (or hour and a half). |
| April 17, 2016 DCPete 409 posts | Since you're only allowed 5 or 7 runs per inning, it's only fair to play 7 innings so a team that falls behind early has a chance to catch up without having to score 10 or 15 runs in the open inning. |
| April 17, 2016 BruceinGa Men's 70 3233 posts | Lester, I'm what I call a softball purest. I believe in 7 innings, unlimited runs per inning, unlimited homeruns, 4 balls, three strikes, no (or limited) courtesy runners and no classes or divisions. I'm having to rethink this as we get older. I'd be happy with 10 year age groups, 40-50, 51-60 etc. I also think the extra home plate is a needed modification for seniors. I don't like AA, AAA, Major or Major Plus. Back to the loser's bracket. If you or your team never played more than two or three games (5-6 hours at the ball park)how could you expect to do well if you had to play 5 or more games in a day. I don't know you or your level of play but if you are happy to play league or a couple of 5 inning games a day more power to you (pun intended). I hope you enjoy your season. Bruce |
| April 17, 2016 Lester 5 posts | Bruce, That would be nice and I remember those days . However, I also remember starting my 5:pm game at midnight as well as tournaments ran behind all the time. I guess what I'm saying is, as long as there are time limits the number of innings doesnt really matter to me. In one of the leagues I play in we get an hour and 10 minutes and can play up to 9 innings. Some games go 9 innings, some 7 and some 5. When I'm done i dont know that I've played more softball in the 9 inning game than the 5 inning game since I played softball for an hour and ten minutes in both games. |
| April 17, 2016 The Screamer5 Men's 60 69 posts | Wouldn't the goal be to get in as many of the seven innings in whatever the time allotted as possible...? As a competitor, I want my team to have as many offensive opportunities as possible. I've only been playing senior ball a few years, so maybe my mindset is a little different. I just want to see more games go longer than 4 or 5 innings if possible and anything we do to speed up the pace of play can't be a bad thing. And I beg to differ...starting with a 1 - 1 count does make hitters be a little more aggressive at the plate and would speed the game up significantly in my opinion. |
| April 18, 2016 Webbie25 Men's 70 2413 posts | Hey, Bruce-again you and I are on a similar page. I would change the 10 year to 8 year age groups to 74. I wonder if SSUSA would consider offering 1 tourney a year where we did play those old style rules with just a couple small variances from today's game. Lets play with non-carbon fiber or double wall bats-like my old Steele's Bat or Louisville 38 oz bats, and play on 275 fences. Or maybe even wood bats on 250 fences. We could put together non-sanctioned teams for this one tourney with no restrictions. Call it a 'Retro' tourney. there are similar tourneys out there locally now. |
| April 18, 2016 Pgh Yinzer Men's 60 27 posts | I know Yinz are all old guys but if Yinz would hustle in & off the field, no pitches between innings and have 1st batter ready to go there should be np get 7 innings played.. I ump a lot of senior games and play so I know what I speak of.. Also as an ump for the pittance they pay us it's not in our best interest to be doin 2 hr games.. the powers to be don't want to pay us what we're worth but they want us to be the guy in the middle to keep all Yinz happy.. Just my .02.. KEEP PLAYN THE GAME WE ALL ENJOY IN OUR GOLDEN YEARS ... |
