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Online now: 7 members: JGSoftballer, JohnO28, Selfish, TABLE SETTER 11, emugica30, mello24, tg69; 85 anonymousDiscussion: 2017 Significant Rule Changes - Penalty for non-compliance
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| Jan. 16, 2017 Steve in Tucson Men's 70 22 posts | 2017 Significant Rule Changes - Penalty for non-compliance §8.4(1) • BATTER‐RUNNER REACHING FIRST BASE The last line states "The defending player has only the white base, in fair territory, to make the putout; his touch of only the bag in foul territory will not result in an out." Question: If the defensive player's foot slides onto the line separating the two bases and touches both, is the batter-runner out or safe? §8.5(5) • COURTESY RUNNER OFFICIALLY IN THE GAME A courtesy runner must report to, and be acknowledged by, the umpire. A courtesy runner is in the game when he touches the base… We have the problem in our association play of players not reporting to the umpire or doing so after they get to the base. Question: What is the penalty for not reporting and being acknowledged by the umpire? |
| Jan. 16, 2017 SSUSA Staff 3490 posts | Steve ... In response to your questions: [1] SAFE • "If there is a play on a batter‐runner going to first base, the batter‐runner must touch some portion of the double bag extending into foul territory. He will be called out if he fails to do so, except if, in the umpire's judgment, the batter‐runner is avoiding a collision. The batter‐runner simultaneously touching both portions of the double bag is permitted." ... This clarification was made because there were multiple instances of umpires erroneously calling a batter-runner out simply because he touched the white bag ... The only obligation imposed by this rule on the batter-runner is that they touch the orange bag ... We added the "some portion" and "simultaneous" language to make this easier to call correctly and be understood by everyone ... [2] OUT • "A courtesy runner must report to, and be acknowledged by, the umpire. A courtesy runner is in the game when he touches the base…" The National Rules Committee discussed, but decided against, implementing specific language as to the timing of this call due to the common circumstance that a lot of things may he happening simultaneously ... However, we would rule that a CR failing to report will be illegal and subject to an appeal out call after play has been resumed by the first pitch to the next batter ... Hope this helps! ... |
| Jan. 16, 2017 B.J. 1106 posts | Steve, I think Staff mis-read your question on the defensive player ( Question: If the defensive player's foot slides onto the line separating the two bases and touches both, is the batter-runner out or safe? ) if the defensive players foot happens to slide onto both bags and the throw beats the B/R he is out and Staff I have a question on your answer to part (2) if the CR fails to report in and the error is not caught until after the 1st pitch isn't he still in jeopardy to being called out on appeal if he is illegal.. Rule 8.5(5) An illegal courtesy runner on base is committing a continuing violation and may be called out upon appeal at any time while on base or, if he scores,prior to the first pitch to the next batter... |
| Jan. 16, 2017 SSUSA Staff 3490 posts | Yep, the mis-read allegation is correct! ... The defensive player can only record an out by touching the white bag in fair territory ... But analogous to the batter-runner situation, the defender MUST touch the white bag, but there is no automatic "safe" call if he touches both bags simultaneously during the put out ... So long as he touches white while in possession of the ball, and before the batter-runner reaches first base, you've got an out ... AFTER the batter-runner becomes a base runner, the double bag is a "unified" single base for all calls .. See: Rulebook §8.4(1) ... And "YES" to your follow-up question ... An illegal CR is an ongoing violation that may be challenged at any time while that CR is on base, or, if he scores, prior to the first pitch to the next batter ... See Rulebook §8.5(5) ... |
| Jan. 16, 2017 B.J. 1106 posts | Staff....brb headed to the dictionary (analogous) lol |
| Jan. 16, 2017 Q19 Men's 65 81 posts | "Steve in Tucson" - I touched white in two separate plays last year on close plays at first and was not called out. Both umpires saw that if I went to orange, I would've COLLIDED with the fielder (going after badly thrown balls) on both instances. Bottom line, I try to avoid contact at first at all times due to the over-57 condition of my body internals and parts. |
| Jan. 16, 2017 SSUSA Staff 3490 posts | That's funny B.J.! • The rule is really pretty simple: The batter-runner must touch the orange base to be safe, and the defender must touch the white to record an out ... And either of them touching both portions simultaneously [◄ sorry about that big word!] does NOT change those calls ... Q19's fact pattern is the umpire's judgment "exception" to the batter-runner having to touch orange ... |
| Jan. 16, 2017 Dbax Men's 65 2101 posts | Wow Q! I thought you were much older. Banned in Arizona |
