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Online now: 6 members: Bones505, IcanRun, Ohioballer, Runner Blue, Wldbill51, dkrollw364; 21 anonymousDiscussion: Bats?? Have We Sold Out or Been Taken? Or Both
| Posted | Discussion |
| April 2 4x4 Men's 65 601 posts | ALL the bat discussion seems to be about the composite bats, which is best, durability, sanctioning, etc. Before this all started there were some hot bats out there that were not composite made of alloys, aluminum. When several bats were banned there were a lot of aluminum/alloy bats on the list and pretty soon it was rare to see a non composite bat in use. We\'ve sold out for the composite technology and spent large amounts of money for bats that we buy needing a \"break in\" period before they are ready (this of course shortens the life of the bats useful contacts left) before we use the bats in earnest then break it and buy another to use. Most of us now have a \"man cave\" full of bats somewhere stashed away in different stages of breaking in while using our \"gamers\". Then (God help us) we read somewhere or talk to somebody and hear about a hotter/better/stronger bat and of course everyone has to have/try/buy one. Have we all gone a little insane here? Isn\'t there a bat out there of a durable material that has just about as much pop as the composites? There was a time when we all had one or two bats and we still managed to jack the ball and use the bat for a long time and be happy. Do we have any viable alternatives to this? Is there any hope (or does anyone know of) there is another \"hot\" bat out there that is not a composite? Or are we just caught up in one big feeding/spending/feeding/spending frenzy? Just food for thought. |
| April 2 4x4 Men's 65 601 posts | Sorry gang don't know why all those extra little lines showed up around the punctuation symbols. They weren't there to start with. |
| April 3 Hit the gap Men's 70 154 posts | Back in the day when all we had were the metal bats, we also had nice hard balls. 50COR. Now with the sorry balls they make us use today, everyone is trying to find the ultimate bat that will make it travel a little farther. I'm all for going back to good hard balls and metal bats but that will never happen. |
| April 3 E. Ness 122 posts | That is an easy question. The ball!!! When I started we used fastpitch balls in the early 70's, then Worth came out with the Poly Core (great ball) to off set crappy bats. The Howards bats were great for their time but still not what they could have been as later demostrated by Ray's bat. In the 80's ASA decided to go to a 44/ who knows what the core was restricted flight softball. A pos if you will. It was this ball that in my opinion started the change in bats. In the 90's we see the 47/525 ball as the ball of choice but the bat revolution had already taken flight. This was also the decade of the Ti and double wall. So to combat the new composite bats the associations have gone back to crappy softballs but actually they never really stop using them. The ASA has always used the 44/375? softball in it world tournaments in the upper division. In 1995 in Waterloo Iowa at the Super Major Worlds they used a 44 core Worth that I believe was a cork centered softball on baseball fields. The scores were low and very few homeruns were hit. In fact WR won the homerun championship with 6. From that point on it was crappy balls. That year in the ASA tournaments that is all we used crappy softballs. So in my opinion it was the use of crappy softballs by the ASA that started the bat revolution. The balls will not change and so in order to play a game where the scores are suppose to be high and the balls hit hard one has to have the very best bat available. Some guys say I would go back to metal bats if we had good softballs. I ask this question can you really trust ASA and other associations to keep their word and use good softballs if this were to happen? I for one cannot.They have burnt me too many times. As have some of the senior associations. |
| April 3 STONEMAN Men's 50 535 posts | PETE D: I hope this might help. 1) Do not use heavy / wet balls. 2) Do not hit 47 or 50 cor balls w/ a 525 comp, when it is below 75 degrees. 3) Never hit over 15 to 20 balls in BP w/ ones bat in one day. Kevin, w/ ANACONDA SPORTS, sells B.P. balls. These balls r a redish / orange & will save ones bats. One of my 57 yr ol' Major Plus friends hits these balls in BP. this ballplayer hits BP & off a tee ( using these balls). I have seen these redish / orange ball travel over 300 ft. Most sport' good stores, also, sell a Neoprene sleeve that sides over ones bat. This will also, allow one to swing their bat more times in BP. Hope this might help......The STONEMAN......... |
| April 3 Hit the gap Men's 70 154 posts | Ness is right on. Even in the Senior Spring Worlds this year (Palm Springs) the SSUSA balls were crap. I think it was a poly covered ball. I could not scratch the cover with my fingernail which leads me to believe this. With the hot weather, it was like hitting a nerf ball. Only saw 2 hit out the whole time I was there. |
| April 3 E. Ness 122 posts | Yes those balls were out of site but they were not the ones that forced the bats to change. If you remember we we hitting bats with 80+ thick walls. At the time the Steeles bats the Easton CU 31, the TPS grey and black bat and the worth power cell were the top bats of the time. They were heavy and had very little flex. After Dave got caught using a worth ball that was being redone in China for Steele ball his softballs went to crap as did everyone elses (except for the balls used by the Steeles team in their barnstorming tour). I remember playing them in Hutch on Friday night before the tournament. Those balls flew and then the next day we hit socks in the USSSA tournament. The balls supplied by the tournament were a far cry from those used by Steeles the night before. We also had the T 4000 Gary but those lasted as long as the Ti bats did. In the end we got stuck with crappy balls when you played in a NIT or World. What you did in league and local tournaments was another story. I knew guys who bought dozens of T 4000's softballs and then changed the covers so they could use them in NIT's and such. They would just change them out when the umpire was not looking. In the end it was the ball and we all know it was. But getting people to admit it is another story. Everyong wants to blame the bat companies. What I don't understand is why people are so against the new hot bats? The majority of softball players have done nothing but ask for this since I started playing softball back in the early 1970's. We finally got what we asked for. I remember in 1995 when I was playing for a TPS team that year hearing Harold from TPS stated they were going to make the TPS Ti bat too hot so it would be banned for a second time (the Ti was legal for 6 weeks in 1995 because of Ray's law suit). I asked why and he said "if the Ti bat was legal then no one would need new bats after they bought it. The perfect bat is a hot bat that could hit the crappy softball's well and it would only last one season." Harold was just telling us what the future held. |
| April 3 4x4 Men's 65 601 posts | So - we're all being herded like cattle and actually paying the money to go through the turnstiles in cowed submissive anticipation it will get better while placing our trust in the manufacturers and associations? Einstein was right we need some representation somewhere. The only voting we're getting to do is with our money and that just empowers the manufacturers and associations to keep on going to make it crappier for us. Doesn't make sense. |
| April 3 E. Ness 122 posts | Gary USSSA has been changing the rules and almost everything else since it came to be. I would not say it is only the hot bats. In the past 33 years that I have played ball here are some of the rules changes I can remember. 46 foot mound to 50 (because of the Poly core softball) Late 70's 50 foot mound to box in senior and USSSA and 53 foot in NSA because of bats. (2004 +?) 60 foot bases to 65 Late 70's early 80's (ball) 65 to 70 middle 90's (USSSA) balls and bats 65 to 70 (NSA) 04? balls and bats 70 to 75 (USSSA SUPER) talent, bats, speed up the game Time Limits late 70's early 80's BALL and talent Middle hitting in my opinion has to do with the home run rules in the younger divisions, the new WWE attitude that has spread thoughout the younger divisions, SANDBAGGING in all divisions, and it being allowed by all associations and even forced by some just for the almight buck, bats, balls, talent, and the lack of respect. Halo and screens I have not played anything with those rules and I don't understand why they are needed now with the dead softballs but that is my opinion. |
| April 3 STONEMAN Men's 50 535 posts | E NESS: In 2002 or 2003, the BALL MFG's, told the softball orginiz's, that the 47 & 50 cor balls / w a 375 comp, were the only 2 balls that could be made & be a constance 47 or 50 cor. At this same time, the Ball Mfg's, also, told the diff, softball orginiz' the follow': 1) that the 40 & 44 cor balls traveled 3.57 MPH faster, than the 47 & 50 cor balls. 2) that the 40 & 44 cor balls would travel 11 ft. farther. 3) that a 40 or 44 cor ball could not be made & be a 40 or 44 cor ball on all 6 sides. 4) that dur' the first 60 to 70 ft, no matter what ball was made, the ball would travel that distance, in less thab .4 of a second. 5) that 40 & 44 cor balls were to hard & made SOFTBALL, less safe. Several Ball Makers, also, told SGMA & the softball world, that by go' to a 40 or 44 cor ball, that this would not solve any SAFETY problems. Good Luck.......The STONEMAN... |
| April 3 taits Men's 65 4548 posts | Legend made the Centerfire 2 (47\525 & 47\375) until '05 then weht out of business. In, 95-96 I had an Easton,Worth 51, & TPs TI, all 3 dented fast. I feel the composites last longer and have more pop even with the 40\44 cor and 375 comp balls. |
