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Discussion: STOP PLAYING ASA & ISA.

Posted Discussion
May 15, 2004
STONEMAN
Men's 50
535 posts
STOP PLAYING ASA & ISA.
As SENIOR's we do have power. The problem is that only a few men will stand up & run w/ the ball. Ridge & Terry, do a great job listening to SENIOR's. ASA & ISA, r ran by UMP's that do not like SENIORS..... PERIOD. I have been told by a STATE U.I.C. & other UMP's that players like me ruin the game. That senior's have funkie rules; want to hit hot balls & use hot bats; can not play defense; & need to learn how to hit behind the runner; & learn the game.
As long as SENIOR's play in ASA & ISA, w/ their stupid atitudes & rule, SENIOR's will have no one to blame but, our selfs. When HOME RUNS r outs & or ends the inning, something needs to be done. PERIOD... Why, do the different softball orginaztions
have the different Classes?
Because UMP's r lazy; do not want to work more than an hour; & r unhappy w/ the pay; can't make a good living w/ out softball; why, don't they quit if, they don't like the rules; etc.
Changes need to be made, on both side of the line...... PERIOD.
May 17, 2004
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
606 posts
Your concerns are valid, but as a long time umpire especially of seniors, I take offense to being called lazy, etc. I will stay with you on the field as long as you want. This is my "hobby", not my career, and I spent an entire weekend without compensation here in Indy to work with our umpires to learn the rules and to make them appreciate that every time could be our last at bat; so players like you could have the games called well by our rules. These games are precious to us that have been lucky enough to live and play this long. Also we went to a Florida Half Century tournament in February, and they use ISA umpires who were very courteous and knowledgeable in the game, Also ISA did allow seniors to use the Ultra II, but they did not allow it for the youngsters. I would also remind you that the gentleman that owns ISA is a part owner in SSWC (SSUSA). Our umpires here in Indy (we are sanctioned NSA at Midwest) hustle, try to know our rules, and are courteous to our players. I am also an ASA umpire and do not turn bad when I do those games. So maybe you just need a good UIC like me because I have met very few umpires that were just out to screw the players, although I have found some. I suggest you umpire in the hot sun and tell me that I am lazy and don't care after that. I would be curious to know where (what state) you think all of these bad umpires exist because no one is making a living calling games. Many of us do it for the love of the game and could do without your lack of constructive criticism. Thanks.
May 17, 2004
Legends 11
44 posts
You go Girl!!
May 17, 2004
STONEMAN
Men's 50
535 posts
NANCY: What is yer E-MAIL.
2nd, the UMP in question is an ASA UMP & STATED that he was the ISA's U.I.C. 4 Nv. Vegas, has several very poor UMP's. 2 of them have walked off the fields during games & do nothing but, bad mouth SENIORS. These men should not be UMP's. I was talking to the Nv. State Rep., Joey, when this jerk ran his mouth.
The other clown brags about walking off playing fields,; tells everyone that he is caring a gun in his bag; & has stated several times that he will decide which rules will be inforced; etc. I do not understand why these 2 men still r allowed to be UMPs. Yes Bill R., is part owner of ISA & SSUSA. As long as Umps like this r around, I will not want to play when 'they' take the field. 1 ump, last yr. started a race riot. She still is umping. LAST POINT, UMP'S like these 2-4 persons w/ their atitudes & disrespect is not good 4 the game. How can players get these 'jerks' off the field.
May 18, 2004
ISAWRVP
2 posts
ISA has always supported senior softball and will always continue to do so. Opinions are just that and Mr. Stone is entitled to his. The incident that he is refering to happened at the ISA Easton Challenge Men's "D" N.I.T. where he was told he would not be able to use his Miken as he had altered the bat with Tape around the barrel. He, went in to an uproar, saying that now umpire was going to tell him he couldn't use his $300.00 bat he didn't give a $%#@ what the rules were. Now as far as the Umpire, he was wrong in stereo typing senior ball or senior ball players in the way he did and has been told about it. I would not repeat nor would I disgrace this forum with the letter forwarded to the National Office by Mr. Stone. If there is any misrepresentation of an association it would be the manner in which Mr. Stone represents the seniors. I have personally worked around and with the seniors for several years and have never seen that kind of display of disrespect for authority nor that kind of language used in a public forum. As far as any ISA umpires ever walking off a field in the west it has never happened and if it were to happen that official would not be working for ISA. ISA officials have not officiated at any senior games in over a year and the only games we have done is for SSUSA at Russel Rd last year. We had no complaints then and I'm sure if we do games in the future we will not have complaints then. We strive to offer continuing training for our umpire staff and
Quarterly certification of officials. For the good of senior softball I hope that Mr. Stone does not reflect the new seniors on the rise.

Sincerely
Lance Boyer
ISA Western Region V.P.
viperfx@cox.net
May 19, 2004
STONEMAN
Men's 50
535 posts
LANCE, get the fact right. That ump was out of line. I was talking to the director. This man has been rude more than once to me. In the futher, I will not speak to him or play when he umps. I tried to explain why the tape was there. Many players tape the ends to protect the bat from Umps & players that will throw these bats. This ump would not let me finish my statement & said the rude things about seniors & to me. What I said & sent to the NATIONAL OFFICES is the way that I feel.
May 19, 2004
ISAWRVP
2 posts
I'm sure that there are many seniors that tape there bats but in ISA it is considered an altered bat. I do have my facts straight I was the one standing there . You came up and had your bat in your hand and showed me where you taped it and told me why. I also told you that it is considered an altered bat by our rule book in fact in all associations in the adult program it is considered the same. The umpire you are so mad at has umpired in several senior worlds and has never had a complaint. I know you think you should be able to do what you want with your bats but if you feel that umpires kick or do what ever you say to your bat why don't you just slide it toward your dugout after you hit or toss it to one of your players then no official would have to kick it out of the way. The soulution is an easy one , follow the rules. ISA is great association and does not deserve your comments just because you are mad at an official, director or any staff that are just doing there job. You generalize and request that others who love the game stop playing it, how petty.

Lance Boyer
ISA Western Region VP
May 19, 2004
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
606 posts
Well, it sounds like this is hopefully an isolated incident. I officiated ISA games for two years, but unfortunately never any senior games. I know that the umpires in the Florida Half Century were all very well suited to officiating our games. Sometimes things happen between the lines as our team learned last year in South Bend that need to be re-evaluated off of the field. If you want to contact me, give me a call at 317-510-3435, or leave me an E-mail address, and I will contact you. It sounds like this situation needs a little risk mitigation, or there is a potential for future incidents if all of these bad feelings still exist. To me seniors are the best games anyone could ever officiate.
May 21, 2004
cpope
Men's 60
160 posts
I am a senior and have played every year from 1965 to present. All assoistations and differant type/style umps. Disagreed with many but have only seem 1 upm in all them years that was out to ruin the game. Umps make mistakes, the players do also. It is not the end of the world. Abide by the rules.
March 1, 2005
rayray
Men's 40
10 posts
Ray Cowart, Texas ISA state director. I want to say 1st let one of my umpires say one negative thing about senior softball and watch how fast I set him straight. I'm making this the first rule for all softball. We as an assoiation are here for everyone that plays ISA softball in Texas, I want to keep the rules for the players. All types of players need diffrent rules and all players want touse the best ball and bat available. I will make sure that that happens. This is my first year off of probation and Chet gave me the task of making Texas the best ISA state in the great USA. All the players out there that know me I have played from the lower ranks to the Highest ranks. I'm also one of the best business men in softball. My personality will not ever let me fail. I will need a ton of directors to help me run this new assosiciation I will make this happen for all in Texas. Check out my websight and let me know what ya want www.texasisasoftball.com I have a few tournaments for seniors as we speak. My only requirement in Texas isa is that everyone has fun.raycowart aka rayray
March 2, 2005
jah#4
Men's 55
551 posts
We have played ISA ,ASA, and most of the rest. All the world tourney we have played in the Umpires and been pros at what they do. I have to say the best of the lot is the SPA ,Ridge seems to have the best of the best. In some tourney lat in the brackets you might see a umpire say or do something, but you have to think does the player do the same when they get tired. You have to think about Seniors , we have all played along time and we stay up with the rules maybe as good or better than some of the younger umpires. That why the UIC and the TD have final say when they have rule protests like the one we had in the ISA Winter World. They worked together and everyone was happy with the rule outcome
March 3, 2005
STONEMAN
Men's 50
535 posts
Common since, leave well enough alone. A few wks ago, I were play' in a new league. The director of this cities sport program is a young ball player. This man, can deciede what the rules will be, if, not, another ASSOC. can be used. The players wanted 6 h.r's. The league started w/ 6 HOME RUNS. The 2nd wk one of this state problem UMPs would not let us play w/ 6. ( This is one of the 3 ASA UMPs that tried to sue LVSSA & LOST.) Also, this Ump was not doing an ASA league & ASA UMPs will no longer do LVSSA events. During the game the field director corrected this know it all UIC & the 2nd game was played w/ 6 h.r's. As this great UIC, told the team managers, 6 h.r's. r 4 'B 'league & this is not a 'B' league, ETC, ETC.

The next night another UMP in this same organ' after the 1ST inning changed the HOME RUN limits. This was a new SENIOR 40 & over league.
Since VEGAS, has a group of nice UMPs & I am the only jerk on this planet, I must leaen & listen to these great UMPs & learn to hit to right field (even when pitchers pitch me inside) & learn bat control. Bat control, hit the ball EZ, hit the ball behind the runner, etc. U, now, learn the game. Thanks, @ 55, I really need UMPs to tell me how 2 play.

March 4, 2005
Proudtex40
57 posts
Stoneman: It's extremely frustrating when you find inconsistency within your local leagues and I believe most of us have experienced the same type of frustrations. Although I'm just starting my third year of senior softball (but my 33rd year of playing slowpitch softball), I've played in most of the senior national tournaments with Fergie's and Damon's over the past two seasons and my experience has been very positive (with the umpiring.) In my opinion (this is key since we all have an opinion), the overall umpiring has been consistent, fair, and I've noticed that the older umps have as much fun as the players. I've even joked with an umpire when he made the wrong call and later stated to me (in private) that he probably made the wrong call. I think the only reason he admitted that he made the wrong call was because I initially told him I thought he blew the call, but didn't make a scene or stay on him for it. I believe umps can make a wrong call or decision just as we, as players, make errors and have some major brain cramps. I'm certainly guilty of doing both, but now I can blame them on getting old. : ) I'm just thankful that I still have my health and have the opportunity just to be on the field and participate. I've been fortunate to play at all levels (from Class B to Major Plus) and even played on 10 national championship teams, but playing in the senior's the past two season has been the most fullfilling. Hopefully, your experience will be more positive for you this season.
Steve Shannon
March 4, 2005
biggeorge
Men's 60
25 posts
Thanks for sharing with me the fact that I am hated by ASA and ISA umps due to my status as a senior. I will take the appropriate steps to protect my wife and family.
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