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Online now: 4 members: Ace99Sherwood, B-LO, TABLE SETTER 11, birdie; 223 anonymousDiscussion: SLIDING!!
| Posted | Discussion |
| Sept. 13, 2012 stick8 1992 posts | SLIDING!! HJ came up with a good idea for a subject to discuss--sliding. Situation: Suppose your batting and you get a base hit to left. The left fielder bobbles the ball and you round first and decide to go for second. The left fielder picks the ball up and throws it to second. You see it's going to be a close play. Do you normally slide? Or do you try to beast the throw standing up? Do you slide in league play or only in tournaments? Tell us what you do. |
| Sept. 13, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | Anytime I need to. Don't wind up in that position for a number of reasons as often as when I was younger, but I don't care if it is a league game or a 3-team tournament bracket how do you just basically give yourself up? |
| Sept. 13, 2012 JBTexas Men's 70 434 posts | I slide on all close plays, but I'm only one of 3 or 4 on our team that does all the time, most go in standing. I would bet the average is less then 20% that slide anytime in senior ball. |
| Sept. 13, 2012 HJ Men's 70 481 posts | G19, I don't understand. If you are playing the same game as you did when younger, then you should be in the position to slide roughly as often. This is important because my proposition is that there is much less sliding and therefore accommodating rules make sense. Why don't you slide as often as before? I would like to hear from others. JB, please explain what age group your 20% number is applicable to. Is anyone sliding at 80, 75, 70 etc.? |
| Sept. 13, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | Well, without the same speed I will not take as many chances as I might have. The other side of the coin is playing against guys without the same arms as they used to have there are times when they don't put you in the position of having to slide as often. And, with the run limit, taking a chance might not be as important since you are limited to 5 runs anyway so not as much reason to push things. Like I said, a number of reasons. |
| Sept. 13, 2012 swing for the fences Men's 50 1224 posts | you slide and try to beat the throw.. The way I feel about it at 51 is that I still slide when ever I need too.. At 55 and 60 I might change my mind and take it easy.. now I don't even think about it and do what I always have done! |
| Sept. 13, 2012 Shut Up & Pitch 67 posts | Most won't slide because they don't want to hurt their legs. The infields at most of the fields in Las Vegas use a type of sand that will instantly turn your legs into hamburger meat. I have seen guys scrape their knees by just getting down on one knee just to stop a ball. If you were to take a piece sticky paper and press the sticky side into the ground and pick it up. Congratulations, you will have just made yourself a piece of coarse sandpaper. It won't matter if your wearing long pants or not. Those type of scrapes take a very long time to heal. Been there, done that! I would rather take the chance of being called out than to slide with no guarantee that I would be safe. Most teams hate to lose players for games due to unnecessary injury's. Most managers would rather sacrifice the out over a lost player with bleeding knees. |
| Sept. 13, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | I have seen many infields over the years that do present this type of problem. Though long pants with reinforced knees and sliding shorts go a long way. |
| Sept. 13, 2012 notretiredyet555 Men's 55 30 posts | I prefer to slide anytime the play is going to be close. I always have a sliding pad on and wear long pants more often now too. I hurt myself more by trying to stop standing up and likely will get tagged out more often. |
| Sept. 13, 2012 boston Men's 60 355 posts | I slide as often as I need, which is often in senior tournaments. I like to force the issue and will attempt to turn as many singles into doubles. Since I usually bat 3-4-5 most teams have a tendency to play me deep. I then am able to use my speed to turn hits into extra bases. In our senior league we are not allowed to slide and I hate it. I have seen more collisions at second base with runners and IF's on throws fron the OF because of this rule. In may league and on the tourney teams I have played on guys flat out refused to slide and they were 50-55. Pissed me off, many of them would say "I'm not sliding, I don't need to get hurt". My response was always "Stay the F home then." Nothing pisses me off more than busting your butt and having to watch guys half-ass it on defense and running the bases. Alot of this is due to the fact that teams can only score 5 runs. Meaning, if we don't score 5 so what the other team can only score 5. When I play USSSA I slide all the time due to the strength of the young guys arms. I love forcing them to throw me out taking an extra base or tagging up. Plus runs are valuable because teams can score more than 5. |
| Sept. 14, 2012 HJ Men's 70 481 posts | Swing, you slide at 51- what % of guys in the 50 to 55 range slide. Shut up, you are so right about the fields. I wear girls' softball sliding pads and took a little ridicule for doing so. But it enables me to not have hamburger legs when I slide (rarely) and dive for balls in the OF (relatively frequently). I recommend it. Sliding shorts help too, but the legs were taking a beating. G19, you are proving my point. More input needed, please help. |
| Sept. 14, 2012 CSinc Men's 50 13 posts | Anytime the play will be close, I'm sliding. I have seen more guys hurt themselves trying to toe dance their way in than I have sliding. The most frustrating thing is watching someone literally slowing up going into the next base to avoid getting hurt.If you have no intention of sliding, don't take the chance of going. On our team less than half the guys will ever slide. At our age I don't begrudge the decision not to slide, but please don't try to take the extra base if you aren't willing to get down on a close play. When I am on the field a whole different part of my brain takes over, so I play like I did when I was young...unfortunetly I may pay for that decision for days (or weeks) after I'm done! |
| Sept. 14, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | "If you have no intention of sliding, don't take the chance of going." Best comment yet. There are guys who decided before they left their house that day they aren't sliding, so why voluntarily put yourself in the position of needing to? Just dumb, dumb people...:( |
| Sept. 14, 2012 dMON 28 posts | Tell me the reasoning behind not allowing sliding at home and in some cases at first base in Senior associations? I understand the fact that sliding slows the progress to these bases. However, should it still not be the perogative of the runner to slide, if he/she so desires? I was recently questioned about sliding into first base. A grounder to the first baseman resulted in a close play at first where I as about to tangle with a player about 50-75 pounds heavier than me. He was not slowing down and his momentum would have taken him right through me. I slid into the safety bag to avoid the collision. The game was held up to decide if my slide (to avoid injury)was legal. In some associations, I believe it is. Why? This does not make sense, even from a safety standpoint, much less a common sense standpoint. SSUSA===why is sliding illegal at all, even at home plate? The 2nd home plate is there to avoid collisions, so why the rule? |
| Sept. 14, 2012 JBTexas Men's 70 434 posts | HJ, I'm talking about the 55-65 age group. 50 do it more often and 70 much less, but their a few. |
| Sept. 14, 2012 kid 32 21 posts | Any sliding rule would be a SMART idea! Once we reach 50 we should just be playing for FUN on and off the field! No reason to get anyone hurt! |
| Sept. 14, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | kid, then I assume you would be fine with not keeping score. Why bother if winning apparently doesn't matter? If you don't want to slide, that is certainly up to you. But why tell the rest of us what to do? |
| Sept. 14, 2012 JBTexas Men's 70 434 posts | Kid32,I for one would have a better chance of getting hurt by not sliding then going in standing up. Glad their cut off your comments on SPA and Ridge, because you were way off base. |
| Sept. 14, 2012 HJ Men's 70 481 posts | Let's not get this thread hijacked. Its purpose is to learn about who still slides and what % it is for each ascending age group. Let's keep the purity of the game out of it and just try to gather some facts. Facts: 1. In 4 years of rec league I have only seen 1 serious injury from a slide and that was to a 2nd baseman taking a throw from the OF with back turned. Badly broken leg from contact by slider. 2. I have seen many injuries - mostly pulled muscles by guys running hard to the base (mostly 2nd) and then stopping short not to overrun it. Please just put facts as you know them on this thread w/o gratuitous editorializing about the purity of the game or lack thereof. |
| Sept. 14, 2012 surf88 Men's 65 1000 posts | I am 63 and I slide whenever the situation is warranted. Playing with the 20-30's,throws from OF are quick and hard. Going in standing up often results in getting hit by a throw. I also wear knee pads as my knees have been torn, scraped and cut hundreds (or thousands) of times. |
| Sept. 14, 2012 Omar Khayyam 1357 posts | Stick, in the last tournament I was in, it was all major teams, 65 or older. I played in and watched 12 games. There were 3 times that someone slid on a close play--all by the same player! In other words, out of 50+ players I watched, only 1 ever slid. I know that on my team there is only one player who slides (and it isn't me since I broke my leg sliding some years ago). I think sliding is primarily a younger players option. Guys in their late 60's, and especially in their 70's, for the most part, no longer slide. Too many braces and artificial knees and arthritis. We're happy just to be upright and playing. We don't feel like lesser men for not sliding. |
| Sept. 14, 2012 swing for the fences Men's 50 1224 posts | HJ, my Baron team has roughly 12 guys on it... out of those 12 I would say that there is only a handful that slide, I know I don't go into second on a double play ball like I did in my 20s and 30s.. I concede it unless I have a chance to beat the throw. I believe you have to pick your spots of where you want to give up your body... I think everyone at this age is different with how they have aged and it's individual choice of what they have left and if they are even capable of sliding! |
| Sept. 15, 2012 spoonplugger Men's 60 95 posts | 8 on our 15 man roster slide. The common thought for the other 7 is: If you have to slide - you you took 1 base too many . |
| Sept. 15, 2012 kid 32 21 posts | JB Texas: in some cases you are right about sliding might prevent an injury but in most cases I would disagree, also it puts the defensive player in jeopardy when someone slides in to them! In my day I have seen more injuries from guys sliding or being slid into! Once again at our ages preventing injuries should be the number 1 concern! FYI, I dont know Ridge very well or his past, just didnt like his comments or explanations! Lets just say he made a very unchristian like comment heard by others! |
| Sept. 15, 2012 bkb555 301 posts | no sliding at all for me...it hurts and usually leaves a sore/cut on knee...if I cant make it, I dont go...AND I can run |
| Sept. 15, 2012 JBTexas Men's 70 434 posts | Kid. I've slide around 100 plus times in the past couple years and have never made connect with a infieder, I've had them fall on me making the catch, but there is a different in sliding to reach a base verus trying to hurt so one, second one is not call for in senior ball. The day they outlaw sliding I will retire. |
| Sept. 15, 2012 kid 32 21 posts | 100 plus times? Either you are really fast or slow! Just kidding, lol! didnt mean guys slide and try to hurt someone, but accidents happen! In retrospect I guess a guy should be able to slide if he wants to! |
| Sept. 15, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | Just wondering. Who in the world counts how many times they slid? Seriously? If you know that detail, I hope you know how many games you won and lost. |
| Sept. 16, 2012 steve65 Men's 65 177 posts | I just returned from Dalton today and in seven games I probably slid 10 times--different slides for different bases and different situations---I am 66 years old an dfairly quick for my age--I will go in on my side or back or even head first and have never collided with the fielder and knock on wood haven't been called out when I slide--except once when I slid accidentally at home platein Columbus In this year--had a senior moment and forgot where I was --to my thinking running and sliding are a very important part of the game----I don't know about the rest of you but when I cross the chalk line I give it everything I have win or lose--- |
| Sept. 17, 2012 santo Men's 55 41 posts | I think players get hurt from sliding because they don't know how or very seldom slide. I never looked at sliding as any more dangerous than running full speed and then trying to pull up and stop standing up. It seems to me much safer to just slide- as long as you know how. I was a swimmer in a younger life and going into the wall, I needed to know where my feet were to make a flip-turn and plant my feet perfectly on the wall. I don't even think twice if the play calls for me to slide, I slide. |
| Sept. 17, 2012 steve65 Men's 65 177 posts | I agree Santo---I slide alot and have never been hurt doing it---I slide in order to avoid contact---a minor scrape is all I have ever incurred--- |
| Sept. 17, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | What exactly is the injury risk from sliding, assuming it is done even remotely correctly? Nine-year-olds slide, it is not really dangerous or difficult. As Steve said, other than occasional scrapes nothing else really should ever happen. |
| Sept. 17, 2012 HJ Men's 70 481 posts | Steve 65, congrats on still being able to do it injury free at 66. Based on what you saw at Dalton, it would be helpful to know how many as a % slide and how many as a % don't. Did you see a difference in the different ages as others have noted. How many of the 65's 70's 60's etc. slide? |
| Sept. 17, 2012 steve65 Men's 65 177 posts | Gary "even remotely correctly" can cause major injury---sliding to closely to the bag can cause a broken ankle or a knee strain etc-- sliding on the wrong side of the bag can cause contact with infielder--a bag raised a little can cause knee or ankle injuries---I would say if a player especially a senior if they do not know how to slide can cause major injuries----base running is an art and takes lots of watching and thinking about situations---its the coaches job to watch the ball its the runners job to know where the fielders are---nothing about good base running/sliding can be remotely correct--- |
| Sept. 17, 2012 steve65 Men's 65 177 posts | HJ--in response to yuor question I am the only one on my team that slides and I saw very few others do it---I would venture 10 percent or maybe less---there is a huge downside though--I have spent several hours since I got home removing the Georgia clay stains!!!! they are not easy to remove----- |
| Sept. 17, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | steve, I see your point. But over the years with five kids I have seen a lot of sliding by fairly young boys and girls all the way up to college-level with very, very few sliding-related injuries to runners or fielders. My experience just says it is pretty low risk. Certainly not no risk, but low. |
| Sept. 17, 2012 steve65 Men's 65 177 posts | Gary do you really see the point?? you keep comparing KIDS with the supple muscle and soft bones with OLD MEN with stiff muscles and bones that are getting brittle--there is no comparison as to how much a person of age can become injured with inproper technique---- |
| Sept. 17, 2012 santo Men's 55 41 posts | I guess sliding isn't something you can easily learn if you are "older" - LOL. It's not something that is easy to practice either. When I see someone try to slide that doesn't know how, they can get really injured. Broken ankle, sprained knee.... If they start the slide too late, it can be devestating. I guess if it is started too early, it's much safer, but if you don't make it to the base, it will look pretty bad when they walk over and tag you out. I think the key is feeling comfortable with where your feet will end up (or hand if it's head first). It's almost like reaching for something with your feet. Seems easy to me, but I have seen some pretty scarey and dangerous slides, so I can only speak for myself. |
| Sept. 18, 2012 Robo2 238 posts | I am 60 now and have never stopped sliding. Yes my knees get cut up but that is part of the game. If one is not willing to slide, that is OK, get a runner or don't go for the extra base. Each person has to do what if best for himself / team. |
| Sept. 18, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | Robo, I agree with all but the "get a runner" part. Just would be further abuse of the "courtesy" runner rule, though I have come to accept that abuse of the rule is standard in the senior game. |
| Sept. 18, 2012 TommyC 16 posts | Still sliding at the age of 55. I think you can hurt yourself more trying to stop and standup on a force play at second instead of sliding. Never new you could not slide into first, in my younger days whenever a throw drew the 1B of the bag I would slide to avoid the tag. Played down in Dalton last weekend and my guess would be that 10% - 15% of the players would slide. |
| Sept. 18, 2012 4Four4 Men's 60 87 posts | Hooked some turf shoe nubs with back foot sliding into 3B last night and was saved by my knee brace from a serious sprain - swollen and sore today - freak stuff does happen. Artifical turf is much different than gold ol' dirt. #4 DH AO/Trovato |
| Sept. 18, 2012 boston Men's 60 355 posts | I find it amazing the number of seniors I see that either do not know how to slide or forgot how to slide. I have to say alot of guys on here are using the excuses for not sliding "I don't want to get hurt" or "at my age". Sorry, guys this may piss you off but, I never use either of those for an excuse for not accomplishing something or not doing something. When I play with the young guys and I miss a fly ball due to the lights or pop up when at bat. I do not say "hey I'm old what do you expect." I don't accept the kids saying "it's okay old guy." When I hit a HR or make a diving catch. I don't expect anyone to say "nice hit for an old guy" or "nice catch for an old guy." Like I tell the kids if they do the same thing, age has nothing to do with it. As for worrying about getting hurt. It happens and the more you worry and play it safey play. It is guys like this that have caused me to stop playing alot of senior tourneys. I play with a reckless abandon on the field as I did when I was young. This does cause alot of pain and many injuries. My wife seems to think I thrive on pain. If I did it any other way I just wouldn't be comfortable or feel like myself. My take is if you have an excuse for everything just stay home. If your worried about injuries and you won't go balls out stay home. As I tell my children, my players when I coach and my students. If your going to do something half-assed don't bother doing it. |
| Sept. 18, 2012 stick8 1992 posts | TommyC that percentage sounds reasonable. I tend to agree with those who believe that if your unsure about making it to 2nd or 3rd without sliding it's best to stay put. I've always slid into bases on close plays and will continue to do so. Unfortunately even with sliding pads and knee pads I still get strawberries or scabs--I call them "red badges of honor". I've even pulled old pebbles from my knee during the winter time!! What gets me are those who slide wearing shorts!! That's nuts |
| Sept. 18, 2012 stick8 1992 posts | Santo you raise a couple of points that caught my eye. You might be right about it being difficult learning how to slide at an older age. It's pretty safe to say that the vast majority of senior players have played ball most of their adult lives and as kids. Wouldn't it seem unusual for a player that's played ball all their life to not at least partly how to slide? You also mentioned practicing sliding. Now that is something I, as likely most players, did regularly in school. The big long tarp was rolled out and we all lined up practiced hook sliding to the left and right, pop-up sliding, head first, etc etc. Needless to say hydrogen peroxide was (and still is) a premium item!! I wonder if there any slo-pitch teams or players that actually go out and practice sliding? That would be a rare thing!! |
| Sept. 18, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | Sorry swing, but boston is now my hero.....:) "If your going to do something half-assed don't bother doing it." How can anyone disagree with that? |
| Sept. 18, 2012 stick8 1992 posts | Boston, you knocked that one out of the park!! |
| Sept. 18, 2012 santo Men's 55 41 posts | Stick, It would seem unusual for a player playing all their life and not sliding, but I still play in an open league a couple of nights per week and notice that even many of the kids (20-30yr olds) won't slide on "league night" and say they save sliding for tournements only. Still, Ive never been hurt sliding other than a few rasberries and find it more danderous to go into a base on a close play and try to stop dead on the base. I still can't blame guys who don't slide because I really never have seen anyone 'practicing' sliding... |
| Sept. 18, 2012 swing for the fences Men's 50 1224 posts | G19, I agree and don't know how to play any other way... I don't expect my first baseman to be hitting and dirt like I do or slidding! Not his job.. Being 6'5" and 260 plus his job is to hit bombs and walk.. He's had knee operations and I know for a fact he would want to slide but the years have taken there toll! So, Balls out is not for everyone at are advanced age.. You have to just give me a 100 percent of what you got and try to stay on the field with no injuries! All I ever ask! And that's the way I roll! |
| Sept. 19, 2012 Omar Khayyam 1357 posts | stick8 and santo, I don't think it is unusual for guys, especially older guys, to be regular tournament players and not know how to properly slide. First of all, Little League didn't begin until after a lot of tournament players were already born. And its early years were in Pennsylvania and surrounding states. It wasn't until the mid-50s that it began to appear in most states. And who ever heard of Babe Ruth ball, Pony ball, American Legion, etc. until they arose later to accommodate the boys that were too old for Little League. The result is that for my generation, there was no option to play private organized baseball as a boy with instruction from knowledgeable coaches. The school option was to play on a high school team (middle schools seldom had the fields to handle baseball). At my high school, there were 25 boys on the team out of 1000 boys in the school. The odds were so unlikely that I would make the team, I didn't even try. Again, about 99% of boys in large schools had no opportunity to play organized ball and be instructed on sliding. Even private coaches were not always helpful. When my son played Little League in the 60s, he played for three years and for two years had only one man as coach (no assistants since dads were at the job in my working class neighborhood), and that coach didn't know how to properly teach them to slide. So my son never learned how to do it correctly. We learned by playing after-school "sandlot" ball, and I wish it were sandlot! We played on hard-packed adobe soil that was as forgiving as cement, and did not have a soft sliding surface. Again, almost none of the boys even tried to slide, and they did not learn properly even then. We also learned softball by playing on church teams or company teams, often coached not by an experienced baseball or softball man, but by the good guy who was willing to handle roster duties. Again, no one ever talked to me about sliding. Yeah, I saw some guys that safely slid at times, but HOW were they doing it? Wasn't that motivated to learn, and in fact some of the more serious injuries over the years on my team were from sliding (including my own broken leg). Busted ankles, twisted ankles that didn't heal for months, coming up over the bag and hitting the fielder, broken fingers and noses and teeth from the few head-first sliders—those experiences discouraged learning to slide. The result is that I, and many, many of my peers in senior softball, those over 65, never learned a lot of fundamentals, including how to slide. We love the sport. We play as much as we can. But we don't slide, and with our brittle bones, no one is planning on learning and practicing! |
| Sept. 19, 2012 TCR84 3 posts | I'm 56 and still play in open rec league ball. And I still slide. Nothing like firing up the team when I hit the line and slide into second for a double. Still love to hook slide and fade away. I stay away from head first though, that's when I usually got hurt! |
| Sept. 19, 2012 HJ Men's 70 481 posts | Thank you for all your comments. I am still trying to get a fix on what % of each age group actually slide. Some have answered and some have given a personal narrative which is great. Omar gave a reasonable explanation why older guys never learned how to slide. I have these questions: TCR84- what is your injury history from sliding and as a 56 y/o what % of guys in their 50s slide? Omar said 1 guy out of 50 in majors 65 and above. Do others agree or disagree for this age group? Swing, you are 51, how many 50s slide in your experience? Santo- how many in 50s slide? Boston, your competitiveness is exemplary- how old are you- what % of the same age group slide- any of your numerous injuries from sliding? 4Four4- at 60 what % of contemporaries slide? Robo2- at 60 how many of your contemporaries slide? Note: If you don't slide you can still join this thread- your input on the % that slide in your group would be helpful |
| Sept. 19, 2012 boston Men's 60 355 posts | HJ: Couldn't tell you the % of guys that slide in my age group. According to what I have seen in tourneys playing vs 50 AA-AAA-Major and Major +. I would venture to guess as little as 20% of the players slide. That would come out to about 2 of the 10 on the field. If you break that down to a team of 15 it becomes lower 15%. The only injury I have ever acquired while sliding in all my years of softball and baseball from age 8 to now 58. I have had 1 concussion from getting hit in the head with a throw to 3rd base at age 50. But, I was safe so it was worth it. Most of my injuries come from diving on defense or running into fences. Damn things keep getting in the way of me catching a ball. lol I have also been the victim of wear and tear from years of beating up my body. |
| Sept. 19, 2012 HJ Men's 70 481 posts | Thanks Boston, I look forward to hearing from others. |
| Sept. 20, 2012 Goater 65 posts | I'm 66 .. I slid once last year and once this year. The slide last year led to some serious regret ... the slide this year made me wonder why i don't push the envelope more often ... guess there is no pat answer |
| Sept. 24, 2012 Wayne 37 Men's 65 773 posts | Learn how to slide properly, and you won't have much problem. I slide on the meat of my buttocks, and do a pop-up slide. I don't get my knees all skint up, or strawberries on my hips. BTW-I DO NOT AT ANY TIME EVER SLIDE WEARING SHORTS. Why I wear baseball pants to tournaments, and the games mean something. |
| Sept. 24, 2012 Wayne 37 Men's 65 773 posts | @gary19-STFU (SHUT THE FUNK UP). Please refrain from things you know nothing about. (for once please) |
| Sept. 24, 2012 swing for the fences Men's 50 1224 posts | HJ, If I were to take a guess. I would say probably 3 out of 10 maybe 4 out of ten over 50 that slide... The bottom line is after 50 the wear and tear on your body is different for everyone... So, it's up to the individual to know his limits and try to play hard and not push it to an injury.. I don't even think about not sliding when on the bases.. it's second nature.. I'm sure my body will tell me something different at some age.. Hell, I never ever thought I would be playing like this or playing at all in my 50s.. Everyone of us still playing over 50 at any level has been blessed! IMO |
| Sept. 25, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | Wayne (whoever you anonymously are) how very mouthy and witless, errrrrrrr I mean manly and witty, of you. |
| Sept. 25, 2012 HJ Men's 70 481 posts | Please don't hijack this discussion. I would still like more input. Any sliders 70 and older. If so, tell your story and how many of your peers also slide. Thank you. Not all comments need a return comment. |
| Sept. 25, 2012 Wayne 37 Men's 65 773 posts | Gary19, I have put my name, cell number, and email address on here a several times. I'm not as anonymus as you think. |
| Sept. 25, 2012 swing for the fences Men's 50 1224 posts | Hey HJ why such a curiosity with who slides? Are you going to suggest a new rule? |
| Sept. 25, 2012 HJ Men's 70 481 posts | Swing, I don't know, but I am only a rec player. In my league I will probably suggest a rule which will probably be rejected. I do think that 1 set of rules for player from 40 to 70 makes sense. In a number of threads I see comments suggesting that different rules may be applicable. A 40 y/o using a senior bat is a different story from a 70 y/o using one. But I still would like more imput on sliding. Your question was quite appropriate. For me learning how the real deal play the game is extremely helpful. |
| Sept. 25, 2012 swing for the fences Men's 50 1224 posts | h a I would be curious to see what you're sliding rulema is as for senior Bats and 40 year olds the bottom line is with the current ball combination and the senior bat it's equal to what we were doing in the 80's and 90's with steel bats in hard balls so if it is up to me it's a no brainer the ball is softer so the speed maybe around the same but the ball is a softer ball then the ball were in the 80s and 90 |
| Sept. 25, 2012 swing for the fences Men's 50 1224 posts | h a I would be curious to see what you're sliding rulema is as for senior Bats and 40 year olds the bottom line is with the current ball combination and the senior bat it's equal to what we were doing in the 80's and 90's with steel bats in hard balls so if it is up to me it's a no brainer the ball is softer so the speed maybe around the same but the ball is a softer ball then the ball were in the 80s and 90 |
| Sept. 25, 2012 HJ Men's 70 481 posts | Swing, the league is a plus 60 league. There are no special sliding rules now. I haven't crystallized my thinking and may recommend nothing. I just see a lot of injuries by guys running hard to second, not sliding, and pulling up fast not to overrun the bag. Many pulled muscles particularly in our cold spring weather. I don't have the knowledge to compare the 80's and 90's to today. My feeling is the USSSA bats with their balls are not significantly different from the senior bats with the senior balls. |
| Sept. 25, 2012 swing for the fences Men's 50 1224 posts | HJ, I know here in Cal the guys playing in and with USSSA bats a good majority are having them shaved, so the deal is they are swinging as hot bats or hotter in the USSSA world.. Every league and Tourney that has composites that are not senior bats will have shaved bats through most dugouts.. One reason I stopped playing in 40s and open.. Hate losing to altered bats! In SS everyone gets to enjoy hitting a hot bat and is for the most part on a level playing field.. There are a few that shave their senior bats but it is lot less than 40s playing USSSA and younger divisions. FYI I hit my Black Senergy USSSA Bat about as far as my SS bat... |
| Sept. 25, 2012 Omar Khayyam 1357 posts | Swing and HJ, conditions are hotter today than in 80s, and probably 90s, despite a hotter ball then. Proof 1: fields built in the 80s to accommodate those bats and balls are much smaller than those built in last 10 years. Older fields for the most part cannot contain the current power, and that is the power of senior players not younger rec league players! Younger players are not allowed to use composites, or even double walls on some fields! Proof 2: Many players (such as myself) played regularly in the 80s and 90s with the best bats available then. We are now hitting the ball just as far, and even farther, and we are older! Proof 3: Even those who don't see much difference in their own power hitting (due to age deterioration) can easily see that younger senior players (as they were 20-30 years ago) are hitting the ball much harder with composites. Proof 4: As a result of increased power, many safety rules have been instituted and limits on runs and home runs per inning are the norm. Many older fields must ban the composites, even for seniors, because the long balls are a danger to other park users (and cars). |
| Sept. 25, 2012 swing for the fences Men's 50 1224 posts | Omar, you weren't at Twin Creeks in the 90s when we had single wall bats and blue stitched Skyhawks that would go 360 feet plus depending on who was hitting them.. Big boys would knock them well over 400 feet! |
| Sept. 25, 2012 swing for the fences Men's 50 1224 posts | Biggest difference I see is with the size of the sweet spot.. metal isn't as forgiving as Composites.. but when both nutted with todays bat and ball combo and metal single wall and the 52 525 of the early 90s you didn't have much difference.. some even think the ball went farther! |
| Sept. 26, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | swing, the difference now is guys in their 50s and 60s are doing that. And many weren't in their 20s and 30s. Despite Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens, generally the human body is not supposed to perform that way. But you are very correct, today's sweet spots are absurd. Guys who mis-hit a big ball moving slowly should not be rewarded, and pitchers who cause the mis-hit should not be punished. |
| Sept. 26, 2012 boston Men's 60 355 posts | HJ: In my senior league we have 17 teams of various ages and we are allowed to run past the bases. most of the younger guys and competitive guys don't like this rule. it was made to help cut down on injuries but I think it causes more than less. Lots of collisions between fielders and runners. I have suggested a slide if you like or run past it should be the players option. |
| Sept. 26, 2012 HJ Men's 70 481 posts | Boston, thanks for the suggestion. What happens with the contact aspect? Must the runner who chooses to run past the bag also avoid contact? We have seen some infielders who can't or won't get out of the way when they have no play. To me letting the runner run past may stop collisions. ???? |
| Sept. 26, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | "To me letting the runner run past may stop collisions." HJ, so would teaching the infielder to get out of the way like he should in that situation. Or let him get run over and learn the hard way. Really is his choice to make. He would have no one to blame but himself. Just like the runner who stays standing in the baseline after being forced at second. His choice to get out of the way, or get hit with the ball being thrown to first. They can choose to move, or apparently choose to get hit. |
| Sept. 26, 2012 boston Men's 60 355 posts | We try to use safety bags when possible at all 3 bases. We have also allowed runners to run close to the base as if a safety bag were there. The trouble is usually with the defensive players. They do not allow the runners room to run past of take trhows from a bad position near the bag. Instead, of being on the OF side of the bag in which the throw is coming, they r right on the bag or on the IF side of it. lots of runners have been peg by throws in those situations. Runners that try to avoid collisions usually pull, strain or sprain something. Some of us just run into the defender. We figure you have been playing this game long enough. Get in the correct position or get run over. I find it amazing how lazy some IF's can be and how poorly IF's position themselves for throws from the OF. |
| Sept. 26, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | How about we just play the game the way it was intended? I know age becomes a factor, and there is NO reason for the same rule for 50s as 70s, but as boston stated so well most of this is not age or mobility-related but rather IFs who just don't know or care to do the right thing and play the game the right way. Those are not physical limitations, but rather mental or attitudinal ones, and can be cured by teaching him the lesson he apparently did not get in his first 40+ years of playing. Or, as boston put it, "Some of us just run into the defender". |
| Sept. 26, 2012 Robo2 238 posts | HJ - on our tourney team, I would estimate 8 of 10 slide without giving it a thought; one does it rarely and one no due to just getting over knee operation. I do not feel 60 is old. It is just a number and for the most part, we are big kids having fun. I would ask, of thoses that slide - how many work out at a gym? |
| Sept. 26, 2012 boston Men's 60 355 posts | One other side note on the running pastt he base in our league. We have had several players and teams go to tourneys and run past 2nd or 3rd base. It's usually laughed at and chaulked up as a senior moment. |
| Sept. 26, 2012 HJ Men's 70 481 posts | It is nice to continue to see a recognition that a 50 y/o and 70 y/o are different. At 68 I play physically and there have been hard feelings because I play to the extent of the rules. Restated, I will not avoid a collision if someone is where they shouldn't be and blocking me. That is not the issue. I don't mind collisions, the issue is whether the rules should be changed to prevent collisions equitably. I still am not sure. I agree with Boston that IF's are often in the wrong place. I know some of it is intentional but some is clearly not- senior moment, lack of ability, poor judgment. I am just about convinced that sliding should always remain an option. I think when the IF's know someone will slide they behave more responsibly around the bag and there is less blocking. |
| Sept. 26, 2012 Wayne 37 Men's 65 773 posts | People need to learn how to play from the neck up. Use your head, you know that lump three feet above your ass. |
| Sept. 27, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | I have long said it makes NO sense to have the same rules for 50s as 70s. Forty-nine year olds can be playing with 25-year-olds under their rules just fine, then when they turn 50 they have to magically play the same as 75-year-olds? Again, NO sense! |
| Sept. 28, 2012 Ernies 53 Men's 50 22 posts | Nor-Cal 50 AAA, 8 out of 12 slide on this team, sliding shorts and double knees keep the rashes to a very bare minimum. |
| Sept. 29, 2012 swing for the fences Men's 50 1224 posts | I say it's up to everyone to know there limits..If they are capable of sliding, then Slide! If not, make sure when taking an extra base you can walk there.. |
| Oct. 1, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | swing, that is the problem. Too many just walk themselves into an out when they know they won't slide yet put themselves in a close situation anyway......:( |
| Oct. 1, 2012 Webbie25 Men's 70 2414 posts | Amazing thread-I have not read this board for a while because of Gary19's cowardly, unapologetic, and dirty attack on my married life. I slid probably 5 times this weekend taking extra bases trying to make something happen for us and not even a strawberry from Cheyenne fields. The popup slide is easy and effective. Yes, I do slide in shorts-stick8 and I do get strawberries occasionally, but I cannot wear pants with my knee brace-it slides down on my knee too much when over the outside and pants pull when the brace is underneath. Yes, I am 60 years old. You just stay in practice to do it well. I do actually go out and just do it occasionally on a field to remain in practice. If they make a rule saying I cannot slide, I will feel that it penalizes me because I cannot stop too well with my bad knees, and I hate the run through rule. I played it in El Paso, Boston, in league a couple times and thoroughly hated it. Might as well be able to yell at the umpire 'I'm stopped-he can't tag me' as you run by! |
| Oct. 1, 2012 boston Men's 60 355 posts | Webbie: I hear you on the league. We have a new director and one of my first request was to make sliding legal. It was great to see you in Alb. Hope, you found your swing although I think it's still sweet. It could also be trying to hit a ball past a speedy outfielder that gets to almost everything can get a hitter thinking. LOL Hope to see you again for another cold one. BTW I did change to a more competitive team after our talk. |
| Oct. 1, 2012 Webbie25 Men's 70 2414 posts | Boston-you have never really seen me in full tournament mode-each tournament we played has been for fun and I dial down to not get hurt for the big ones. At 60 I have learned you have to do that-and truthfully I hate it. You have a big problem-You are now Gary19's best friend!! You need to shake that or you can drink alone!!! (LOL)(Could not resist) Who are you playing with?? |
| Oct. 1, 2012 boston Men's 60 355 posts | We started a new 50AAA team called Pistoleros 50's. Sad part is I am now the oldest player on the team at 58. Three of the players ar turning 50 next year and we have 8 other guys 51-53. It's wierd how Gary 19 and I do agree on many issues, buy don't get jealous bro, your still my Hero. lol |
| Oct. 2, 2012 Gary19 Men's 50 2609 posts | boston, nothing weird about it at all. We should be both happy and proud to be correct so often.....:) |
| Oct. 6, 2012 TCR84 3 posts | HJ - don't know % of 50+ who slide. I play on rec ball team where next oldest guy isn't within 10 years of me. However, none of these guys slide like I do. In my younger years, I pushed the envelope hard, and usually had raw knees from sliding so much. I figured if I didn't slide once or twice a game I wasn't trying hard enough. Less than half the younger guys slide, and when they do I'm surprised they don't get hurt more. Lot of headfirst stuff too, which is just way too easy to get hurt on... |
