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Discussion: Senior bat care and durability

Posted Discussion
Oct. 22, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
Senior bat care and durability
Hello guys,
Just returned from a great tournament at the Villages Florida. If you are sports minded and want a incredible place to retire , look up the villages on your computer. Happy to say my team Team1 Sports / Combat walked away with top honors and got a ISSA berth. I had a chance to watch numerous teams take batting practice in the morning on adjacent fields. We have HEAVY dew here in Florida that leaves the grass as wet as rain. I was surprised to see player after player taking bp in the mornings with soaking wet bp balls using their senior bats! This is one of the worst things you can do to a senior bat and severely shortens it's lifespan. Let me remind you of a few things to avoid:
1. Do not use wet bp balls with your senior bat. You can't control game conditions but keep those wet swings to a minimum.
2. Don't use your senior bat in a batting cage without examining what balls are being used there. Many cages use balls that will damage senior bats.
3. Try and use 44/375 balls or the new 52/275 balls. Other types of balls may help you look like a hero but they are damaging your bat with every swing.
4. COOL WEATHER is coming and in some places it's here. Don't use your senior bat under 65 degrees...it's going to break faster, guaranteed.
5. Limit your bp sessions with your GAME bat. The more bp you hit, the fewer games you are going to be able to use it. Use an old bat or a ASA OR USSSA bat for bp and take the last 5-7 swings each round with your game bats if conditions allow.
Even with the Ambush or other durable bats you will shorten the life of the bat by not following these guidelines.
Since I sell all the senior bats I should probably not tell you all this so you will buy more bats...but, that would not be right! Lol
If you have questions or need help with any senior bat , call or email me.
Alan
Team 1 Sports
tricoach18@att.net
561-718-7504
Oct. 23, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
Guys,
I forgot number 6...just got in a bat today to inspect and...
6. DO NOT roll or shave a senior bat. Obviously, it's illegal but it also severely restricts the bats potential for durability. I received a bat that supposedly had around 200 swings on it before it broke. We cut it open and found that the bat had been rolled before using it. As you know senior bats have no warranty but if you roll or shave the bat it obviously has no chance of being replaced. These bats are certainly high performance enough without doing anything to enhance them other than a couple of rounds of good bp. I have outlined break in procedures on this website and on mine at team1sports.us
Follow these for your best results and call me with any questions.
Alan
Team 1 / Ambush
Oct. 23, 2012
mad dog
Men's 65
3958 posts
alan,you need to inform ssusa(or this senior board) who this individual is that is altering their bat....this is how we get rid of the cheaters..don't turn your head about it,if it is enough to tell them no on a replacement bat,it is good enough to turn their ass in......
Oct. 23, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
I agree but I have no idea or proof that this bat was used in tournament play. I do know of guys who alter bats to hit in hr competitions, etc...still not a prudent thing to do but obviously something I can't police.
Oct. 23, 2012
mad dog
Men's 65
3958 posts
don't care,if they alter a bat,it needs to be known by the associations...a guy who feels the need to alter a hr derby bat,to me is just as guilty......if you don't turn them in who else is gonna,as your the one to see it has been altered.....also if the mfg'ers or reps do turn them in,do ya think maybe they would not be trying to push an altered bat by you...your way there is no penalty to the cheater,someone has to take a stand and quit burying their heads in the sand.....
Oct. 23, 2012
titanhd
Men's 50
343 posts
Alan, how do you tell that a bat has been rolled ?I totally understand how you would tell a shaved bat but, what indicated to you that the bat was rolled?
Oct. 23, 2012
5ToolsinOhio
Men's 50
160 posts
You forgot number 8 on original post..light coat of wintercrest right before bedtime.
Oct. 23, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
There are several ways depending on the brand of bat and to what degree the rolling is done. A trained eye can look at the interior of the bat and see differences in the condition and coloring of the carbon.
5tools, good one !
Oct. 23, 2012
Full Monty
80 posts

Tri18

What is your opinion or advice on the use of "Bat Warmers" in cooler weather?

Will they maximize the life of the bat?

Legit or Gimmick?






Oct. 23, 2012
rick#8
16 posts
Alan, are you going to be in naples next month for the Winter Nationals, if so, I have an Ambush you should look at, 50 swings, balls all 44/375, temp above 75, totally blown out.
Rick Snodgraass
Conn. Sportsplex
55 Major Plus
Oct. 23, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
I will be there mister. Bring it to me and we will do a full autopsy. You can also mail it to me if you wish.
Bat warmers do help slightly. As the days get cooler, the easier it is to break bats. I go to USSSA bats except for a game. But....even at that, we reduce senior bat life every swing we take once the weather gets in the 60's or lower.
Thanks,
Alan
Oct. 23, 2012
rick#8
16 posts
Alan, get me your shipping address and I/ll try to get it out to you this week, it was 1 of 3 you sent to my buddy in McKeesport,Pa. I was hoping to get it ready for Las Vegas, but, it didn't last long enough, this senior softball is really starting to get quite expensive, this is the 5th bat that I have broken just this year, 3 ultra's, 1 reebook and then this ambush, I do still have the Combat Original that I got at the start of the season, they seem to last about a year for me, but they are not the same as when they first came out about 5 years ago, drop me your shipping address and I will look forward to seeing you in naples, Rick
rsnod8@comcast.net
Oct. 23, 2012
db14
91 posts
To my fellow softball players....yes bat warmers do work. Especially so on senior bats due to the thickness/thiness of their barrels. All of the above recommendentations are in fact prudent as well. Also no need to pay $50 or more for one. If you are creative and observant you can make your own. Just my personal experience and in no way scientific however they have allowed me to add a bit more life to my bats. Hope this helps. Gary 19 no need to chirp in on this one but i'm sure you will.
Oct. 24, 2012
Webbie25
Men's 60
1995 posts
Tri18-I have heard that even with a bat warmed in a warmer, that hitting cold softballs is detrimental to the life of a senior bat because it makes them harder. Truth to that one? Sounds logical. Thanks.
Oct. 24, 2012
Full Monty
80 posts
Tri18

Thank you for your reply.

From what I can understand from your reply is that you don't use them.

And that below 60 degrees a senior bats life is reduced whether a bat warmer is used or not.

Is this correct?


Oct. 24, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
This is true to the extent that you cannot control what the cooler weather is doing to the ball that you are hitting...as temperatures drop, balls become somewhat harder as well which has a negative impact on bats. The bat warmer only takes care of one side of the problem. Remember guys...no matter what brand of bat you are using you will decrease it's life and increase breakage by using it in cooler weather. It's a risk that each player needs to access for himself but I will tell you the bat companies will not entertain breakage issues during the fall/winter months as a result. So...use an older bat or a USSSA bat or be prepared to buy a new senior bat after cold weather usage...
Alan
Team1sports.us
Oct. 24, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
Rick,
Sent you an email...sorry about the breakage...we have been fortunate overall with the Ambush thus far....less than 1/2% of premature breakage. Overall, the durability has been excellent with fantastic performance. I broke my first one right before the Villages at around 800/900 swings which is by far the longest lasting senior bat I have ever used. As with any manufactured product and especially high performance ones, you can get a few that don't withstand the pressures put on it. We take our engineering seriously so we will very closely examine the bat to see if their was a flaw somewhere.
Thanks,
Alan
TeamAmbush
Oct. 24, 2012
HJ
Men's 70
443 posts
Alan, totally agree. I try to find a USSSA bat which approximates my senior bat for BP and spring use. It might be helpful if the senior bat
sellers, you, mike and ed. put out a list of USSSA bats which approximate the feel and weight, balance point etc. of the various senior bats.
It would put substance to what you are suggesting.
I have found the old virus enhanced end-loaded combat closely approximates my trusty yellow MM combat, but I am clueless what would approximate
my Reebok Balanced Melee. Any suggestions??
Oct. 24, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
Worth resmondo 454 balanced matches up real close in swing weight and feel. Get with me if you need some...I have a variety of USSSA bats on sale now...
Tricoach18@att.net
Alan
Team 1 Sports
Oct. 24, 2012
softball4b
Men's 60
768 posts
What bat would be have an approximate swing weight/feel to Reebok End loaded.

ASA and or USSSA
Oct. 24, 2012
surf88
Men's 60
903 posts
softball4b: Our ASA/USSSA Melee swings a bit similar to our Melee EL. I keep one in my bag as we do experience cold temperatures in the mountains. Our ASA Melees and Vector-O's have a 1 year warranty.
Ed Andrews (970) 729-3145
Oct. 24, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
Softball 4b, the Reebok senior end loads have some different balance points depending on what weight you swing. Shoot me an email or call me and we can dial in the best bat to replicate the one you are currently using.
Thanks,
Alan 561-718-7504
Oct. 24, 2012
Gorilla Boy
Men's 50
190 posts
I sure am glad that I didn't have to dial in on my bats or I might not have ever hit a home run.
Mike Macenko
aka: Gorilla Boy
Oct. 24, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
Mike,
You can walk in the woods, snatch a tree out of the ground, chew a few limbs off of it, and hit a cork center 400 feet. The rest of us mere mortals need all the help we can get.
Props to one of the greatest All-Time hitters in softball history...
Alan
Team 1
Oct. 24, 2012
Al33
Men's 55
183 posts
Tri18 - Alan, you are 100% right on the money. Mighty Mike could hit it 400+ with anything and I saw him do it many times. Unfortunately it was against my team. Mike hit some of the longest and most majestic bombs I have ever seen. Over 6,000 home runs in his career says it all, and your years in 1987 and 1988 were mystifying.

We in the north know all about the tips you have provided to extend the life of any composite but mostly the senior bat. If it's real cold we'll use alluminum bats for BP just so we can get swings and work on our timing. Thanks for your continued assistance to senior players.

Al Drechsler #33
Pace Electronics
Oct. 24, 2012
Gary19
Men's 50
2615 posts
Mike, we will have to let these guys know they are a little late to the party. I remember watching you hitting balls halfway up the hill to the Zoo on Rose field in the mid-70s. You and Indian Joe were always fun to watch in the home run derbies there.
Oct. 24, 2012
crusher
Men's 70
403 posts
If you hit a ball 230feet do whatever you want with a bat, hit in cold weather, hot weather, etc.... you will not harm your composit bat. It will last you 10 years. This is a lot of people. I see some bats that are weathered from the sun, not the hitting.
NOW, if you can hit a low linedrive to the fence or crush one over the fence, then, you need to take care in breaking the batin, YOU want a long lived bat...
No wet balls, Rotate bat. Very little batting practice. Do not hit close to the end of the bat. Use in tournaments only.
Even then if you hit 3 out of 10 out of the park you may destroy your bat.
My 30oz black centenarian has 107 swings on it. About 45 swings on sweet part. Is broken in and will launch ball out of 300ft park against light breeze. NO spider webbing.

1. Always rotate bat, wrote 1-6 on bat to make sure I rotated bat.

2 types of marks on bat
1. Ball skin ripped off ball on bat &
2. Where a dumbass bounced the bat against the concrete
or something in dougout putting up the bat while
I am going to touch 1st base or running bases.

Have a good winter.
Oct. 25, 2012
Webbie25
Men's 60
1995 posts
I got proof positive this year that the Mikens just don't last like they used to. In March, in Phoenix, in 65 degree weather I broke both my bats, a melee and a miken. Crusader had an old 1.20 29 oz U2 balanced that he had bought from a guy that retired. No telling how many cuts on it, but it was pretty weathered. That bat not only lasted until Sunday of worlds in Vegas, it was also the hottest bat I had. I did some bat experimenting so it wasn't the only bat I used this year, but it was my main one. I put literally hundreds of cuts on it and between tournaments and league games here in Albuquerque probably had 60 or 70 HR's with it. It hit wet balls hard in Dalton, got some cold weather work in Reno and held up (40-50 degrees and a few snow pellets on Friday),I will miss that bat.
Oct. 25, 2012
HJ
Men's 70
443 posts
Crusher, you are so right. There really are 2 worlds out there and the "230s" really don't have to be concerned. Do you find the bat throwers are the guys that always seem never to have a bat and always want to borrow one? Pet peeve!
Webbie, I have tried a number of times here to get guys to distinguish between 1.20 and 1.21 Mikens. To my knowledge no post of very premature breakage with the 1.20's. Impossible now to buy 1.20's new- the word go out fast.
Oct. 25, 2012
taits
Men's 65
4403 posts
HJ,
i'd bet all Miken did was change the 0 to a 1 on the BPF, so it 'complies' to the new standard.
1.20's are out there but you have to look for them. My last one had well under a 100 when it broke in Reno this year. Broke clean at the ring finger of the upper hand.
Oct. 25, 2012
HJ
Men's 70
443 posts
Taits, as I understand it, and I could be wrong, the bat under the 1.21 standard had to meet the new standard after a longer break in period. I believe the older 1.20's could not pass the new test because they became too hot to pass the test after the break in. Therefore Miken had to reformulate the bat for the new standard and therefore there are real differences. Alan,Ed and
Mike is this correct or am I wrong?
Oct. 25, 2012
taits
Men's 65
4403 posts
Not sure about that other you mention but there is a somewhere that 'reasonable assumption' when you purchase a new 'product' that can or should be be used for a reasonable amount of time. Now then what is reasonable would be the other side of the coin. I gave my thoughts on that and under 100 hits would not meet that standard especially is it was altered in any way.
I think they should last twice that or more.
Oct. 26, 2012
BruceinGa
Men's 60
2734 posts
I'm surprised that no one had mentioned not using ASA balls and/or using 52/300 balls.
The ASA balls are somewhat heavier than USSSA and ISA balls, thus causing more damage. (thanks to Kevin S for this tip several years ago).
Usually before games early in the morning (dew on ground) we use the pink bp balls, 50 cor, 125 comp. I would think these are still available through Gorilla Boy.
Oct. 26, 2012
crusher
Men's 70
403 posts
Bruce - did not know about the heavy ASA ball.
Sometimes when throwing befor a game a guy will pull
a ball out and it seems light or heavy compared to
what seems normal. Bet what you said is the reason.
Oct. 26, 2012
mad dog
Men's 65
3958 posts
bruce forgot all about that,but your right....we use the 52-275/300 ball now for most of our bp sessions,and we like it...we also use the ASA 52 ball for all leagues in our area.....
Oct. 26, 2012
boston
307 posts
Webbie; My condolences on the lose of ur favorite bat. :)
Oct. 26, 2012
BruceinGa
Men's 60
2734 posts
Crusher, Most ASA balls weight 7-7.1 ounces. The USSSA and ISA balls may weigh as little as 6.8 ounces.
Of course some that have been outside in the rain my weigh over 7.4 ounces.
Oct. 26, 2012
Webbie25
Men's 60
1995 posts
boston-it's on my wall of bat fame, right next to my steeles bat, and my brown Louisville 38 oz bat.

Is your noew team going to make it to Winter Worlds?
Oct. 26, 2012
boston
307 posts
Trying to get these guys to get their senior cards. We have about 9 guys w/o one. Coaching grown men can often be more trying than t-ballers. If not, I may come out of the closet and show my senior side with a team my age. lol Big John H. kept calling me Gary 19 during league a few weeks ago. Guess I'm going to have to get my identity back. Nothing personal Gary 19. I may even break out my senior bat.


"Stay thirsty my friends"
Oct. 26, 2012
crusher
Men's 70
403 posts
Hey Webbie - I had 2 38oz Steeles bats, thaught at the time they were the greatest bats ever. Paid like $13 each for them. Even though they seemed to be solid Alum they would send the ball out of the park now and then.
Put them in back of garage and probably sold them as scrap alum for more than paid for them 25 years before. Hell, I think they were solid alum. They were a solid bat before the GSM or whatever the latest solid core bat is to be.

Have a great day W.. C
Oct. 27, 2012
Webbie25
Men's 60
1995 posts
boston-having Big John calling you that should wake you up. It's not a compliment-I know him too well. LOL You are right about coaching old men.I did it for 2 tournaments when Reid was out and it is tough.

crusher-I used a 38 oz for a long time and then when I got the Steeles I got a 35 oz and was amazed how light it felt. It was a great bat. I pulled it out in a tournament last year and hit one to the warning track with it on a 300 foot fence-no pop-maybe I should send it back??? LOL
Oct. 27, 2012
?
88 posts
Tri18

As I was reading your comments on this thread something didn't seem to make sense to me. In your comments you stated that the use of Senior Bats in temperatures below 65 degrees will drastically shorten the life of the bat. Then you suggested that purchasing a USSSA bat with a 1 year warranty for the cooler weather to be used in place of the senior bat. The problem is that USSSA bat will not last much longer than the senior bats if used in temps below 60 degrees. Sure, you get a 1 year, 1 time replacement warranty, but both the purchased and replacement bats could be broken in just a matter of months if used in cold weather. A few years ago I did just what you suggested and during the cooler Las Vegas months I cracked 2 USSSA Miken Denny Crine Pyscho bats with warranty. The first bat I cracked was the one I purchased and the second bat was the warranty replacement. While I agree that USSSA bats will hold up better than senior bats during cooler weather there is no guarantee they will not break. The use of the U-trip bats is only a bandage and not a cure for use below 60 degree weather problem. I am still looking for a solution for the cool weather bat use problem.
Oct. 27, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
?,
You are somewhat correct. It's your choice what you use and how to best spend your money. Even aluminum is adversely affected by cooler temperatures. If you don't want to break something you can buy old aluminum bombast, Steeles bats, etc...and use those. For that matter you could swing a wooden bat. But...we all assume certain costs and we have performance choices to make. Best advice is save your game bats for just that...the game that counts. Otherwise, select something else.
Best of luck,
Alan
Team Ambush
Oct. 27, 2012
Webbie25
Men's 60
1995 posts
Tri18-did you ever think it would come to this when you were playing in the 70's and 80's and a bat lasted for years? Let's go back to the aluminum bats and the hot balls. Hot balls are cheaper.
Oct. 27, 2012
?
88 posts

Webbie25

"Hot balls are cheaper."

NO TRUER WORDS WERE EVER SPOKEN!

Oct. 27, 2012
?
88 posts

Webbie25

"Hot balls are cheaper."

NO TRUER WORDS WERE EVER SPOKEN!

Oct. 28, 2012
Clean Up
45 posts

YES!

Here we go again....

WHICH HAS THE GREATER PROFIT?

Buying Hot Balls that cost about $5.00-$10.00 per ball....

Or buying bats that cost about $150-$300 per bat....

Is it very hard to figure out which choice the Bat Companies and bat sales reps want you to purchase?

$$$$$$$

IT'S ALL ABOUT MONEY

$$$$$$$

:-(

:-(
Oct. 28, 2012
Tri18
671 posts
Webbie,
Very true! We bought a bat for $39 and it lasted all year. Then cu31 and c405 came out... And we started crushing those like pie plates. Thank you Louisville Slugger and Easton for sponsoring me all those years!! I think you could have built a car out of my dented bats! Lol
Let em fly boys!
Alan
Team 1 Sports
Oct. 28, 2012
?
88 posts

Webbie25

"Hot balls are cheaper."

NO TRUER WORDS WERE EVER SPOKEN!

Oct. 28, 2012
Shut Up & Pitch
55 posts

A little birdie told me....


"ALL repeat ALL composite bats

and ALL repeat ALL high end aluminum bats,

no matter the make or model,

senior version or not, are prone to break when

used at temperatures below 60 degrees!"
Oct. 28, 2012
Shut Up & Pitch
55 posts

A little birdie told me....


"ALL repeat ALL composite bats

and ALL repeat ALL high end aluminum bats,

no matter the make or model,

senior version or not, are prone to break when

used at temperatures below 60 degrees!"
Oct. 28, 2012
Fabe
Men's 50
225 posts
Glad I play in the Tropics! I break um but not as often has cold weather regions...Aloha, Fabe
Oct. 29, 2012
?
88 posts

Some guys have all the luck.

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