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Discussion: BRICKYARD

Posted Discussion
May 2, 2022
Rob64
Men's 50
74 posts
BRICKYARD
How was the BRICKYARD tournament this year? I heard the fields were awesome again! Props to SSUSA for the venue pick and the grounds crew for such wonderful fields every year! Can't wait till next year!
May 2, 2022
DaveDowell
Men's 70
3777 posts
The Brickyard Invitational rained out late Saturday afternoon ... Heavy rains overnight also made the fields unplayable on Sunday ... The event was canceled on Sunday morning ... (Your sarcasm is noted)
May 2, 2022
Rob64
Men's 50
74 posts
Thank You for the reply Dave I was there, the fields were in a state of being unplayable in the outfield before the rain! I have a picture if you'd like to see the warning tracks! I was told 10 years ago SSUSA would not throw a tournament at a complex in such a condition! YES the rain was bad.
May 2, 2022
57BLACK
Men's 60
15 posts
NEEDS TO BE CALLED DANDELIONS SPORTS COMPLEX
May 2, 2022
msw4indy
21 posts
I live in Indy and Midwest is where we play our 50+ League. Unfortunately that park has went downhill for the last 5 plus years. Not even 100% sure who owns it now (Last I heard it is parceled up to 3 different owners in different stages of development which is why it is still open) but it's safe to say that nobody is putting any money into it other than the minimum it takes to keep it running as it is. Can't do anything about the weather but this tourney needs a new home. Problem is where? Not many parks in the area with open weekends anymore that have the size/space to host as many teams that came out, but I will play wherever it goes.

Mark W
Chi Town Assault #44
May 2, 2022
Rob64
Men's 50
74 posts
Hi Mark,

I was told $3 goes to the venue and $2 to SSUSA for the $5 per person to enter the complex. I was also told the only money they get is through concessions. Please correct me Dave if this information is incorrect that I recieved from 1 of the 3 owners. So I don't know how that is even a substantial business. There are plenty of nice ballparks but they don't let you play for free to send the money elsewhere. How much does the venue get please enlighten me I'm curious?

Rob

May 2, 2022
BH44
Men's 50
62 posts
Last time attending the Brickyard and rethinking the remainder of our schedule with SSUSA. Saturday all 6 fields full from 7:30 start to 10:30 last start - any issues no way to catch up so for the 7:30 games most started after 8 due to sign in and the long line coming in to pay $5 to enter after you made it thru the mine field - I am sure some will need new front ends by the time they left. Nothing you can do about weather but infields were hard as a rock and outfields not mowed with pot holes out there before then. Lost our Right fielder going for ball in the second inning of our first game. Pulled hamstring and dislocated knee hitting a hole in the grass. Concession stand had two people not sure what they were doing but stood in line forever for anything all day long never had even hot dogs ready.

So when they called it after the 6:00 which started after 7 you knew it was the end since most hadn't started brackets yet, how would they get all those games in on Sunday. The final slap was only playing 2 seeding games only refund is $100 credit if you make and go to the TOC - brutal.

Only bright spot was Nancy's hard work there - thanks Nancy always great to see you.
Joe - BH24
May 2, 2022
DaveDowell
Men's 70
3777 posts
Rob64 ... Since you asked ... Your statement that SSUSA receives $2 of the $5 entry fee to the park is overstated by exactly $2 per patron ... Knowing what I know about the three-headed Midwest ownership structure, it's very likely more accurate that one of those owners may well be attempting to conceal that $2 from either or both of the other owners! ...

BH44 ... Please re-read the email you received from SSUSA ... The offer of a $100 credit is for any T.O.C. qualifier event, not the T.O.C. itself (although if you go to the T.O.C., the $100 would be applied there if you wish) ... Please note that by rule, SSUSA is not required to refund any entry fees after two games have been played, but has offered to do so in this instance despite specific rule book language (at page 56) to the contrary ...

Thanks for your comments and for taking the time to read this post to set the record straight ...
__________

§ 10.1(2) • TOURNAMENT TERMINATED
If, in the opinion of the director(s), a senior softball tournament must be terminated prior to its conclusion because of adverse weather or other Acts of God, the tournament will not be postponed beyond its ending date. Should this unlikely event occur, refunds will be made at the discretion of the SSWC executive board. In no event will refunds be made after two games have been played. There is no guarantee of any refund. Participants must realize that nobody can control weather or other Acts of God.

May 2, 2022
BH44
Men's 50
62 posts
Dave - yes, thanks for the correction - many of the SSUSA tournaments in the Midwest is you register with your office and send the tournament director a message you have signed up but pay the tournament director at the site - how do you get $100 credit for those events like in our case which we already paid - Quad City, Iowa Open, ISA World Series. Milwaukee Classic?
May 2, 2022
DaveDowell
Men's 70
3777 posts
BH44 ... The future event credit is for SSUSA administered events that are T.O.C. qualifiers ... Examples would be the Northern's (Lansing), the Midwest Championships (St. Charles), etc. ... It wouldn't be fair for us to impose honoring that credit on independent tournament promoters who are offering the other events you mentioned ... If you want, please give me a call tomorrow at the Sacramento Home Office if you want to talk about this ... I'll be there most of the day until I go on Grandpa duty at 3:30 PM Pacific time ...

May 3, 2022
Rob64
Men's 50
74 posts
DaveDowell...So they get all the parking fees and concessions.....the three headed monster will be the end of the already terrible park or their three headed monster! So moving forward with the rest of the proceeds what does the park get and how much of the rest of the money goes to awards, umpire fees etc.....Just curious because I know of a lot of nice venues in Illinois,Michigan,Ohio and Indiana that would be excellent hosts what do they get for hosting an event? Because none of them charge for parking much less per person. Even in the Bad weather we had Saturday, Sunday would still be a go some of the venues that I know of so....whats the Ballparks cut? I'll find a good venue if it's financially feasible for the park. Please if you have the time all of the content asked not just partial Information on fees. Thanks Dave for taking the time to read the post and please set the record straight.......... Just looking for a money trail to get a better venue for the players in our area that time of year we are all ready to go from the long winter break and we play there because were not given another option in the area just needs to be changed. I can help change that if I can get a bottomline if it's feasible for the ballpark.
May 3, 2022
DaveDowell
Men's 70
3777 posts
Rob64 ... There are two "money trails" ...
• SSUSA receives tournament entry fees (ONLY) ... From those, we pay the facility rental in advance (thus far non-refundable as to Sunday), umpire fees for every potential game (in advance) to Midwest, Diamond-Dry costs, softball costs, scheduling fees, Director air fare, Director hotels, Director rental car, Director fees, awards, other tournament supplies, printing and reproduction costs, roster and tournament administration paperwork FedEx costs and Sacramento home office staff salaries for roster checking, booking host hotels, among other functions ...
• Midwest Complex receives the first three items on the SSUSA costs list above, gate fees and player admissions and concessions ... We have no idea, nor is it any of our business, how they spend the revenues we generate for them ... In their defense, they are not unique in charging admission ... The Big League Dreams franchise sites in the west and both Cactus Yards (Gilbert) and Victory Lane (Glendale) in the Phoenix area have similar entry fee structures ...

This may come as a surprise to you, and we're not complaining, but The Brickyard Invitational tournament loses money every year for SSUSA, and how much is not a public disclosure item ... It is one of the events that we run, despite not being profitable, because it's important to offer an event in your area, with early-season timing, rather than expecting you to travel unreasonable distances to play ... We are happy to do so ... If we dropped all tournaments that don't make a profit, lots of events would "go away" ... Other larger events around the country being profitable allows these type of events to be subsidized ...

Although the number is edging upward as costs continue to spiral upward in this inflationary economy, the general rule is that an event like this breaks even at somewhere around 60± teams ... We believe that 60± teams is certainly achievable at Midwest, but not until and unless your teams consent to play on Friday ... That current reluctance contributes to the tight scheduling criteria, one with very little option for recovery if Mother Nature shows up like she did last weekend ... She ALWAYS wins ...



May 3, 2022
Rob64
Men's 50
74 posts
Making this simple what's SSUSA's cut and what does the venue get from entry fees?
May 3, 2022
DaveDowell
Men's 70
3777 posts
Rob64, let's make it even more simple: You're asking for proprietary information that is none of your business ... Despite that, here's what's currently available from the "public record" of this website, from the tournament page and this comment thread ... You'll have to guess at the rest of it to satisfy your curiosity ...

• SSUSA's "cut" is 36 entry fees @ $450 each [$16,200] Less: 36 entry fee credits @ $100 each ($3,600) = $12,600 ... SSUSA's expenditures are significantly in excess of that amount ...
•The Midwest Sports Complex "cut" is something you will have to ask them to disclose ... We know some of the components we paid from the entry fees, but not all of the composition of their "cut" ...

Most of you guys have mastered the multiplication part of this economics course (entry fees x number of teams), but not many of you demonstrate any skill at the subtraction component (deducting for expenses) ...

May 3, 2022
Rob64
Men's 50
74 posts
So back to Brickyard why not another complex? I've heard for the last 5 years from teams we're not coming back, my team played 2 out of the last 5 just to give it another shot we're done! We all know the weather is always bad at the time, but the complex...... never going to reach the 60 Teams needed that way don't do us (SSUSA) any favors by losing money we can find other tournaments! I wish more people like BH44 and myself would comment like I hear at the event. I want SSUSA to survive and thrive but I've added NSA and SPA to fill in spots that SSUSA cannot for us., as far as paying to get in I'm sure those other complexes have a value as far as Friday games we're in so I can't speak for other teams but I know some that would be glad to play on Friday if they could get in!

Not trying to turn this into a back and forth conversation but I know this area and there's plenty of venues and plenty of teams that would play on Friday especially even if it were a late Friday start to get ahead. Mother Nature is not the issue on my end we have snowball tournaments here!

Thanks for your time Dave and the information, I know not feel, I know it falls on deaf ears!
May 3, 2022
Rob64
Men's 50
74 posts
That's where you're showing the deaf ears! I have a Masters degree in Economics being an Accountant for 30 plus years so.....not making this personal!

Have a good day!
May 3, 2022
DaveDowell
Men's 70
3777 posts
Interesting ... My undergraduate degree is a Bachelor of Science in Commerce (Accountancy) and I retired as a C.P.A. after 30± year in practice ... You should know more than you're showing on preserving and protecting proprietary and confidential information ... Good day to you, too ...
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