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Discussion: TOC suggestions

Posted Discussion
Feb. 24, 2011
mad dog
Men's 60
3935 posts
TOC suggestions
was asked how it could be changed when all the present tourneys are lock in b/c of contracts with the cities they are being held in.

1) no wait for it to be played(some teams had to wait 14 months) ,no roster changes
2)some teams have not played for 2 months
3)teams out of shape,by that i mean game shape.there is a 2 month lapse time frame to deal with from regularly playing.

yes this year there was a lot of northern teams(26 out of the 50 some odd teams that finished in the top 3) that won and they had access to indoor facility's.the teams that only have outside places to practice are at a disadvantage.

list some ways SSUSA could change over and still keep their contracts in place.i know i couldn't,just was able to list reasons why.
Feb. 24, 2011
wagon487
Men's 50
516 posts
I got that letter also:)
Feb. 24, 2011
mad dog
Men's 60
3935 posts
wagon what would be your suggestion/s to have it in nov then...
Feb. 24, 2011
wagon487
Men's 50
516 posts
i'm to old to fight the power! I understand both sides. i'm just happy to be here!
Feb. 25, 2011
mad dog
Men's 60
3935 posts
understand wagon,just was hoping someone would read this and maybe give a viable way to swap tourney's around and have ssusa still honor their contracts with the cities they are locked into now.
the prol i see is the winters being held in 2 different cities at about the same time.
Feb. 25, 2011
Beasley
Men's 50
169 posts
Mad Dog, I didn't get the letter but I'll hook a brother up and add my opinion.

One way or another, SSUSA needs to have their season fall within the same calendar year. Lets say they decide the season will run from January to October and lets assume the World Tournament is going to be the last tournament each year. Then any SSUSA sanctioned tournament played between January and August would qualify you for the TOC in September. I'm not sure what the qualifications are for the World Tournament, but since it's currently in October and wouldn't change, there isn't really anything to worry about there.

SSUSA could have their Winter Nationals in November (as they do now) but it wouldn't qualify you for anything.

Just a thought.
Feb. 26, 2011
Corky
Men's 55
446 posts
Having missed 3 toc's for the reasons cited above, I'm all for having the TOC in mid to late November. I think the weather is still good in FLA. and the cold weather teams would still be in game shape and their rosters intact. In Indy we put our gloves up in early Nov. and can't get outside again until late March at the earliest. I agree with Beasley, the Winters after the Toc would work best because teams are most likely operating with the next yrs. roster at the winter national. Just my 2 cents
Feb. 26, 2011
stick8
1261 posts
I would like to see the TOC the same weekend as Phoenix and move up the SSUSA worlds to either earlier in October or in late September.
They could still have the winter nationals in November and a February TOC qualifier in Florida for the next years TOC.
Also, suppose team C is runner up or finishes third in a TOC qualifier. If team A (or both team A & B) finished above them already has a berth then team C should be extended a berth to the TOC. Perhaps more teams would participate. jmho
Feb. 26, 2011
kbl
Men's 60
527 posts
stick8--dont forget what TOC means (Champions)
thanks, ken
Feb. 26, 2011
bullet
Men's 55
130 posts
They talk of more teams going to the TOC.How about all the groups get together.SSUSA,SPA,ISA,ISSA,ISF.An have all of htese champs play in a TOC.This would really add to the number of teams.
Also have this TOC in Nov,And move the Winter national to Feb.
Feb. 26, 2011
titanhd
Men's 50
324 posts
I agree the Winter Nationals being played before the TOC just doesn't make sense.

SSUSA now re-rates the winner of ISA and SPA Nationals. Why not also allow those re-rated winners a berth to the TOC.
Basically what Bullet is asking.
Feb. 28, 2011
Capt Kirk
400 posts
Would the current TOC softball complexes(Winterhaven & Lakeland, FL) support an expanded field (let's say 150 teams)?
I would suggest that TOC should be played elsewhere, we should play on the best fields. We played in Lakeland, Fl in 2010, not impressed with those fields. If it is truly the best of the best tournament, why not have best fields & etc. We should not be playing the TOC in Feb.
Feb. 28, 2011
Webbie25
Men's 60
1953 posts
stick8-you have to remember this is a business and SSUSA put their bucks on the line to give us this wonderful venue to play. Without it, we are not playing much at all. Having said that, I am certain that they will not move their most successful tournament-Phoenix Worlds-329 teams. There is also a problem with having tournaments too close together. Winter worlds (FT. Myers and Las Vegas) work out well 3 or 4 weeks after Phoenix). They also have to lock in several complexes for the TOC. That alone cuts down on the number of cities that even have the facilities to hold a TOC. Plus, you are trying to get a warm weather site, and that is iffy anywhere in the country from November to March. The last 2 years have been well below average temperaturewise in Orlando. Maybe Hawaii, but who could afford that? (Look at Tucson for the Accenture PGA golf tournament yesterday-an inch of snow on the course in the morning). This has been discussed at length, too. Would Winter Worlds be as successful in February? Would the TOC really be better in November? Rest assured that these topics are well discussed by SSUSA and viable options offered by all of us will be considered. It would also take a huge effort by SSUSA to change these tournaments.
Feb. 28, 2011
garyheifner
349 posts
I realize this is the Tournament of Champions. However, do you really enjoy playing 3 meaningless games and then play for the championship the best of 3 with one other team???? My team has qualified for the TOC 3 times. In winning our entry each time, the chamionship games went to the "IF" game with us winning in the 7th by a run or two. Point is, there was really no difference between us and the team we defeated. In the interest of making the TOC a better level of competition, I would offer a bid to the Champs of course. I would then try and complete an "8" team bracket by offering a spot to the 2nd place teams of the ring qualifer tournaments on a first come 1st serve basis Until "8" teams has been reached. If an age group has at least "8" champ teams sign up, then this offer would not be made to 2nd place teams. If there are 6 champ teams and 3 2nd place teams want to come, SSWC would have to have a lottery drawing for the 2 spots. This might really help the Major or Major+ teams and other age groups where only 2 or 3 teams show up.

Also, with the Winter Nationals in early Nov., I don't see why the TOC can't be in the 1st week of December. It is not that close to CHRISTMAS.
Feb. 28, 2011
taits
Men's 65
4305 posts
I like bullet's idea of all championship teams that won amongst the other assn's be included but see a problem with them agreeing on who runs it who is responsible, who's name is the headliner, and who do they share the pot of gold on the fees and other responsibilities that are are included in putting it together.
Only a few share info, and even then it is not all the time. Ratings will be a problem because they do it differently and you know darn well some are not right.
So it comes down to the summit members getting their act together and come up with a cohesive plan that works for everyone not just what each wants as it is now, and they go on their separate ways.
That would be an ideal TOC. But having a showing of only about half of those that qualify really doesn't say much, especially if you take in all the other assn's possibilities.
March 2, 2011
Webbie25
Men's 60
1953 posts
taits- it is really hard to have a nationwide tourney, especially in this economy. $$$$ I think they do a great job getting 119 teams there.
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