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Discussion: PLAYER RELEASE

Posted Discussion
July 11, 2012
BOB P
11 posts
PLAYER RELEASE
IS IT FAIR TO A PLAYER IF HIS MGR WILL NOT RELEASE HIM FROM HIS ROSTER.THE RELEASE APPROVAL FROM A MGR WAS INTENDED SO TEAMS AT THE END OF THE SEASON COULD NOT LOAD UP FOR THE TOC & WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS AT THE END OF THE SEASON.THAT'S ALL WELL AND GOOD,BUT WHEN A PLAYER WANTS A RELEASE
BECAUSE THE TEAM DOES NOT GO TO THE TOURNAMENTS THEY HAD LISTED ON THE TEAM PRESEASON SCHEDULE IT SHOULD BE GRANTED.NO MGR SHOULD HAVE THE POWER TO STOP A PLAYER FROM PLAYING SENIOR SOFTBALL. THE PLAYER HAS PD HIS REGISTRATION AND SHOULD BE ABLE TO PLAY. PLAYERS SHOULD ONLY BE RESTRICED TO TEAM ROSTERS IF THE PLAY THE SCHEDULE THE TEAM COMMITED TO AT THE START OF THE SEASON.PLAYERS IN THE 65'S 70'S 75'S & 80 AGE GROUPS MAY NOT BE ABLE TO PLAY NEXT SESON DUE TO POOR HEALTH.
July 11, 2012
Bubble Gum
64 posts

Next time, stop screaming and try using lower case letters.

July 11, 2012
rightrj1
Men's 55
208 posts
Bob,

I totally agree with you on this one! It shouldn’t matter if the coach doesn’t commit to the preseason schedule or not…If a player want to be release from that team IT SHOULD BE THE PLAYER'S CALL not the manager’s.

I’ve heard managers will do this to players out of spite, how is it that the manager’s have the final word?

If I play for you, then ok no problem….but If I want to be release, then I have to kiss your A$$ to get it done…..That just isn’t right!!! PERIOD!
July 11, 2012
Beasley
Men's 50
169 posts
I can agree with this IF players aren't allowed to return to a team once released. That way a player couldn't get released to play a tournament with another team and then return to the original team.

But if you don't put some controls on it, then you will have teams loading up for the Big Two. One control may be that the player has to play in X number of tournaments with the new team in order to be eligible to play the World or TOC with them.
July 11, 2012
LP
293 posts
you can change teams one time only in SSUSA once you have quit and gone to another team you can not go back to your original team. the manager can not stop you from doing this, all you have to do is get it cleared from SSUSA.
July 11, 2012
Beasley
Men's 50
169 posts
LP,

That's not exactly true.

Without going into detail and whining, if a "manager" doesn't want to release you, then you're pretty much done.

In my particular situation, I'm pretty much done with SSUSA for the remainder of this year. No big deal because I called SSUSA before our situation went down and I knew what the possibilities were. And I didn't have any more SSUSA tournaments currently scheduled. However, if things were like you say, I would be playing SSUSA before the beginning of the next softball year.

But you know what, it's worth it sitting out a couple SSUSA tournaments. I'll be playing plenty of tournaments with the other associations.
July 11, 2012
curveball
Men's 65
400 posts
LP This same type situation happened a couple of years back that involved 2 fellows playing for a team out of Palm Springs. SSUSA backed the manager and these 2 didn't play the rest of the year. Manager has full control on this one.
July 12, 2012
neck10
498 posts
I think if a player wants to play for another team in a tourney & he & the coach dont agree there should be somewhere to turn,maybe not in the same age & class but there should be somewhere for a quick answer there's enough tourney's out there that a guy should be able to play every weekend .just had one of our guys call & ask could he play somewhere else this weekend to get some extra swings in I told him as long as he didnt play up I didnt care!!!!!!
July 12, 2012
neck10
498 posts
I dont understand why a guy cant play for another team if his team is not playing that weekend, unless he makes thee difference in that team winning & losing guess wouldnt be fair to the other teams with there original rostewr's.
July 12, 2012
Gary19
Men's 50
2615 posts
neck, that would be the difference between a "team" and a bunch of guys getting together for a weekend.
July 12, 2012
J R
182 posts
Think about Manager puts team together.Gets committment from a sheet listing tournaments for the year. Buys shirts. Then a player jumps teams. Player was being counted on by team and manager.I say you committed so you are in for what you promised, Sittin out for a year will make you think about giving your word and standing by it.I ask the team and the majority says no. Then no release
July 12, 2012
Gary19
Men's 50
2615 posts
"giving your word and standing by it"

What a sadly obsolete concept.
July 12, 2012
softball4b
Men's 60
756 posts
If I commit to a team then I plan on playing on that team for the entire year regardless of how or who is recruiting me.

The only exception I have ever made was when I was told that the team we had would not be competing in the Nationals and I never competed against my former teammates.

My intent every year is to compete with and against the very best at the highest level.

That being said, managers should not have the final say when it comes to a player moving one time during the year. There are always extenuating circumstances and back stories, but the player should be able to decide where he wants to play.

For the most part, I believe players will commit to a team and honor their commitment. Those that don't, usually have done it in the past and managers reap what they sow when they pick up players with a history of moving teams.

July 12, 2012
neck10
498 posts
JR what if teams says they are going to play in X amount of tourneys then desides not to go to lets say 2 of the original 6 every one agreed on whats your take then???
July 12, 2012
Pricer
Men's 50
622 posts
Commitment? Either your good for your word or your not. As a player, your commitment is not only to the manager but all of your teammates as well. JMO
July 12, 2012
softball4b
Men's 60
756 posts
That blade cuts both ways.

If the team management goes in a significant different direction, then you based your initial decision on incomplete or inaccurate information. I try to make an informed decision.
July 12, 2012
LP
293 posts
Beasley and Curveball a couple of years ago while in a tournament with only ten players,one of our guys quit and went to play with another team( diff. age group)that left us with nine players. i refused to give him a release to play for a team back in our same division, he call SSUSA--- Terry H. called me and told me since i wouldnt release the player,that he (Terry) would. thats what i have to go on but maybe its how SSUSA feels that day.
July 12, 2012
CAPT D5
124 posts
Most players just want to play ball. If treated fairly players will ussually stay with the team that fits. Any agreements must work both ways. I only play with guys who treat each other with respect and fairness. Too often we forget this is all for fun. We play to win because losing is not fun. Unless there is a system of due process for players prevented from playing, I favor erroring on the side of the player. We all know power can corrupt, so lighten up and let players play. We are all just a bunch of old guys trying to enjoy our last good years playing a great game with some good guys. Lets keep the spirt of competition and fairness and it should all be fun
July 12, 2012
TOMAR77
Men's 55
199 posts
As a manager, if a player wants to be released I accommodate him. If he doesn't want to play with my team so be it. Most likely he isn't a fit so best for both of us.It is to much trouble to be vindictive and hold him back, I say be on your way.LP, I admit I would be tested by what happened to you and your team, but I would release him and hope to play against him to whup him by shutting him down and winning the game!
July 12, 2012
Beasley
Men's 50
169 posts
LP,

I understand your situation and without knowing what Terry H. knew at the time, it's hard to assess whether I would make the same call. So I can't really say with I agree with the decision or not.

I believe that Capt D5 has a good point - that there has to be process for players to be able to continue playing. All the power cannot lie with the Manager. My situation is a complicated one. I'm abiding by the SSUSA decision but I voiced my concern regarding managers having all the power. That's about all I can do. Maybe it will be discussed and maybe it won't, but I can't spend endless hours worrying about it. I'm moving on.

I guess when manager(s) and player(s) split and can't agree on a release, the best process would be for both sides to present their argument and allow SSUSA to make a decision.
July 12, 2012
TOMAR77
Men's 55
199 posts
Beasley,your idea does have merit. SSUSA, what say you?
July 13, 2012
LP
293 posts
I dont want a player who doesnt want to play on my team,and i would give him a release to go else where, but if you quit during a tournament and leave me with only nine players for that day. now i'm pissed and it causes a hardship on the rest of the team, to me he can wait till the next year to get picked up. i wish someone like that to have all the bad luck in the world.
July 13, 2012
Beasley
Men's 50
169 posts
LP,

I can certainly understand your position. And I agree that someone quiting at a tournament puts everyone in a bad situation and there probably should be some type of delay in the player getting back on the field.

But not every manager is like you. There are some out there that hold players hostage because they want to be a RICHARD CRANIUM. And because of the way things are at the moment, they appear to have all the power to do that.
July 13, 2012
Gary19
Men's 50
2615 posts
Don't players have an obligation to the coach and teammates to honor their word?

So now our generation is becoming as self-centered as the next?
July 13, 2012
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1003 posts
I believe if a player wants a release you give it to him... Period! Save SSUSA the hassle of having to hear from the player wanting the release.

There is a million reasons why a coach or team might want to not release a person, however when it has gone bad, it's time for all parties to move on! So, if the relationship is good, bad, or indifferent the release should be granted! One week notice should be sufficient!
July 13, 2012
Gary19
Men's 50
2615 posts
Just wondering, how many times have all you guys been divorced? Seems like commitment is an issue with some/many.

You agree to something, you do it. Just not that difficult. If you want to, or need to, leave then fine. But not for "greener" pastures.
July 13, 2012
Beasley
Men's 50
169 posts
If it were only that easy.

Your word is your commitment but things happen that force you to make a decision as to whether you want continue being associated with your current team.

The thread was started because it appears a team Bob P was playing on decided not to honor their word and go to the tournaments scheduled at the beginning of the year. Apparently Bob P decided to leave the team and now the team manager won't give him a release.

So should Bob P be given a release anyway because the team failed to honor their commitment? Or should Bob P honor his commitment to the team even though they aren't honoring theirs? Or should he just leave and sitout the remainder of the SSUSA season? Why does the Manager (who failed to honor his commitment) get to decide Bob P's fate?
July 13, 2012
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1003 posts
To many reasons a person might want to be released Gary,,, I know two guys that I would never have in my dugout! I drove 240 miles once and turned around because on one person I would never play with ever! So if I wanted a release I was going to get one but they Released him as they should of! Bottom line Gary is a one week notice and you should be released!

July 13, 2012
Gary19
Men's 50
2615 posts
Beasley, as I said I understand that if you need to leave, fine. And a guy certainly can discontinue being associated with a team.

But to do it to leave for another/better team is wrong. Now I do see what you are saying about the team changing what it committed to, though even in that case I would think the reasons why have to be considered.

swing, I know that can happen, but were those guys there prior to you committing? I think part of a good relationship, any relationship, is both being a good partner and picking a good one. If you fail in either, ultimately whose fault is that?

July 13, 2012
Beasley
Men's 50
169 posts
Gary,

In most cases I can agree with you that a player leaving a team for another/better team is wrong. But I also feel that there are exceptions where leaving a team is justified - even though some people will be pissed off. A player leaving a team to play for another team in the same classification (Major+, Major, AAA, or AA) is wrong.

And I can agree with you that the reasons for a team changing their schedule have to be considered. But that leads us back to the same quesiton - who decides and what's the process?
July 13, 2012
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1003 posts
regardless of fault Gary both parties need to move on... I'm not going to release a guy that is jumping ship that week to play against my team on a greener pastures deal.... Like I said, one week notice or two week notice to give my team time to replace this guy... but the release should be granted at some point!
July 13, 2012
Gary19
Men's 50
2615 posts
"but the release should be granted at some point!" Sure, the end of the season.

I agree the parties might need to move on, but not without some repercussions. A death sentence? Of course not....:) But immediately free and clear, I just don't see it that way. But could just be me.
July 13, 2012
LeeLee
86 posts
Gary why would want to keep a guy that doesnt want to play for you. You just want to keep him a roster to punish him or something. This is a game things like that aren't positive. There is no reason to not allow a player his release. The only reason you wouldn't would be negative reason.
July 13, 2012
LeeLee
86 posts
Sorry about the post above, I just got to excited about it. What I mean't to say is why would you keep a guy that doesn't want to play for you and things like this aren't postive for the game.
July 13, 2012
Gary19
Men's 50
2615 posts
He doesn't have to play for me, but if that is his decision then he won't play for anyone else.

I want to keep him because he made a commitment to me and to my team, and life should not let people walk away quite that easily. He can go play somewhere else next year, this is not a lifetime deal.

Guys hopscotching teams is not positive for the game.
July 13, 2012
taits
Men's 65
4387 posts
It the mgr releases the player shouldn't be a problem there.
If the player is able to get a release on his own so be it, either way the player is on;y allowed ONE for the year.
Why would a mgr want to keep a player he knows isn't happy there. I'd think he is more likely to not show up or not play at full capacity. That's a losing choice he
makes.
Both should have the ability to do attain the release, after all you only get that one, and you don't get to go back to where it came from. Any other team you go to your 'stuck' there.
July 13, 2012
stick8
1297 posts
LeeLee how is quitting a team during mid-season any more positive for the game then a manager not releasing him?
July 13, 2012
crump22
Men's 50
43 posts
Gary 19, I,m the co- sponsor, manager and player for Motown Stars 55 major softball team ,if a player want a release,i want my uniform and any equipment that belong to the org. return first, in the past gerke had 5 ex motown player that start the year with us. gerke recruited player during the game, so if a player wanted to leave , good luck, because Motown have had a team for 33 year . took the 10 that wanted to stay and won the NSA
July 13, 2012
Gary19
Men's 50
2615 posts
I am sure it was very satisfying to win in that situation, but it is such crap that guys our age do things like what your ex-players did.
July 13, 2012
Wes
Men's 65
311 posts
ALL OF THE ABOVE
This is a major problem I think and I'm not sure that it's a single players fault
or a managers fault.
I would play two or three weeks a month if
I could find a team that would play that much, I would pay the fee so money's not the problem. I have played on three different teams the last three years because THE TEAM would agree to play in say
6 or 8 tournaments, they would play the first one and when it came time for the second or third tournament two or three player would say I can not go, for what ever reason, so we are now down to 12 or 13 player and some of the others would say I'm not going with just 12 or 13 player. So we do not go. We would end up playing 3 or 4 tournaments a year. I'v played on teams from Ohio-Kentcky-Ind.& Mo.
I will be going to the rules committee next
year for both SPA and SSUSA with a rule change. This is the rule change that I'm going to propose---help me make it better.

A player may play on no more than three teams each year as allowed in other section of the rules. A players base team,in each age group,will be the team
he plays the first tournament with each year. A player my play in a tournament with a second or three team, in each age group,as long as his base team is not playing in that tournament. If his base team is playing in that tournament he/she
must play with his/her base team.

Now the way I read this is that if his/her
base team goes to TOC then he/she must play
with the base team. On the other hand if the base team does not go to TOC then the
player may play with the second or third team he/she has played with.
July 13, 2012
LeeLee
86 posts
Positive because he doesn't want to be part of your team and your team is better off without them. Any player that doesn't want to be part of a team is a negative. The positive he is gone and your team moves on without any cancer or issues, by keeping him it just creates a negative vibe. Gary you only get one move anyway, players get released in the show all day long and players ask to be released. You just want to keep them on your roster so they can't play anymore that year. Really, sounds like your a mad little kid this isn't the third grade. You know sometimes things just don't workout, so why would you want to end a friendship in a negative way. Treat people the way you would like to be treated, or just be a better person, you are keeping score tick for tack. You don't want to play on my team anymore so I am not going to relaese you so you can't play with anyone else. REALLY COME MAN!!!!!!!!!!!!11
July 13, 2012
stick8
1297 posts
LeeLee I can understand all that but is every player who quits a team a cancer? I don't beleive that to be the case. What if say today one of your players--one of your best--an every game starter well liked and respected--came up and stated he can't make the worlds in Las Vegas because of a family or a work committment and cannot get out of it?
Let's say you have 4 more tournaments, all SSUSA, before Vegas. Knowing he's out for Vegas would you:
a)keep him on the team and play him as normal for the 4 tournaments
b)keep him on the team and gradually phase his playing time out so to get another player more experience for Vegas
c)keep him on the team but as a back-up
d)mutually part ways and try to add someone else
Tough choice to make!!
July 13, 2012
CAPT D5
124 posts
Too often we forget this is a fun game and we can ruin it with little power games. If you are going to get serious about not allowing players freedom to change teams then you might want to consider having contracts. I choose who I play with. If I am treated well I will likely stay. If I want to go to a better team my choice. Of course with every choice comes consequences. The consequences are what usually influences behavior. When a team manager gets with new players understandings based on mutual consideration and respect are important. I have seldom seen a player quit a team where he is treated well. Players need to be on teams they are happy. This is not the old USSR.
July 13, 2012
swing for the fences
Men's 50
1003 posts
LeeLee, what are you talking about?/????? We are keeping you on our roster and want you back! LMAO... Just kidding...

You want your release you got it.. I would never want someone who didn't want to be with the TEAM... I know my team would man up against anyone that didn't want to be with us... Perry and Mike for instance... they are targets.. LOL

No need to be a baby and keep someone just because he may or may not play against us.. I say it gives our team more incentive to beat that team.
July 13, 2012
LeeLee
86 posts
Stick I agree with you, there are many reasons for a player to be released. I am talking about players that might want to move on and the manager not releasing him, so he couldn't play for anyone else. the senario you mentioned is different, I doubt the player would even ask to be released. IMO if a player wants to be released and you hold him hostage not allowing him to play with someone else this could be a cancer. I don't think none of us like to told what we can do and cannot do, as Capt said this isn't USSR it is America you know the home of the free and the brave.
July 13, 2012
Omar Khayyam
999 posts
I've been on three teams in the last ten years where a guy was let go in mid-season. In every case, it was a first-year player on our team. In every case our manager gave him his release—why not? We're not going to play him after in one case quitting the team in the middle of a tournament and in two cases, insubordinate to the manager. We don't want him sitting on the bench poisoning the dugout. So he was released and we parted reasonable friends.

Interestingly, in all three cases the guy was already a problem in the dugout and with the team, even before the incident that led to him being let go. No one else on the team pleaded his case—they were happy to bid him farewell. All three caught on with another team—all three never played for the new team again.

So I'm with the release-him-and-move-on group here. Even without cause other than a yearning for greener pastures, it's better to move past it. I agree with Gary19 that it is a sad indictment of our culture that players would commit to a team and then want out when another team beckons. And if the team's tournament plans are reduced, even a great contributing player should be released if he's a guy who lives for softball and wants to play as much as possible. In those cases, the team didn't keep to its commitment for an aggressive tournament schedule.
July 13, 2012
BOB P
11 posts
The bottom line is the player wants to play he is in his 70's. The team he is with is not going to the tournaments they had scheduled for the season . He wants to play as much as he can this year you don't know what next year will bring, he shoild not be tied to a team that is not going to the tournaments they had on there schedule, because other team players changed ther minds.When your 70 your happy to wake up the next morning. he should get his release
July 14, 2012
stick8
1297 posts
For a lot of years back in the day I played against a guys team who had a rule of never releasing players. Pricer will know exactly who I'm referring to. This guy always had the best teams, somehow got the best draws at tourneys, best uni's and a sponsor that paid for everything--and I mean everything!! So many players that played for him used to bitch and complain about how he ran a team and how he (expletive) over many great players. I wanted to beat this guys teams badly and over the course of hundreds of games played against them I was successful less than a handful of times. One nioght this coach told me his philosophy. During the season April til August he gives every player on his roster an equal chance to prove themselves. Before the states, regionals and worlds he picks what he feels is his best lineup to win and he stays with it the rest of the way. What's important is everybody knows from the start that is how it works. Many good players that didn't make his starting lineup sought to quit but he refused to release them. He told me he doesn't believe in releasing players to another team because of the committment that everyone from the players to theb coaches & sponsors have made. I gained a whole new respect for this guy after this conversation. Currently, this guy is helping coach Resmondo and has beeen with them for several years.
July 14, 2012
CAPT D5
124 posts
Stick8, I question whether the coach's philosophy of not releasing players was so effective, or if the full sponsorship was the main reason for the measure of success mentioned. I would not play for a team with the player unhappiness cited. If the players knew full well what they were getting into, fine, but if it was sprung on them latter, then not good. Sounds like a power thing, but I don't like telling others what is best for them. Personally, I would choose the team that brings down the type team mentioned. I have been on championship teams and have always enjoyed winning more with underdogs and good people making mutual respect most important. I realize we all have our own values, but I choose free choice with commitment being two way. When given the choice of someone else's way or the highway, I choose my way. I don't play for money or gifts. Pride and self respect are high on my list, and playing with others who understand those values. I always fight for players rights, seen too much crap.
July 14, 2012
the wood
1085 posts
Capt D5:
I agree with you on this matter. We have never felt the need to keep a player (no matter how good he was)if he didn't want to play for us. We have been on the other end when the other mgr played power ball with a guy's head... 'yes, we'll release you'... 'no, we won't'... etc, etc. I won't bore you with the details but I felt that it was pretty weak of the other mgr. It was late May at the time.
We did release a guy from our roster (future HOF guy)so that he could play with one of our opponents in the 2007 SSUSA World Championship 2 weeks later. They were short an outfielder or two and he was on our roster but hadn't played all season (injuries, family conflicts). They won the tourney but we have never looked at this as a poor decision. They most likely would not have won without him. He's a friend to this day.
If we have to be chicken shit to win we don't need it... we play senior softball with real people and we prefer to treat them as such.
BW
July 15, 2012
stick8
1297 posts
CAPT D5 as a player I understand exactly what you mean but on this guys team the players knew full well up front how it was being run and what might happen. The players whom I knew that ended up being bench players felt they should've been starting and did not want to sit. Completely understandable. But otoh, the manager has to decide what his best line up is and go with it. Unfortunately some got the short end of the stick on playing time. It's not like it was sprung on them without prior knowledge.
July 15, 2012
CAPT D5
124 posts
Stick 8, I understand what you are saying, having managed and coached for years. I wouldn't attempt to judge past situations I wasn't involved in, I tend to respect those more directly involved. I would though wonder if the disgruntled players were pressured into regrettable agreements. Players often go along with things just to play. The good managers don't take advantage and pressure players. I think keeping players happy has a role. Without knowing everything I tend to give players the benefit of doubt, realizing the power is usually on the managers side. So many players being unhappy seems is a factor. I believe in working as a team and for the team, but if someone doesn't want to be on the team, let them go. This is a game meant for fun, I believe. Again, I respect your view, and know different things work in an imperfect world. I think there is definitely merit to strong leadership. We just have to be careful of abuse. I am not offering judgement here, just a point of view, to consider. Good luck.
July 15, 2012
stick8
1297 posts
CAPT D5 you might have something when you wrote "players often go along with things just to play". I suspect the guys knew never thought for one second they'd be bench guys. And when they found out it likely blew their mind. A lot of players don't care for this coach but it's difficult to argue the mans record.
July 18, 2012
MartyM
Men's 65
9 posts
Wes-Go for it. I think you have a good idea. I'm one of the Players that asked for and received a release after the 1st tournament of the year simply because I was the only player on the team that did not get to play and never got an explanation/apology/nothing. It was painful as I had developed a great relationship with the players. Luckily I found another team to play with. But, I am only getting to play 4 or 5 tournaments. I would love to play a few more and the opportunities exist except for the fact that I can only play for one team. If my team isn't going to a tournament and there is another team that is short a player, I sure would like to be able to play. Never know when the end will arrive and I can't.
July 19, 2012
Duke
Men's 60
720 posts
I was on a team about 7 years ago, where myself and many others wanted to leave. I asked for a release, but the coach would not do so. He even went to a team and asked the coach to not pick me up for their team. The coach from that team called me and another player that day, and asked if we wanted to join them for the remainder of the season. LOL! This could have been a battle between me, the former coach, and SSUSA, except for one fact. A team email was sent to the team regarding best wishes to Andy and 5 others and good luck on your new teams. SSUSA took that email as sufficient for a release from the coach, once I sent it to SSUSA. Being on the former team was so unbearable and finally hit the limit with many of us. Before leaving, I gave the remaining players(who all thought we were not going to leave), an option to keep the team going, but eliminate the coach, and they did not pick up on it, and have all said that they regret their decisions to stay. BTW, the coach was not a player on the field.

I am usually the coach/manager on most teams that I play on. My take on releases in most cases is if you want to leave, then you can leave. The only reason that I could think of not releasing a player, would be if he owes money to the team. Once that was paid, he can go play for whoever he likes. I cannot remember a player leaving my team in the middle of a season, except if he has moved out of the area and/or had no money to travel any longer.

Just my 2 cents worth,

Andy Smith,
55/60 Major
July 19, 2012
Gary19
Men's 50
2615 posts
I must just be old school. I still think commitment is something to be taken very seriously. Maybe that's why I have been married for 32 years to my first wife.
July 19, 2012
#19
Men's 60
252 posts
Gary19 ... Seems to me that "commitment" should be a 2-way street.

#19
July 19, 2012
Duke
Men's 60
720 posts
Commitment is important and honorable, but when a coach is constantly critcizing and yelling at players in the dugout and on the field of play in front of everyone, it is time to move on. When things over a period of time(4 years) cannot be worked out, it might be time to leave or a divorce. No sense staying together and making everyone miserable, especially children. That is my last comment on this subject.

Andy Smith,
55/60 Major
July 19, 2012
Gary19
Men's 50
2615 posts
Andy, I completely understand that, but was that all brand new behavior for that coach or has he had a history of doing it and should that not have been known by the players prior to committing to play for them?

Kind of like some kid who signed to play for Bobby Knight, then wanted out because the coach yelled at him. How about the player doing his homework first? No, not everything can be known, I realize that. But I am going to guess the coach of a senior team did not just start yelling that season.
July 19, 2012
CAPT D5
124 posts
Andy, I give you credit for not playing the last word, one up game. You state your experience and share a view and let it stand. Having seen the good and bad of tournament play, I believe there is room for improvement. Tournaments are great fun and challenge. Maybe from sharing our views we can identify problems and improve the experience. Too many good players have quit playing because of unresolved issues. Too often players just wanting to play have to endure power trips which leave few options. Most of us don't get paid to play. In essence we are just a bunch of guys wanting to play and share a game reminding us of our youth. Lets keep trying too look critically at issues and find solutions. Bottom line, without respect nothing works. We are men who aren't going to put up with crap just to play a game.
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