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Online now: 3 members: TABLE SETTER 11, fitzy, kotonk; 86 anonymousDiscussion: What is the call? Fair or Foul
| Posted | Discussion |
| April 11, 2017 gonz 51 posts | What is the call? Fair or Foul what happens if a batter hits a ball that is going to be a foul ball but close to the fair line. If the defender let the ball hit the ground it will be a foul ball, but what if the defender is standing on the foul ball side of the line and tries to catch the ball and it hits his glove and lands on the fair ball line side? Is this a fair ball? I am assuming that it is fair. thanks Sherwin Gonzales Hawaiians #35 |
| April 11, 2017 SSUSA Staff 3485 posts | The "fair or foul ball" determination is made solely by reference to where the ball is in relation to the foul line (extended vertically like the plane of a football goal line) at the moment it is first touched by the defensive player, regardless where it first touches the ground ... Your fact pattern includes a statement that: "..If the defender let the ball hit the ground it will be a foul ball.." seems to indicate that it was over foul territory when first touched ... If so, this is a foul ball ... |
| April 14, 2017 stick8 1991 posts | Based in your description it is a foul ball. The call is based on where the ball is touched. |
| April 14, 2017 gonz 51 posts | ok, so what happen is the defender is straddling the line. One leg in fair territory and one on the foul side. Ball is close to the line. Can't really determine if it will be foul or fair. Defender tries to catch it hits their glove but it lands foul. I guess this would be a judgement call for the umpire as the moment of first touch wouldn't be determined. thanks Sherwin Gonzales Hawaiians #35 |
| April 14, 2017 DaveDowell Men's 70 4312 posts | gonz ... Changing the facts from saying initially it would fall foul, to now saying it can't be determined, is only going to do one thing: It makes your first hypothetical irrelevant ... HOWEVER, the rule we stated and as affirmed by stick8 remains the same: Where was the ball in relation to the foul line, inside our outside of fair territory IN THE AIR at the time it was first touched? ... That is the only thing that matters ... If the umpire can't determine that, our best suggestion for you is to get another umpire for the next game ... |
| April 14, 2017 k man Men's 65 326 posts | Umpire judgment call, 1 team will be happy with the call, the other team will be upset with the call. Let's go to the video tape. |
| April 14, 2017 DaveDowell Men's 70 4312 posts | Absolutely true K man ... This call is guaranteed to have EXACTLY a 50% approval rating, regardless of which way it was ruled! |
| April 14, 2017 gonz 51 posts | sorry guys, I didn't mean to change the facts. I was changing the situation. It was meant to be if something different happened. sorry about the confusion. I guess like you all stated. It would be where the ball was at the time of touch but if that can't be determined it would be a judgement call. Sherwin Gonzales Hawaiians#35 |
| April 14, 2017 DaveDowell Men's 70 4312 posts | gonz ... It's a judgment call by definition ... The umpire's judgment call is simple: Which side of the line was the ball on when touched? ... Outside the line = FOUL, inside the line = FAIR ... It's not a "mental coin toss" exercise for him ... |
| April 14, 2017 titanhd Men's 60 638 posts | Simpy put. "the ball plays itself" |
| April 15, 2017 lb16 Men's 60 196 posts | It is really very simple it is always were the ball is in relation to fair foul line. Were the player's position is has no bearing on call ever! |
| April 15, 2017 stick8 1991 posts | Let's change this a bit. Fly ball is hit deep down the left field line. Left fielder is at the fence, the ball hits his glove in fair territory but then goes over the fence in foul territory. What is your call??????? |
| April 15, 2017 Clean Up 68 posts | "the ball hits his glove in fair territory" I believe you answered your own question! |
| April 15, 2017 DaveDowell Men's 70 4312 posts | stick8 ... In baseball, and maybe softball, too, I've got a dead ball and a two-base award (ground rule double) ... Major League Rule 5.05(a)(9) basically says: If a fielder in fair territory deflects a fly ball into the stands into foul territory, you have a ground-rule double. |
| April 15, 2017 B.J. 1105 posts | Dave I see the rule you posted.... I guess deflecting off the glove is different than off the head of the O/F ...they awarded Carlos Martinez a home run when his batted ball deflected of Jose Canseco's head and over the fence.....one of his better fielding plays |
| April 15, 2017 B.J. 1105 posts | forgot to add....in softball it is considered a 4 base award |
| April 15, 2017 B.J. 1105 posts | SORRY....didn't pick up on the part of ball going into foul territory.... then it would depend on if the ball went over the fence in the air in fair territory and then landed foul...this would be a 4base award...but if it hit off his glove in fair territory then bounced foul and out of play it is a ground rule double |
| April 15, 2017 DaveDowell Men's 70 4312 posts | B.J. ... I still think it's a two-base award/ground rule double, despite the bizarre flight plan amendment for the ball that you created for stick8's fairly simple hypothetical! ... [grins] |
| April 16, 2017 B.J. 1105 posts | Dave, which bizarre flight plan that I made up...lol... I agreed with you that if after the deflection the ball went foul yes 2 base award... but are you saying that it doesn't matter if the ball after the deflection goes over the wall in fair territory and lands foul its still a 2 base award? |
| April 16, 2017 DaveDowell Men's 70 4312 posts | If the ball leaves the field of play in fair territory, like from a deflection by the outfielder in the corner, that curves around the back of the fair/foul pole, I have a HR (baseball) or 4-base-award (softball) ... |
| April 16, 2017 stick8 1991 posts | Dave is correct, it is a two base award. It's akin to a ball going out of play. |
