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Discussion: Congrats SS-USA on Western Nationals

Posted Discussion
July 26, 2005
Downs
50 posts
Congrats SS-USA on Western Nationals
To the SS-USA staff, field directors, and umpires, congratulations on one of the best tournaments ever. It rained hard Thursday night and the fields were in primo condition on Friday afternoon. Used a revised, 5-inning 1 & 1 schedule and it worked great. Kept on schedule and no complaints heard. There were lots of potential problems regarding eligibility and the staff handled them all with professionalism and extremely good judgement. They listened and was fair in all their applications according to the team managers that were involved. (No, we did not win either the 55's or 65's) but we had good competition and lots of ball. Again, congratulations to all the winners and to the SS-USA and their respective staff. Thanks! Jim
July 26, 2005
MK39
Men's 50
333 posts
Downs
Hi Jim, i met you last year at the ASA Nationals in Salem.
Could you please elaborate a little more in depth about the Eliigibilty issues that happened in Wa. for me. Seems to be a hot topic right now.
Thanks
Mike Kelly Kelly's Sports 50+
July 26, 2005
Hacker
Men's 65
41 posts
Dave, coudn't agree with you more...especially about the field prep after the rain. When I went to the Russell Road complex on Friday morning and saw the infield under an inch of water...I thought no way are we playing today and it looked as if Sat was in jepordy as well...boy was I amazed when I received a call that the games are scheduled for 2PM and to find the fields in very good condition blew me away!!
Great job to the field crew!!

As far as elgibility problems...we had an incident in the Championship game where a new player who hadn't played in the previous round-robin or seeding rounds mysteriously showed up for the championship then disappeared after they won. Fortunately it was our 1st loss and we won the next game...whew!
July 26, 2005
Downs
50 posts
To MK39. Mike, I was not a party to any of the actual complaints or inquiries. What I heard was from the players or managers that played approximately when we did. I played in the 55's and then in the 65's. I did not hear any major complaints and it is my opinion that the issues were addressed in a logical and professional manner as none of the issues, that I am aware of, resulted in any further controversy. Play continued and at least everyone SEEMED satisfied.
The issues I heard were, Snowbird concerns whether they were committed to only one state or playing multiple states. One concern was how a team could qualify if they had not won a tournament to gain a spot in the West. Nationals. It was later learned by the Manager that to qualify a team had to play in at least one qualifier, not win one. Qestioning frozen rosters.
Teams supposedly picking up players at the tournament and adding them to a roster, from a younger age division and higher classification. And whether or not players were required to sign in prior to playing in the tournament. Finally, like I stated, I was not a party to ANY of these discussions, however, the SS-USA staff seemed to address all issues and satisfy those concerned. (Yes, Mike. I really enjoyed our conversations last year at the ASA. We won the 65 Major Plus while you young ones were winning the 50's. Just this week received the awards from ASA for winning their 2004 Nationals) I think I'll stick to playing SSWC and skip ASA . ASA won't even give out their phone number or email address. Jim
July 27, 2005
MK39
Men's 50
333 posts
Downs
Thanks for the reply and update. It was the Snowbird issue i was wndering about if it happened there as well.
It is a bad rule that can't be properly monitered and a rule that needs to go away to keep the peace among us players.
The assocations who grant that status to anyone and everyone is putting the teams against each other as we start to learn who has taken an unfair advantage of the rule and it will escalate more and more as time goes on resulting in confontations betweens teams as well.
Regarding ASA, it was like pulling teeth to get our awards as well. We had to contact ASA headquarters and finally got everything around may.
Always a pleasure Jim, keep having fun, wish i was but i am too involved with making sure my team gets a fair game.
Thanks
Mike Kelly Kelly's Sports 50 =
July 27, 2005
Downs
50 posts
Mike39: quite some time ago I personally gave up on being concerned about the Snowbird issue. It has proven to be a way of life up here in the N/W. There are a large number of players that invoke the Snowbird rule and play in championship play with teams from two states. We see it in many of the teams that exist up here. Play for a team most of the year and play qualifiers and some world or national tournaments with a local team and then go play in some other softball org. championships with an AZ. or CA. team. Honestly, the majority just say to xxxx with it because they are our friends and we just live with it. The powers to be are well aware of what is going on. See ya!!!!
July 27, 2005
mad dog
Men's 65
3948 posts
jim it was nice to put a face to the person who helped me out down here in central cali.we played some good games against each other.good luck in the 65's.there was some problems with guys not playing seeding and showing up for elimination play,also playing in more than one div,but thier ages allowed them to.55's playing 50's and etc.mk good luck with this issue on the snowbirds,i personally do not think it should be,ok u do have people who move south for the winter and they should be able to play locally for the state they are in,but if thier home is more than 6 months up north thats where they should do thier championship play.
July 27, 2005
MK39
Men's 50
333 posts
mad dog & Gary19
They live in there primary redience for 8 months or more of the year.
The majority of legal snowbirds go from a cold northern state down to the warmer souther states in the winter and return back to the northern state in the spring.
They will not practice with there souther national team at all from that point on and just becomae a hired gun to fly in for the big events only.
This is not what the rule was meant to be like at all.
They can play league in both states but the state of primary residence should be the o nly state in which you are allowed to play national level ball other wise like i said before. I can fly the best players in the game to work at my store for 3 months and build a super team.
SSUSA needs to come on here to explain why there are so many protest and issues coming out of the snowbird rule and what if anything do they plan to do about it before there worlds this year. Also i can find anything about a snowbird or dual resindency rule anywhere on the SSUSA which allows them to just make it up as they go it they want to????
IMO
Thanks
Mike Kelly Kelly's Sports 50+
July 27, 2005
MK39
Men's 50
333 posts
Gary19
SSUSA and quite a few other senior softball organazations have determined that open regions is not what they want for senior softball as years ago super teams were built with money sponsors who flew players in from all over the country.
They have now set in place a geogragical border rule that only permits the state that the majority of players reside in to be the home state and from there they can only pick up players from the most direct bordering state to them. Excpet of course Ca. and Fl. who they ruled to be stand alone states and can not pick up any one from outside of either state.
That being said is why a guy who wants to really play on a national team from outside of his region simplu claims to be a snowbird and gets himself flown in for the worlds only.
I hope this helps. it is complicated and would bve a lot simpler if they just made it the same for everyone and just let us play real softball like we used to.
IMO
Thanks
Mike Kelly Kelly's Sports 50 +
July 29, 2005
Downs
50 posts
MK, Mad Dog, Gary: sorry for the delay but had to fly down to OR. for a funeral. My wife's uncle. Now, MK, if you have the 2005-06 SS-USA Rule Book, there is now a section on Snowbird residency. My book was left with the team when I left for OR. and I won't get it back for a week or two, so at this immediate time I cannot quote the exact section, but I did read it last week when I received this years rulebook.
My concern, with the Snowbird issue is similiar to the adjoining state rule. Here in WA we only border OR. and ID. However, someone said some states are able to draw from up to 9 bordering states. Again, CA. and FL. stand alone. Anyone from anywhere can claim Snowbird status. It is not worth the expense to investigate or challenge. So, if a bordering states rule and a snowbird rule are both applicable, why have any residency rules? I personally believe the powers-to-be should either eliminate all residency requirements, or mandate that any team with one or more out-of-state players must play Major Plus. No exceptions. Honestly, the majority of team rosters are extremely flexible on a continuous basis and there is not much that can be done. (Mad Dog, thanks for the good old fashion butt kicking in the West Nat. Good games and good job) Jim
July 29, 2005
STONEMAN
Men's 50
535 posts
I POSTED THIS OVER 6 MONTHS AGO.
59.6M PEOPLE or 21.1% of the U.S. POPULATION are 55 & OLDER. 33M are FEMALES & 26.6 M are MALES (MALES make up 45%). 76.6 % of the U. S. POPULATION are FEMALES or 18 & YOUNGER.

CALIF. has 35.5M PERSONS & 77.7% are FEMALES or 18 & YOUNGER.( 3.3M SENIOR MEN)

FLOR. has 17M PERSONS & 74% are FEMALES or 18 & YOUNGER. ( 1.6M SENIOR MEN)

TEXAS has 22.2M PERSONS & 79% are FEMALES or 18 & YOUNGER. ( 2.1M SENIOR MEN)

GEORGIA has 8.9M PERSONS & 77.2% are FEMALES or 18 & YOUNGER.

ILLINOIS has 12.6M PERSONS & 77% are FEMALES or 18 & YOUNGER.

TENN. has 5.8M PERSONS & 76% are FEMALES or 18 & YOUNGER.

NEW YORK has 19.1M PERSONS. PENNSY. has 12.3M PERSONS. OHIO has 11.5M PERSONS. NORTH CAROLINA has 8.4M PERSONS. NEW JERSEY has 8.6M PERSONS. VIRGINIA has 7.4 M PERSONS.

NV, AZ, UTAH, IDAHO, & OREGON have a COMBINE POPULATION of 15.1M or 1.4M SENIOR MEN.

KANSAS, OKLAHOMA, COLORADA, MISSOURI, & NEBRASKA have 18.1M or 1.7M SENIOR MEN.

N. & S. DAKATA, MONTANA, & WYOMING have 2.8M. (ONLY 1/4 of a M SENIOR MEN.)

ARKANSAS has 2.7M & can DRAW from (6 STATES) w/ a TOTAL POP. of 44M or 4.2M SENIOR MEN.

W. VIRIGINA has 1. 8M & can DRAW from (4 STATES) w/ a TOTAL POP. of 35M or 3.3M SENIOR MEN .

KENTUCKY has 4.1M & can DRAW from (7 STATES) w/ a TOTAL POP. of 51M or 4.8M SENIOR MEN.

COLORADA has 4.5M & can DRAW from (7 STATES) w/ a TOTAL POP. of 18M.

GEORGIA has 8.9M & can DRAW from (4 STATES) w/ a TOTAL POP. of 23M.

TEXAS has 22M & can DRAW from (4 STATES) w/ a TOTAL POP. of 12.5M.

WASHINGTON.. .6.1M TOTAL POPULATION... .58M SENIOR MEN... 2 STATES w/ .43M SENIOR MEN

OREGON.. 3.6M TOTAL POPULATION... .3M SENIOR MEN... SAME as WASHINGTON
IDAHO.. 1.4M TOTAL POPULATION... .13M SENIOR MEN... 6 STATES w/ 1.5M SENIOR MEN

UTAH.. 2.4M TOTAL POPULATION... .23M SENIOR MEN.. . 6 STATES w/ 1.5M SENIOR MEN

S. DAKOTA.. .76M TOTAL POPULATION... .08M SENIOR MEN... 6 STATES w/ .8 M SENIOR MEN

MAINE.. 1.3M TOTAL POPULATION... .13M SENIOR MEN... 1 STATE w/ .13M SENIOR MEN

NEW HAMPSHIRE.. 1.2M TOTAL POPULATION... .13M SENIOR MEN... 3 STATES w/ .25M SENIOR MEN

MISSISSIPPI.. 2.9M TOTAL POPULATION... .29M SENIOR MEN... 4 STATES w/ 1.75M SENIOR MEN
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