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Discussion: As a AA or AAA team would you police yourself when adding players

Posted Discussion
July 30, 2008
Lecak
Men's 55
1012 posts
As a AA or AAA team would you police yourself when adding players
I'm reading alot about ratings and wondered once you got the rating you felt as a team you deserved would you then say no to the Major/Major plus who suddenly might get dropped into your lap. Or as a 50 team a new fresh 49 year old who falls under the rating category because he hasn't played yet but shows great talent. Would you say no we are a AA or AAA team or would you grab them and compete. Until this is self policed I wouldn't take Terry's or for that matter any of these directors places. Somebody has got to make a decision. If you honestly can't answer the above questions I wouldn't want a group of players judging my team.
July 30, 2008
Duke
Men's 60
729 posts
Lecak,

As a misrated Major team at the moment, we have turned down 2-3 Major players asking to play with us. They want to play with us, if we stay in Majors. We are a 55AAA team, regardless of where Mr. Hennessey rates us. As I said before, we are not a Major team, AND I will not boot players off the team, just to satisfy Mr. Hennessey. Even if players left, I would not pick up Major players and compete at the AAA level. I know teams have one or 2 Major players on their AAA team, but that is not what we are all about. I do not think one Major player at the AAA level will make a huge difference. No Major players should be on any AA team. Why would they want to be anyways with the limitation on home runs?

Andy Smith,
Double Nickels,
AKA: Base Hawgs,
Manager
July 30, 2008
Lecak
Men's 55
1012 posts
Andy your to be commended. The only way a Major or Major Plus talent would probably filter into the lower divisions is when they first start playing. There are some really good 48-49 year old guys bubbling under they could land anywhere. My question is really at the teams who can pick these guys up.
July 30, 2008
taits
Men's 65
4403 posts
Lecak,
Question(s), In just how many tournaments will a guy play in then get labeled as a major or M+ player. One qualifier or another Ring type, Local assn.?
I really think the only thing teams want is a written check list (as it were) as to why or why not a team was moved up or down. There is NOTHING.
July 30, 2008
Lecak
Men's 55
1012 posts
Taits hope all is well. I bet for every team that is screwed on their upper rating there is an equal team getting away with some stuff. My understanding on move up is win one of the tournies listed as an automatic bump up so be it. All else you get a wizard of oz behind the curtain thing. Moving a team up mid year after making them conform to the appropriate roster levels and then moving them up because they have a run differential of X runs that is kind of weak. My original question will teams police themselves? My opinion only there should be an impact player list and it probably doesn't need to be to long.
July 30, 2008
Ken
Men's 55
462 posts
Lecak,
That is a good question. If a team feels that they have been rated wrong, they might want to pick up players to compete in the upper rated division. But if they were moved back to where they belong, what would they do with the new guys? It would help if the staff at SSUSA would be more proactive in answering questions from the teams that are affected by this.

Also, I for one wouldn't mind being judged by my fellow players if they were serving on some kind of advisory board or ratings commission. SSUSA won't go to the TD's for help in this. All they care about is run differential. We had to ask TD's to call and email themselves. We need to get something like this ratings commission going if we hope to get teams rated right. And they have to be people that actually see the teams play. And it would work both ways. The teams staying in the wrong division, for whatever reason, couldn't duck the ratings commission, and would get moved up where they belong.
July 30, 2008
taits
Men's 65
4403 posts
Joe:
If it's anything like the agencies (law enforcement) no they really do not share the info as they should not do things the same. No two "policing" methods would be the same, so the results would differ ot team ratings
Just like the major assn's now, all different with no standardized written accounting to guide them. So my answer would be; yes, but not well done if done. Having different methods for doing a move for different tournaments is not fair either. Fing one method set it to print and try it.
I would think a Mgr ot whom ever is appointed would be honored to participate, but should nopt do that which he may have a comflict with... This appointment must have authority to make decisions or a vote if a vote is part of it. More thabn just a this is what is going on, here are suggestiuons to try to fis the problem we see.
By the way, me well yes but your the one who had a scare...Glad all is well.
I had it a year ago this month...not fun.

Any thing about anything will bring about conjecture.
July 31, 2008
breeze53
Men's 55
40 posts
Guys, the best way to police teams, are the tournament directors. When you have a sanction tournament from any assocation, and a team, lets say a AA team thats hit 5 or more HRs { like what I heard that when on in Champaign,Illinois} the director should have the power to move that team up to AAA or Major immediately. I just think that teams policing themselves is a dream. As for teams that are misrated, they played themselves in to that position and they should play themselves out of their position. Bob
July 31, 2008
Corky
Men's 55
449 posts
I've been playing senior ball for over 6 yrs now and have seen everything from the "win at all cost" and "if your not cheating your not trying", to the genuine "just let us compete at our true skill level teams"'. It would be ideal if every team took the latter attitude. BUT we all know that's not the way it is. Lets be honest. Any team in need of a player is going to try to find the best player available. With that said the question I have is what really determines a "Teams" skill level? Is it HRs or amount of runs scored?
Our team doesn't hit many HRs but our goal is to score at least 20 runs a game and we are usually successful when we do. So where should we be rated? In my opinion the only way to reasonably rate teams, is to have people with good knowledge of the game observe each game, at each level (provided there are enough teams in the division) and report to ssusa staff as to their skill level, by pre-determined criteria set forth by a panel of their peers (players).
Just my 2 or maybe 3 cents worth "Keep on Playin"
July 31, 2008
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
616 posts
Breeze53, Terry was in Champaign two years ago and moved a AA team up to AAA in the middle of the tournament. They were not hitting a lot of homeruns, but they were well outscoring other teams in the bracket. They were a team that had always been 500 against Coachie's team; so I did not think that they should have been bumped then, but it may have been appropriate this time. I watched the championship and the if game in the 55AA/AAA this year in Champaign. Holding both teams to AA rules would have helped (even though that is usually to help the lower rated team instead of the higher), but also if the 2 AA rated teams had been made to play best 2 out of 3 in the tournament like the 60 Majors did, then the AAA teams would not be on here as upset as they are about either of the AA rated teams. I think that tournament directors usually try to be fair, but hind site is always better than when you are in the middle of the situation.
July 31, 2008
JOHN BOB
Men's 60
76 posts
After 13 years of senior ball the biggest problem I have seen is the criteria for moving a team from Major to Major+ is the same as being moved from one of the other division's. I feel there is a hugh difference between M & M+. We won ISA world last year as a Major team there were a total of 5 teams 2 were AAA . The team we beat in finals was better than us but they played 4 games on 2rd day of tourney we played one & in the if game our SS turned a triple play. Anyway it took us half of this year to get re-rated back to M having to give 5 run's to M teams and getting our tail's kicked by Travellodge the only 55M+ team in this area. We wasted a good chance to qualify for TOC plus played in a couple of 2 team Tourney's. Also AA is our lowest division and in the young guys division E or D a HR is a OUT I feel this should be the case in senior AA
July 31, 2008
Corky
Men's 55
449 posts
hey Nancy
i believe your talkin about the 50AAA and not 55AAA. If I'm wrong you can spank me LOL that was for Billy W. Bo's got a cold one for ya in St. Louis
July 31, 2008
Corky
Men's 55
449 posts
BTW we're doin a tune up game at Metro at 6:30 tonight and Bo's buyin
July 31, 2008
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
616 posts
Corky, you are so right. It is hard typing that zero after typing five so much, or maybe it was just to protect the innocent. I am hoping that we get over there to see you play. You will really like the complex, and your division was very strong last year. I think that you would have done well there in 2007; so good luck with 2008.

John Bob, I was glad to see your team moved back down. I have watched a few of your games this year (some a little closer than others), and I feel your team is Major on good days. The only thing that I disagree with you on is that I think that with age comes a little privilege; so I think that an over the fence ball should never be an out in seniors, even if it is only for a single. This also helps keep some hitters out of the middle. The other problem that I have noticed in Major and Major Plus ratings is that as teams get older, there are generally less teams in their divisions, and they get moved up when they are no better than when they were younger just because they won the wrong tournament or had a good weekend.

Good luck to all in Missouri and North Carolina this weekend.
July 31, 2008
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
616 posts
Corky, I will be at Charney tonight, but usually on Thursdays, I am like a moth when I see the lights at Metro on the way home, and if you are still there tonight, I will certainly take advantage of Bo's generosity.
July 31, 2008
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
616 posts
Corky, I will be at Charney tonight, but usually on Thursdays, I am like a moth when I see the lights at Metro on the way home, and if you are still there tonight, I will certainly take advantage of Bo's generosity.
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